Comments

You must log in or register to comment.

jezra t1_ison7uy wrote

there should be an /r/aboutfuckingtime sub for stories like this where artifacts, looted by grave robbers, are finally returned.

24

Shufflepants t1_isotk4z wrote

Now, if only the museums in the UK could take a hint.

20

hattysaurus t1_isp2uwr wrote

Don’t they have to due to NAGPRA, or am I misremembering something?

11

loof10 t1_isr5noj wrote

“We watched John Oliver last week and thought he made some good points.”

10

KTnash OP t1_isr5vpn wrote

The John Oliver Effect is real.

5

Redsneeks3000 t1_isozef6 wrote

Hear that Buckingham palace? Give it all back.

7

AutoModerator t1_isnzf7d wrote

Reminder: this subreddit is meant to be a place free of excessive cynicism, negativity and bitterness. Toxic attitudes are not welcome here.

All Negative comments will be removed and will possibly result in a ban.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

1

deathacus12 t1_isrh1zi wrote

Artist here, actual question. Do indigenous tribes have the resources, experts, and facilities to conserve these pieces? Or is it a symbolic gesture and they're gonna stay with UC Berkeley.

−1

dacuriouspineapple t1_isrxrfz wrote

It doesn't matter what one does with their own belongings. Aside from that, there's an underlying assumption baked into these types of questions that is offensive.

3

deathacus12 t1_isryy5x wrote

It does in this case since these objects have been deemed 'culturally significant' by historians. Their preservation is therefore important.

I'm not implying that these tribes are stupid or incapable of taking care of these objects. I would hate to see irreversible damage done to these artifacts, especially since their culture has been destroyed enough as is. Care of historic artifacts requires teams of folks with extensive domain knowledge, proper facilities, and money for upkeep. Unless they have a dedicated art or anthropology museum, they most likely don't have the necessary resources. Even if they do have the resources or could get them in the near future, transportation is an issue. Many of these artifacts are fragile. Transporting them to (probably) lesser facilities with the added risk of them being damaged in transit doesn't really make sense. That is, if you care about the cultural value these artifacts have.

−1

Illithilitch t1_itdv2ux wrote

They rebury them. Just like you would if someone dug up your grandma. Preservation isn't the goal.

1

corrado33 t1_isqr3nc wrote

Legitimate question: Would artifacts be safer in a large museum or in the possession of a group of people who don't have a museum?

In some cases the answer is obvious. If the people you stole from are well established and have their own museums, then sure, give it back. But what if that's not true. What if the people you're giving it back to don't have their own museums? What happens to it? Does it decay somewhere to be forgotten to time?

I have no idea who has and who doesn't have museums, I'm simply speculating.

−8

mlwspace2005 t1_isrdad2 wrote

Does it matter if they are safer? If I broke into your house and stole your TV or the urn with your grandmother's ashes would my keeping them be justified if I had better storage facilities? It's their cultural artifacts and human remains. And let's not forget that those artifacts which are stored in larger institutions arnt necessarily safer, people do dumb and highly destructive things to them even there.

11

corrado33 t1_issxtkc wrote

If the artifact is of significant provenance, yes.

Imagine something extremely important to the way we figured something out, say... the Rosetta stone. This artifact was extremely crucial to figuring out how certain languages work, and it's of great cultural importance as well. However, it's in the british museum which likely means it was stolen from elsewhere. What if that elsewhere doesn't have any place to properly store it? What if it's likely to get stolen and lost if it's given back. Do we just give it back, knowing full well it's likely to get stolen/destroyed?

What then?

−2

mlwspace2005 t1_istcx6s wrote

If that place it was taken from does not have the capacity to store it you should still return it, whatever cultural significance you attach to it means nothing against it's original cultures claim to the artifact. Especially if it's someplace like the British museum, who in the past have decided such culturally important artifacts should be scrubbed with the likes of a stiff metal wire brush and chemicals, thus permanently damaging such artifacts. Not to worry though, if you can ever scrape together enough money to travel to the UK you too can pay to see your artifact, assuming it's among the few thousand on display and not part of the 8 million objects locked up in the basement forever.

5

AsianSensation1087 t1_it05vzk wrote

Yes. Give it back. It's theirs. They'll take care of it.

3

corrado33 t1_it0dvvg wrote

And if they don't?

And an important artifact is destroyed/lost/stolen?

What then? We say "Whoops! That's their right, even though it's part of our history now too!"

0

machinegunsyphilis t1_it3nay5 wrote

What if UC Berkeley caught and fire and everything they had burned down? What if aliens crashed their ship into their storage? We can go on all day with nonsensical what ifs.

1

corrado33 t1_it4hncc wrote

UC Berkeley has top of the line fire suppression systems, ESPECIALLY wherever they'd hold artifacts.

That's.... literally the advantage of keeping artifacts in museums where they're well taken care of.

You're arguing my point here.

1

PM_ME_UR_SEAHORSE t1_isr9aiz wrote

Usually human remains returned to tribes get reburied, with other artifacts it depends, but regardless they don't rightfully belong to the anthropologists or archeologists who took them or dug them up or the university that's been holding on to them, it should not be up to them what happens to the items, it should be the decision of the descendants of the people whose bodies we're talking about or who made the items. Whether they have their own museum or loan them to a museum or bury them or whatever.

The Wiyot tribe this article discusses does have a Historic Preservarion Office and a cultural center.

8

frothysmile t1_isq8oiu wrote

But where are they gonna store the artifacts? I would assume next to their alcohol and fourwheelers.

Or, maybe a casino safe.

Obvious joke

−9

playbeautiful t1_isq9s9i wrote

r/thepunchlineisracism

14

frothysmile t1_isqa8e8 wrote

Pretty good sub reddit. I laughed a few times

−4

playbeautiful t1_isqbe7r wrote

I really like it because it’s a mix of actually funny jokes and super cringe offensive ‘jokes’

I am not sure which your joke is so I thought it’s perfect for the sub lol

2