[deleted] t1_j6lb0e6 wrote on January 31, 2023 at 3:11 AM

Reply to comment by Freethecrafts in Other person's car insurance may not cover my car repair, even though they backed into my parked car? by SereneFrost72

I completely agree the insured party who lied about the vehicles use has committed fraud not the insurance company or the agent or the underwriter. 100% and driving without insurance is in fact a crime. But you can’t blame an insurance company because someone misrepresented their situation to bypass obtaining the right insurance. Also if an insurance company can’t stipulate the policy terms which the policy holder agrees to when purchasing what stops everyone from lying? Why can’t I buy insurance by the mile say I drive 1 mile a year and pay $1 annual premium now you have to cover me? Come you cannot possibly believe that every insurer should insure 100% of every singe claim if the policy was misrepresented at the time of purchase.

Freethecrafts t1_j6lc06s wrote on January 31, 2023 at 3:19 AM

Again, disingenuous. The underwriter is required to provide coverage for a vehicle in order to be allowed to provide proof of insurance. That is the requirement. Otherwise, any scammer could provide “insurance” from an Indian call center, then disallow all responsibilities for whatever clause. The fraud is by the insurance company and their agents when they insure a vehicle, guarantee coverage, then stipulate against coverage in such a way that a third party would be left with the same limited recourse as existed before such insurance was mandatory. Either only sell fully functional policies, get out of the business, or expect to go to jail.

I absolutely think the underwriter should bear responsibility. If they want to go back on the insured for some stipulation, fine, don’t care. But outright denying claims fails on multiple criteria for an underwriter.

Charred_Steak_Nubbs t1_j6livtv wrote on January 31, 2023 at 4:15 AM

You could not be more inaccurate in your assessment.

Every policy is a contract between the insured and the insurer. In that policy contract the insurer outlines the terms of the coverages and any exclusions. These policies are reviewed and approved by each state in order for the insurer to use the policies.

Let me use an example for you. A person purchases insurance and pays the first monthly installment of their 6 month policy. The insurance company then mails the insured their proof of insurance for the 6 month policy period and declarations page. Coverage is contingent on the insured continuing to pay their monthly premiums. Let’s say the customer doesn’t pay after the first month and their policy cancels due to non payment. Should the insurance company be on the hook for the remainder of the original policy? The answer is no, the policy cancels due to non payment and there won’t be any coverage after the cancellation date despite what the proof of insurance says.

Freethecrafts t1_j6ljjfh wrote on January 31, 2023 at 4:21 AM

Insurance companies are required to provide an up to date listing with local enforcement and have a real time validation. You both misunderstand what the “card” is and what it represents.

You still refuse to understand that an underwriter is required to insure a vehicle for at fault claims. That’s the deal for being allowed to exist within that regulated environment. Leaving a third party without a means of payment for a vehicle you insured is a violation of that regulation. If you have a stipulation between yourself and the insured, go after them for that stipulation afterwards. At no time should an insured vehicle on the road leave an aggrieved third party without means to be made whole.

Charred_Steak_Nubbs t1_j6lklsl wrote on January 31, 2023 at 4:30 AM

You can believe what you want but it’s wrong. There are uninsured vehicles and drivers all over the place driving around and there is no requirement that insurance companies are required to force coverage on those vehicles.

The DMV receives insurance information from insurers. Insurers are also regulated by the state DOI. Don’t take it from me though, do your own research.

Freethecrafts t1_j6lmfmj wrote on January 31, 2023 at 4:47 AM

Never said insurance companies are required to force coverage. I said insurers are required to guarantee coverage for their policy holders. That’s the market requirement. To exist in the market, you have to be bonded and guarantee to cover fault.

I’m sure your idea of stipulating against regulation is going to work out well. Be sure to keep records on every denial, they’ll be necessary.

Sure, lots of vehicles without any insurance. And for that there’s hefty fines and possible jail time for people using public roads without following the laws. You keep trying to convolute drivers and the state where this discussion is on insurers and their regulators.

You’ve really sold me on the idea of felony charges for insurers who deny coverage for at fault claims based on some contract stipulation. The very idea that you could outright stipulate against the foundations of the system requirements is absurd. It’s good timing too.

[deleted] t1_j6mmqwd wrote on January 31, 2023 at 12:19 PM

You’re fundamentally wrong insurers are not required to guarantee coverage. Drivers are required to have coverage not the other way around. The insurance company has done nothing to stop the effected third party from collecting. The third party would file shit against the at fault driver. You as the driver is responsible to have the appropriate insurance. Not understanding this is such a cop out for any responsibility is mind blowing to me. Nothing is anyone’s fault right? Only person to blame the insurance company as usual. As I said earlier plenty of things wrong with insurance but you’re barking up the wrong tree. You have a very poor understanding of the law if you believe the insurance company is the one to “guarantee” coverage. You can actually check case studies on this it has been checked and checked again in the courts and you’re wrong every time

Charred_Steak_Nubbs t1_j6lqx9l wrote on January 31, 2023 at 5:31 AM

Maybe it’s different in your state as insurance regulations are made at the state level, but in my state it’s contract law. The state approves the policy for use and the insurer issues and binds the policies. The insurer and the insured both have to comply to the terms and the applicable policy language in the contract. The policy will outline the coverage and situations where coverage will not apply. As long as the insurer is operating within the parameters of the policy contract they can deny coverage if applicable. If the insured disagrees they can file a complaint with their state’s department of insurance, but as long as the insurer is operating within the language of the contract the denial’s likely stand.

This is how it works in my state (Oregon). There are no absolutes with coverage and it always comes down to the policy language in the contract which has been filed and approved with the state.

[deleted] t1_j6lcskt wrote on January 31, 2023 at 3:25 AM

Lol I genuinely can’t tell if this is a joke like you’re pranking me. You’re telling me a contract signed by both parties prior to it becoming in force should still stand if one party lies? So say I buy your house for $1 million dollars I move in and then never pay you there’s no recourse? You honored your end of the bargain but I lied. But contract is still valid I get the house and you never get your money. This has to be a troll post? You’re saying that lying to receive the benefit should require the benefit to still be provided? An insurance company denying coverage does not stop the claimant from filing suit against the at fault party. I just think you misunderstand how contracts, insurance, and the law works frankly.