Comments
ProtoplanetaryNebula t1_j7rjcq0 wrote
Battery density improves around 5-8% per year, so the gains are small but steady. None of these 50% gains that always get talked about ever come to anything, but over time it all adds up.
SandAndAlum t1_j7t3rv3 wrote
> None of these 50% gains that always get talked about ever come to anything, but over time it all adds up.
They often do, it just takes a decade, so it looks like another 5-8% improvement when it hits market.
ProtoplanetaryNebula t1_j7t4ijt wrote
No, they are just small iterations actually. No one cell make that much of a big jump in one go. I follow battery news and youtube channels on the subject every single day.
SandAndAlum t1_j7t5fi8 wrote
LiFePO4 was a huge jump in cycle count, charge rate and cobalt usage but charge rate wasn't even state of the art once commercial. Lithium was a huge jump in density. Hard carbon anodes were a huge jump when first investigated, but small hop once commercialised. Various low nickel and low cobalt cathode improvements were 20-40% better than status quo when discovered. Some Zinc based chemistries are a huge jump from what was normal when discovered, but are niche now.
The techniques and knowledge also apply to other things.
ale_93113 t1_j7sh6t7 wrote
Same with cancer, a new cure is always on the way
It never materialises
Yet the mortality rate goes gradually down
Nows_a_good_time t1_j7tg9xg wrote
We havent gotten any of these talked about chemistry changes though. Just steady improvements on existing Li-ion or LiPo
ProtoplanetaryNebula t1_j7vd36o wrote
That was my point.
Midori_Schaaf t1_j7rbnb7 wrote
TL;DR The new battery claims potential for 1KWh per kilogram.
Context: gas is about 12 or 13 kwh/kg
Li-ion batteries are about 0.25kwh/kg
allenout t1_j7s78j6 wrote
Bear in mind, electric motors can be 95+% efficient while ICE cars are at best 25% efficient, so that means that ICEs are actually more like 2kWh/kg while metal air batteries are 1kWh/kg+, so a electric car would only need about 2x the size of full fuel tank as a ICE car.
SandAndAlum t1_j7t3xcw wrote
You also need to include regen. And the fact the tank has a weight.
1kWh/kg is roughly on par with a small reciprocating ICE.
allenout t1_j7t4ims wrote
The fuel tank is made from thin plastic so the weight is largely irrelevant.
SandAndAlum t1_j7t5ie3 wrote
They're still >20kg when plastic, and the last few I saw were steel and weighed as much as the fuel.
ctudor t1_j7wed8j wrote
i think ICE engine and specific parts add more weight than their electric counterparts.
solotryps t1_j7y84cg wrote
An ICE transmission also wastes a lot more power than a simple EV reduction gear
mrSunshine-_ t1_j7t4kxk wrote
Petrol density is something like 0,72, so it drops even more. In 50 kg petrol space you get 75kg battery.
GI_X_JACK t1_j7t6xrt wrote
Also keep in mind that ICE doesn't translate %100 to Electric use wise.
The infrastructure of gas is you basicly fill it up once a week, at a gas station.
Unless you live out on a farm, you can't have a refueling station in your house. You can't also run a gas pipe, as gas stations need trucks to show up and refill the gas. There is a lot of logistics into fuel processing and delivery that is specific for ICE.
Electric? You just have a high amp 240V circuit installed and charger. for a GOOD charger its about $1k, and another $1k USD to have the line installed. All the infra is already there.
You don't need a week of fuel, only a day.
Also, as noted below, EVs are far more efficient.
chrisdh79 OP t1_j7qsk0i wrote
From the article: A new paper published in Science describes the chemistry behind a novel lithium-air battery, an innovative design which could potentially provide way more energy density than traditional li-ion battery technology. It could serve as a real breakthrough for the battery market and a possible revolution for transportation and heavy-duty vehicles such as airplanes, trains and even submarines.
