B-Rock001 t1_j1ntfuh wrote on December 25, 2022 at 11:07 PM

Reply to comment by leeharrison1984 in Tech Journalism Doesn’t Know What to Do With Mastodon by psychothumbs

And people gravitate to their own tribe.... it's human nature. It's naive to think that people are going to a better job "without algorithms" to not create echo chambers.

But I also think you're using "algorithm" as a bit of a boggy man here... I mean how does mastadon know what to show you if not for an algorithm? It'd be like sorting by "new" on Reddit... yeah that works for some people but it's like taking a firehose of data. Most people want something a little more curated, which means something has to do that sorting

Algorithms aren't the problem, the incentives are. What we need are algorithms that have incentives encouraging positive discourse. Attention and likes are fine for your puppy and cat pictures that really don't mean anything, but if you want to talk about anything meaningful popularity is not the way.

oxala75 t1_j1o5dt4 wrote on December 26, 2022 at 12:48 AM

"sorting by "new" on Reddit..."

That is what I want on Mastodon.

Also, i don't think Twitter's algorithm promotes positive discourse. I believe that it promotes engagement at almost all cost.

Additionally, I've been having much more substantive discussion on Mastodon. In fact, that's currently my only gripe with my experience with the Fediverse - a lot of genuine connections and access to interesting people, but the silliness is in lower supply than on Twitter. I know why, and i'm aware that loving hot mess is a double edged swords.

Mastodon is not a Twitter killer, but I think that it can be a Twitter alternative for some. More importantly, it is something that has value. It is not for everyone, and isn't trying to be. It is harder to understand at first, and i wish that was different. But I'm very puzzled by people who are calling it useless, and by people who don't understand why living algorithm free wouldn't be desirable for some.

B-Rock001 t1_j1oh6ml wrote on December 26, 2022 at 2:36 AM

Never said it was useless. Just don't buy it's the revolution supporters (like the author of the article) want it to be... I think that has a lot more to do with the lukewarm reaction than "you just don't get it, man". Seems to me a good chance it simply exacerbates the bubbles we already find ourselves in if only those who are savvy enough to work with it sign up.

BTW, I know some like sort by new, but I find it's mostly trash (except maybe in small communities). I actually want something to sort through the dregs and promote the good stuff. Likes and attention is a terrible metric to use for that but it's all we've got so far. I want something better that starts encouraging healthy discourse for all, not just those who can figure it out... don't really know what that is, but mastadon ain't it.

oxala75 t1_j1oq2fk wrote on December 26, 2022 at 3:58 AM

I hear you. I'm not sure what the solution is, because Twitter also is a lot of (good!) things, but great at encouraging healthy discourse for all is not one of them.