Historical-Mastodon9 t1_j0kcdp5 wrote on December 17, 2022 at 8:10 AM

Reply to comment by FireZeLazer in Hi! I’m Dr Lucy Maddox from Bath University (UK). I’m a clinical psychologist researching compassionate care and things that can get in the way. I have a new book out called A Year To Change Your Mind, about how psychology can help with everyday life by UniversityofBath

>Although just to warn you, the latter is associated with high levels of stress and burnout and there's some talk of "locking" trainees into the role, meaning they can't leave for 2 years post-qualification

I think they've already done this. It's as sad as it is funny, really: 'people are leaving this really stressful, underpaid job. How can we fix this? I know, how about we force them to stay?' Brilliant.

>be prepared for a really competitive field. I'd only recommend it if you are truly passionate and focused on it as a career. I'd say most people are looking at 3-4 years minimum of experience after undergraduate before they get onto the course, which is then another 3 years. I was fortunate to get onto the course with "only" 2.5 years of experience. Most of my colleagues have more.

What do you think helped you stand out to get on sooner than your peers? What do you think you might have done if you couldn't become a psychologist?

I'm passionate about it, but it's very depressing to read about how hard it is, and I can only imagine it's going to be harder than ever with the increased levels of graduates due to covid policy mess. Also my university seems to be stingier with 1sts; the number of people who get them supposedly goes up every year, and at my university 35% of people overall get firsts, yet for psychology in all the reports they have given out so far for any assignment I've done, only like 10% of people, max, are getting 1sts in their assignments. Very few people are going to be graduating with 1sts overall, and I'm not sure I'll be one of them. There's definitely the thought of saying 'screw it' and studying for a conversion course in computer science for an easier life, even though I'm not passionate about that.

FireZeLazer t1_j0mn4t9 wrote on December 17, 2022 at 8:45 PM

Damn that sucks. PWP is still a great job for experience but being locked in makes it hard to recommend when the stress can be unhealthy.

It is competitive but if it's what you want to do I'd still encourage going for it. There are many other job routes other than Clinical Psychology if it doesn't work out. You can become a CBT therapist, or look at a Health Psychology route, or a PhD if you like research. I think I'd have kept trying for the doctorate if I hadn't got on at least for a few more years (I know some people that take 5+ attempts to get on).

My backup career outside mental health was data analysis/data science, or some research position.

Don't worry too much if you don't get a first. As long as you can show you're academically capable, that's what's needed. Experience + clinical skills are what most institutions look for.

Historical-Mastodon9 t1_j0oebxa wrote on December 18, 2022 at 5:03 AM

Thanks for the response! Whilst I've got you, could I pester you to answer a few more questions?

Is being a psychologist what you dreamed it would be?
If you could go back and give advice to yourself when you were younger, what might you say?
I'm a guy. I've noticed that most psychologists, and certainly people on my course, are women. Do you have any idea why this might be, and have you found this to be the case where you work? I'm kinda hoping this will make me stand out a bit amongst the hordes of candidates.
You mentioned data science. I've used a bit of R and psychology obviously involves some statistical analysis etc., but do you think that would've been an easy transition? What were your thoughts there? Sounds like maybe you had a similar back-up plan to me and my idea of a computer science conversion.

I'm definitely going to soldier on and hope to become a psychologist for now. But that voice at the back of my head does make me question it sometimes, especially since I'm a mature student, so spending another 6-10 years before I become a psychologist in the best of cases wouldn't be ideal. But it's hard to imagine being satisfied in life if I don't give it a shot.

Thanks again.

FireZeLazer t1_j0pbz2a wrote on December 18, 2022 at 12:12 PM

Since I was about 16 I wanted to be a clinical psychologist. It was my main goal since then.
I'm not sure!
Yes Clinical Psychology is about 80% women. Probably lots of societal factors explain that difference. I don't think being a man or woman is a benefit or weakness.
I taught myself R to do the statistical analysis for my dissertation and I really enjoyed it. I figured if I could teach myself R during an undergraduate dissertation, that I could learn enough to become a data analyst, and from there transition into data science. I have no idea how realistic it was, but I think it would have worked if I put my mind to it.

On that note, if you are interested in quantitative analysis/maths I would recommend doing further learning yourself where possible. If you are a mature student does that mean you live at home as opposed to rooming with students? I lived at home and I think this gave me a good advantage over my peers. I wasn't surrounded by alcohol and drama and noise. This gave me the opportunity to work much harder. This is why I was able to do extracurricular reading and learn skills such as R. There's a great course by Daniel Lakens online about p-values and frequentist statistics. If you go through it you will end up knowing more than not just your peers, but a lot of the lecturers and clinical psychologists too. This then allows you an extra perspective in being able to critique research which is a really important skill in psychology.

On the topic of career, it depends on your goals. Spending another 6-10 years to become a clinical psychologist can sound daunting, but you need to reframe it. You will be spending that time learning really valuable skills, earning some money (most roles are band 5 so ~27k). For example, to some people being a PWP is their entire career. Or some will progress to Senior PWP and Band 6. There's also a new role as a Clinical Associate Applied Practitioner (or something like that), which is Band 6 (or Band 7 in Wales) and can function as a career or a step to Clinical Psychology (although like a pwp, locks you in for 2 years).

P.s I've mentioned a lot about working hard, but I also spent a lot of time doing other things like gaming, watching football, going on walks, etc. You need a work life balance.

Historical-Mastodon9 t1_j0ptpt2 wrote on December 18, 2022 at 3:04 PM

>Since I was about 16 I wanted to be a clinical psychologist. It was my main goal since then.

Ah, I think you misinterpreted my question. I was asking whether it lived up to your dreams. Is it as satisfying as you hoped?

I'll check out the course, thanks. And true, there's definitely various options to consider with careers, it's not all or nothing. I'd also consider applying to graduate entry medicine which is again super competitive but I think the experience I'd be gaining would tick a lot of the boxes for that. Did you go down the support worker -> pwp/ap -> doctorate route?