BackItUpWithLinks t1_jbeocec wrote on March 8, 2023 at 2:45 PM

Or you could say the US has some of the lowest taxes in the developed world, and when you add in expenses for healthcare it’s right on par with the other developed countries.

pennieblack t1_jbeqwe3 wrote on March 8, 2023 at 3:03 PM

Sure. That might be fair. I don't have the numbers either way, but I thought it unfair to judge a guy on half his comment.

BackItUpWithLinks t1_jbes7h0 wrote on March 8, 2023 at 3:12 PM

And I thought it was unfair to add more money to the pile, then incorrectly say the US has “some of the highest” when really that just brought the US in-line with many other developed countries.

SobeysBags t1_jbevfwi wrote on March 8, 2023 at 3:33 PM

Health insurance premiums in the USA are the highest in the world, the average for a single person being $500 a month and for a family $1300 a month. This doesn't include max out of pocket deductibles an other co-pays etc. That's brutal. Sure this is not a tax, but it is a de-facto required expense, as if you go without this, you are putting your life and livelihood at risk along with your family's. So it is not brining it "in-line" with other countries it is going above and beyond. Not to mention things like property tax and other forms of taxation in these states with no income tax or sales tax gets hidden from international comparisons. Honestly talk to anyone who moved to the USA from places like Canada, Australia, many places in Europe. They often think they will be free from high taxes, only to discover it gets transplanted to other places, and they are paying for it elsewhere.

BackItUpWithLinks t1_jbex7xr wrote on March 8, 2023 at 3:45 PM

> talk to anyone who moved to the USA from places like Canada, Australia, many places in Europe. They often think they will be free from high taxes, only to discover it gets transplanted to other places, and they are paying for it elsewhere.

So, that’s exactly what I said. The US has relatively low taxes until you add in healthcare, then it goes up to be about in-line with other developed countries.

You agreed with me.

SobeysBags t1_jbf1xsc wrote on March 8, 2023 at 4:16 PM

Except I didn't say "in line", I said above and beyond. Also even without healthcare, many states with sales and income tax are more than many countries. It's the states with no sales tax or income tax that bring the average down in the USA, as this does not consider property tax, fees for services, and other forms of taxation not normally calculated in international stats. One of the issues with a such a huge country with many levels of govt, it's hard to see the price you pay on the ground as a regular person.

BackItUpWithLinks t1_jbf3y3l wrote on March 8, 2023 at 4:29 PM

> Except I didn't say "in line", I said above and beyond.

I’d like to see the math that says when you add all of it up, the US is paying more.

I keep seeing that many other countries have universal healthcare and the US has to pay so “the US pays more for healthcare” but that ignores that they also pay 45-50% tax and VAT.

So if you’re going to claim the US is more expensive, compare apples:apples and show the math.

SobeysBags t1_jbf66c1 wrote on March 8, 2023 at 4:43 PM

Most countries with universal healthcare are not paying 45-50%, that is really only a few countries that also have huge safety nets and public services well beyond healthcare (not to mention the Americans spend more on healthcare costs than other country on earth). If you want to show the math state by state and country by country, you better sit down and pay some tuition. When you are paying 6-15 GRAND in healthcare premiums each year, you better believe no one in other countries have this burden. No one moves to the USA to escape taxes or reduce their tax burden, it just doesn't happen. Personally speaking, I have lived in about a half dozen other countries (although I am one person, and this is purely anecdotal), the USA is one of the highest burdens with regards to taxes and income reduction I have encountered. This nonsensical American exceptionalism, where we can't compare it to any other country, because "apples and oranges" is a defeatist attitude, and a flight from the reality on the ground.

BackItUpWithLinks t1_jbf7djg wrote on March 8, 2023 at 4:51 PM

> Most countries with universal healthcare are not paying 45-50%, that is really only a few countries

Finland
Japan
Austria
Denmark
Sweden
Belgium
Israel
Netherlands
Portugal
Ireland
Spain
Germany
UK
France
Australia
Greece (44%)
Italy (43%)…

I posted the link. I’m not sure what more I can do.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/highest-taxed-countries

You keep typing words back at me. Why won’t you back up your claim? Post info on how the US spends more when you take into account all taxes.

Are Maine taxes as bad as people say?

BackItUpWithLinks t1_jbeam3o wrote on March 8, 2023 at 12:55 PM

pennieblack t1_jbejlmm wrote on March 8, 2023 at 2:10 PM