The new battery can sustain more than 1,000 recharge cycles with just a small five percent drop in energy efficiency and zero impact on coulombic efficiency. This means that all the initial battery material was still active, with no irreversible side reactions during the charge/recharge cycles.
The design conceived by researchers at the Illinois Institute of Technology uses a solid electrolyte based on a ceramic-polyethylene oxide composite, which is safer and more efficient compared to liquid electrolytes. Ceramic and polymer materials used as solid electrolytes have their own downsides when used separately but when combined, they can provide both the high ionic conductivity of ceramic and the high stability of the polymer.
FuturologyBot t1_j7qx60w wrote
The following submission statement was provided by /u/chrisdh79:
From the article: A new paper published in Science describes the chemistry behind a novel lithium-air battery, an innovative design which could potentially provide way more energy density than traditional li-ion battery technology. It could serve as a real breakthrough for the battery market and a possible revolution for transportation and heavy-duty vehicles such as airplanes, trains and even submarines.
The new battery can sustain more than 1,000 recharge cycles with just a small five percent drop in energy efficiency and zero impact on coulombic efficiency. This means that all the initial battery material was still active, with no irreversible side reactions during the charge/recharge cycles.
The design conceived by researchers at the Illinois Institute of Technology uses a solid electrolyte based on a ceramic-polyethylene oxide composite, which is safer and more efficient compared to liquid electrolytes. Ceramic and polymer materials used as solid electrolytes have their own downsides when used separately but when combined, they can provide both the high ionic conductivity of ceramic and the high stability of the polymer.
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/Futurology/comments/10x84jy/a_new_lithiumair_battery_design_promises/j7qsk0i/
satans_toast t1_j7rr1m3 wrote
I don’t see anything about heat dissipation, is that not a concern?
AbjectReflection t1_j7t5rma wrote
There are a couple of good technologies to help with transportation and EV style vehicles. The vanadium redox battery for one, and the newer aluminum ion battery. I think the biggest problem facing the EV industry is the fact that companies make it incredibly difficult to replace the existing batteries with new ones. Like new laws facing cell phones in the EU, EV car manufacturers need to make the batteries more easy to replace and recycle.
GI_X_JACK t1_j7t6620 wrote
>one kilowatt-hour per kilogram
I'll believe that when I see that in a mass production model.
consider:
my Fiat 500E has a 24kWh hour battery, so 24 pounds.
Max energy consumption from my house in a 1 day period is 25 kWh, typical 11 kWh
go222 t1_j7vpatt wrote
It uses a polyethylene ceramic. I wonder if it will have the same problems as was recently found with PET (don't ask me to pretend I know what the T is for but PE is polyethylene). That tape is supposed to be an insulator but breaks down to cause battery shorting. Lots of battery stories lately and definitely progress but hard to tell when batteries will be as durable, available, and affordable compared to expectations raised in these articles.
twasjc t1_j7raegd wrote
We're moving away from batteries in general and instead focusing on making zero point modules smaller with background energy storage. Area 51 has ones the size of a cell phone or so atm. We can separate storage and generation from usage
EgoDefeator t1_j7rebjj wrote
I want whatever you're on
Fonzie1225 t1_j7ressg wrote
and the US military isn’t using this technology in every fifth-gen fighter because that would make things TOO easy!
MarvinStolehouse t1_j7rlhse wrote
Once we can get that up to toaster size, we can finally get that 8th chevron to lock.
GeminiKoil t1_j7tb5g1 wrote
At that point we can go grab the ZPM we fuckin' forgot in Atlantis and won't even need the other shit.
hallowass t1_j7rxipi wrote
This guy watched stargate and thought it was a true story.
True_Reward9768 t1_j7rcwds wrote
Please shut the fuck up about batteries.
I swear every fucking week we hear about some amazing breakthrough that NEVER makes it to actual devices for some reason or another.
itsgoingtobeebanned t1_j7r20ja wrote
If I had a dollar for everytime they think they've made better batteries....
Hope it's true but as someone who likes drone racing which is currently limited by battery tech I've heard this a bunch over the last 6-7 years