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degggendorf t1_j4lpgdl wrote

Reply to comment by Beezlegrunk in Share your opinion about Fane Tower by quinntronix

Ooops, you forgot to answer the question I asked! That would look an awful lot like deflection to someone reading your comment.

So let's try again...what do you think would happen if a million new apartments opened up in San Francisco tomorrow?

> If you’re so certain that those theories are true, point to the actual U.S. cities that you know they have been proven.

I would like to once again ask you to read my links. I already did what you're requesting. Or are you actively trying to avoid learning, because you value retaining your preconceived notions over anything real?

Let me coax you into learning with this excerpt from here:

> To be clear, this debate is not about whether new housing can reduce housing prices overall. At this point, that idea isn’t really in doubt. There’s good reason to believe that in regions with high housing demand, building more housing can help keep the prices of existing housing down. In their Supply Skepticism paper from 2018, Vicki Been, Ingrid Gould Ellen, and Katherine O’Regan offer an excellent introduction to the broader question of how market-rate development affects affordability. Citing numerous individual studies and reviews of dozens more, they conclude that “the preponderance of the evidence shows that restricting supply increases housing prices and that adding supply would help to make housing more affordable.”

which references this study, that has all the real-world data you're looking for.

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Beezlegrunk t1_j4muu3m wrote

>Ooops, you forgot to answer the question I asked! That would look an awful lot like deflection to someone reading your comment.
>
>So let's try again...what do you think would happen if a million new apartments opened up in San Francisco tomorrow?

There'd be an apartment for every man, woman, child, and many pets in San Francisco, given the size of its population. Whether they could afford them is not clear, since adding additional apartments in San Francisco has so far not lowered rents. I've stated that dozens of times, but if you keep asking, maybe the answer will change ...

> I already did what you're requesting.

No, you haven't — you've cited research papers on how zoning regulations affect the number of housing units that get built in certain. What you cannot possibly do is actually state the name of a city where the construction of high-price housing has reduced the cost of lower-price housing.

You can't do it, because there are none. As soon as you cite an actual city, we can discuss what the effects of luxury housing have been there. But since you're certain that your theories on high-price housing are valid, why is it so hard to find even one concrete example ...?

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degggendorf t1_j4mx436 wrote

> There'd be an apartment for every man, woman, child, and many pets in San Francisco, given the size of its population.

Right, we agree so far.

> Whether they could afford them is not clear

Why isn't it clear? What are the possibilities?

To me, the owner will have a bunch of buildings that are costing them money sitting empty. They list them for $4,000/month. No one rents. $3,000/month. No one rents. They try to sell the building, but no one wants to buy a vacant apartment building. $1,500/month and people become interested.

That is supply reducing pricing.

If you don't think or aren't sure pricing will get lower, what do you think will happen instead? The owners just keep them listed for $4,000/month with 0 tenants, and just lose money into bankruptcy?

> you've cited research papers on how zoning regulations affect the number of housing units that get built in certain

If you think that's the topic you might be literally illiterate. Or, more likely, you're just misrepresenting it because in your imagination you think it makes it seem like your unwillingness to learn is you winning an argument.

> As soon as you cite an actual city, we can discuss what the effects of luxury housing have been there.

Against my better judgment, I will do some reading for you and pull out a few of the cities referenced in the paper: Atlanta, Detroit, Minneapolis.

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