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__The__Anomaly__ t1_jd81of0 wrote

Reply to comment by tiopepe002 in Endgame for f****** society! by tiopepe002

I would recommend starting with the book "The Player of Games", because it gives the clearest description of what The Culture is actually like and it's a relatively short but fun read. (Also you can find a free PDF of it easily)

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Jernau-Morat-Gurgeh t1_jd8farb wrote

I came here to suggest this. It also hints at some of the more dystopian aspects of a post-scarcity society and how manipulative it may actually be.

Still would be my preferred sci-fi civilisation to live in of all that have been written or put to film.

Then move onto Excession for a view on what AI politics could look like.

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usaaf t1_jd8oh50 wrote

(Don't read this if you don't want Culture book spoilers)

At least the manipulations are for a good reason, unlike our present Capitalist Manipulations. Sure Gurgeh is played hard, but SCs reasoning for that was to destabilize a very cruel society in the least-harmful way they thought possible. And despite that, they went out of their way to provide him with protections all along the way. It shows how a post-scarcity society answers the remaining hard moral questions that might crop up. I think Banks lays out something as idealistic as reality will allow, a mix of pragmatism and compassion.

We definitely do not get that from our present, very much outwardly, explicitly coercive power structures. I'd take drones playing games with me for reasonably noble purposes over the disgusting manipulations and outright power abuses of a Capitalist society, with its only goal ridiculous and ultimately useless profit.

And that said, the Culture is fully aware of the dangers and moral risks of their meddling, and is still only partly apologetic about it. In Look to Windward, the Culture literally caused a bloody and intense civil war by trying to erase a caste system in a lower-tech society. While they apologized and tried to make amends, they still maintained that they'd keep interfering, keep trying to make things better, even if they're going to make mistakes and cause harm, all because they want to try to prevent greater harms if possible.

This is contrasted almost directly by things like the Prime Directive (which some argue was originally created to showcase humanity's compassion and drive for the same as the Culture, b frequently breaking it, as is the case in ToS, for noble purposes) as used in the TNG era and somewhat Voyager. The Culture isn't afraid of those mistakes and I think that shows a much more humane approach, a much more logical one, and one that certainly has the potential to bring about greater peace and general well-being than the essentially passive, wishy-washy, hopeful optimism-minus-action of something like the Prime Directive, which gives observers peace of mind in the face of external suffering and serves best as a refuge for cowardly centrism.

As far as Banks and his Culture goes, I do not think there is another Science Fiction writer that had as keen a grasp on the idea of AI or post-scarcity out there. His machines vary in intelligence and motive and drive, from little more than robots as we know them to intensely, almost more-than human actors with deep feelings. As an art form, fiction obviously features a lot of conflict and Banks's books are no exception, but unlike most sci-fi he does not taint his pleasant, optimistic, peaceful view of future. It really is a blueprint for what is possible, something I feel like we could build one day. Maybe soon. And, hey, if someone doesn't like the Culture, they can always leave. That, more than much else, is something you can't get easily anywhere else.

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