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ElectricStar87 t1_izpkde7 wrote

Sure but virtually all of the densely populated areas not served by rail here have substantial bus service. You can certainly critique the speed and frequency of those buses and the quality of their Inter-connectedness (we need more of them, and more express busses), but the argument for large rail investment over simply better buses has never been convincing.

Unless you’re talking about subway additions or all surface rail lines having light preemption, this isn’t really an argument that’s being made in good faith. And even then you’re talking about astronomical investment and infrastructure additions.

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instantcoffee69 t1_izpkudx wrote

Oh no, we're talking about wanting a substantial infrastructure investment. It's how you make a city a better place to live and work.

Get people out of car and into public transportation. The only way to do that is to have GOOD public transportation, and you have to pay and build it

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baltinerdist t1_izq50gj wrote

The other way to do it is to make it free. MTA costs roughly $800M per year and sees less than 100M riders. If every rider was spending two bucks a ride, that still wouldn't even get to 25% of the budget.

Just make all transit services free and watch ridership balloon.

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ElectricStar87 t1_izqlfk9 wrote

This has been tried, and things didn’t work out that way. Obviously perhaps other conditions might change the outcome.

I could understand subsidies/vouchers for individual transit users with limited means, but overall you likely need to maintain fees.

I think overall, fare recovery ratios for public transit tend to be between 20-30% on average, if that’s of use.

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ElectricStar87 t1_izpla7d wrote

Buses provide an extremely good step in that direction, without the costs or liabilities of rail, and with much faster implementation. So many people here just insist that trains are magic and anything other than that is a pale shadow of a solution.

EDIT: buses also allow for greater route flexibility over time (additions, changes).

To everyone downvoting this comment, you are providing no counter argument or contrary data.

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ElectricStar87 t1_izpzkr3 wrote

Buses provide an extremely good step in that direction, without the costs or liabilities of rail, and with much faster implementation. So many people here just insist that trains are magic and anything other than that is a pale shadow of a solution.

EDIT: buses also allow for greater route flexibility over time (additions, changes).

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Beneficial-Pickle787 t1_izpmq9o wrote

How often do you take MTA buses?

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ElectricStar87 t1_izpnucq wrote

I don’t have a vehicle and haven’t for a decade. I take buses less since coronavirus (prefer biking) but for many years have taken buses twice a day for commuting across the city and for other purposes as well (grocery shopping, etc. — both MTA and Circulator), with light rail and subway trips as well, depending on destination. I have also previously taken commuter buses out to Columbia in years past.

EDIT: Also a frequent MARC train rider — I buy tickets by the 20 pack.

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ElectricStar87 t1_izptcsj wrote

So….I’m being downvoted for being an exclusively bike and public transport user? Cool. Makes total sense.

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ticumac t1_izqn96o wrote

I would say for being inconsiderate of others and acting like because you can do it, everyones else can. But hey, whatever makes you sleep good at night.

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ElectricStar87 t1_izqsm1v wrote

There’s nothing inconsiderate about my responses, nor anything presumptuous about how my particular experiences with using transit translates to other people’s abilities or capacity.

There are however a lot of claims made by other people here that would incur extraordinary costs with potentially far less benefit than many other solutions, soaking up funding that could otherwise go to other very deserving needs like child care, healthcare, senior centers, schools, lunches etc.

Just because people really like trains doesn’t mean their proposals for trains are superior to other options.

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rmphys t1_izq3p4w wrote

Anyone who is unwilling to take an MTA bus will be equally unwilling to take any rail line they build.

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Beneficial-Pickle787 t1_izul5fg wrote

That’s not true. If buses were the same speed as rail, then maybe. But rail with dedicated ROW is definitely faster and more reliable.

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