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GYN-k4H-Q3z-75B t1_jebrsts wrote

276:0 in favor, too. Look at the world map to find out why everybody can dance around Sweden's application, but Finland's is no joke.

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IBAZERKERI t1_jebu6c1 wrote

WHOA.

big news day today! Trump's indicted AND Finland joins NATO

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Bigduck73 t1_jec0qlb wrote

Welcome to the friggin guardians of the Galaxy

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jmcgit t1_jec48gk wrote

Replying to ZrvaDetector (#2,504,216)

Russia issued some empty threats and the Finnish decided it’d be cool to have backup if Russia ever decides they want to take Finland too.

Those empty threats were mostly just bluster and attempting to keep their story straight on Ukraine, but it was still enough to get Finland to move off the fence.

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ZrvaDetector t1_jecbvgj wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#2,505,896)

It won't be ratified anytime soon. Sweden is actually bit unpopular in Turkey. Finland was not. They applied together so Finland got some collateral until they seperated their application process.

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IlIFreneticIlI t1_jeck9e3 wrote

Congratulations to Poo-tin, NATO recruiter of the year! Muscovy on a real rampage this year.

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random-incident t1_jeckaxh wrote

One nation should not be able to stop an otherwise unanimous vote to accept a new country. They should have had a clause that one holdout can’t stop a new nation coming in and the dissenter can live with it or leave the organization.

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raisroy t1_jecvl05 wrote

Replying to random-incident (#2,508,556)

The central idea of the NATO alliance is that all nations will come to the aid of any nation within the group that is attacked. The alliance will break down if individual nations are free to choose whether they'll actually do so.

Turkey would be responsible for defending Sweden in such a scenario, thus they have a voice in whether they have to be put in such a situation in the first place.

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HughMananatee t1_jed45xw wrote

Nice work Russia, managed to double your borders with NATO once Sweden is in too

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MeatsimPD t1_jedhse0 wrote

Replying to random-incident (#2,508,556)

Okay now imagine how you'd feel if a bunch of other countries tried to force your country to obligate it's military to the defense of another country.

And NATO would be far weaker without Turkey, certainly not worth kicking them out because they delayed Finland for several months. Have some patience

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ivytea t1_jedm3gy wrote

Replying to concerned_llama (#2,518,679)

There are still lots of footages on the internet showing YPG destroying Turkish tanks and helicopters using American weapons. That was Obama’s legacy until that orange head who openly admired Putin and Xi found more in common with Turkey’s Erdo who essentially became a dictator after the coup

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Garolys t1_jedmq4i wrote

Nato ei voi tallentaa Suomea!

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tolae01010 t1_jednrw7 wrote

I'd be a little nervous right now if I ran Estonia. Not sure of their dealings with NATO or Russia, but that seems like the next logical Russian target.

Edit: Just looked up that their leader has criticized Putin. So...

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aister t1_jedpmc4 wrote

Replying to random-incident (#2,508,556)

if NATO was a normal economic bloc, then yes. But it is a mutual defense block. Turkey is pretty much forced to defend Finland, or any other members of NATO, if they are attacked. Turkey, as well as any other countries in NATO, have to be OK with sending their weapons, ammunition, and most importantly, soldiers to defend Finland, as well as other new applicants and current members.

I hate the fact that Turkey and Hungary is holding up the process, but it is a process I wholeheartedly agree to.

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Enclavean t1_jedr6do wrote

Replying to demarr (#2,509,473)

All NATO countries has to agree yes, but parliaments dont need to be unanimous (as whatever vote wins is their countries only stance), Hungary just ratified as well and they had some votes for no

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JTanCan t1_jedy41w wrote

Replying to ivytea (#2,513,617)

No U.S. president has supported the creation of an independent Kurdish state. Iran doesn't want it, Iraq doesn't want it, Syria doesn't want it, Turkey doesn't want it.

Europe doesn't support it either.

Trump is a lot of things but he's not single-handedly responsible for torpedoing Kurdish statehood.

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JTanCan t1_jedyesp wrote

Replying to demarr (#2,509,473)

It wasn't. Turkey's parliament has 600 seats. Erdogan convinced the opposition simply not vote.

Next he has to sign off on the measure. I'm curious how long he's going to sit on it.

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JTanCan t1_jedyurn wrote

Replying to tolae01010 (#2,519,106)

As of last year the next target was Moldova. I don't recall there being evidence that has changed. But that plan is complicated by the failure of Russia to conquer Ukraine.

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osmopyyhe t1_jedze6m wrote

Replying to tolae01010 (#2,519,106)

Estonia is already a part of NATO and Finland joining actually increases their security as Finland offers additional air cover and makes supplying forces fighting in Estonia easier.

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Thedudewhosmokedpot t1_jee5ujt wrote

Replying to JTanCan (#2,521,415)

This is reddit." Trump bad"

Edit: it's especially bad because there's no shortage of actual things he did people can attack him for instead of making up stuff and blaming him for every single thing that's ever happened.

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Darkstar197 t1_jeec3oo wrote

Replying to GYN-k4H-Q3z-75B (#2,519,553)

NATO agreement has a clause that says “an attack on one is an attack on all”.

So every country needs to be on board, otherwise there might be situations of a country being forced to goto war for a country they do not support. Which might encourage countries to leave the alliance.

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funbike t1_jeed6x0 wrote

Replying to IBAZERKERI (#2,502,105)

This is really going to piss off Putin. He was trying to expand his influence and now he's got another NATO sitting along a huge portion of his border. When the Ukraine war ends, they'll likely be admitted and then the only non-NATO European country on their border will be Belarus.

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randompantsfoto t1_jeeivtt wrote

Replying to HughMananatee (#2,526,392)

Sweden controls a significant portion of the Baltic Sea. (Including the island of Gotland), a sea which essentially becomes a NATO lake as soon as they join. Any Russian ships based in St. Petersburg become trapped/useless in the event of a conflict with NATO.

Granted, they weren’t getting out into the North Sea and Atlantic past Denmark and Norway anyway, but now they wouldn’t even have room to steam out to the middle of the Baltic and pretend to be a navy without being under constant threat of land-based anti-ship missiles anywhere they go.

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randompantsfoto t1_jeek1tg wrote

Replying to random-incident (#2,520,712)

Not yet. Upcoming elections will either force Eedogan to fold (if public sentiment is leaning towards allowing Sweden in—his primary opponent is for allowing), or will approve it after he wins (once he gets what he wants from all the arm twisting).

As Sweden (as well as Finland) is part of the EU’s mutual defense pact, under Article 42, the rest of Europe’s member states are beholden to come to their aid regardless, in the event of an attack. It gives the U.K., U.S., and Canada an out if they didn’t want to get involved, but there’s not much chance they’d leave anyone hanging in the event of Russian hijinks.

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