Gloomy_Scene126 OP t1_j7y3nyt wrote on February 10, 2023 at 5:38 AM

Reply to comment by varmisciousknid in Freedom is found beyond dualism : Frithjof Bergmann’s model of freedom from a nondual perspective. by Gloomy_Scene126

Bergmann’s theory would suggest that you enter the flow state while playing pen and paper RPGs because you’re identified with the activity; you therefore act freely while doing it. On the other hand, nonduality says that the flow state is our natural state and we can get to the point of acting freely in everything we do if we move beyond the realm of identification and dissociation, let’s say.

varmisciousknid t1_j7y4m9j wrote on February 10, 2023 at 5:48 AM

The article was talking about there being separate flow states, one for art and one for academia, that's what I was talking about

Gloomy_Scene126 OP t1_j7y54cc wrote on February 10, 2023 at 5:54 AM

The article only mentioned the flow state insofar as it relates to freedom and identity

varmisciousknid t1_j7y6565 wrote on February 10, 2023 at 6:05 AM

Towards the end of "the ground beneath the fence"

Gloomy_Scene126 OP t1_j7y96hk wrote on February 10, 2023 at 6:41 AM

The end of that section is differentiating between Bergmann and Spira’s view of flow state….in other words it’s establishing the difference between the flow state as seen from a dualistic vs a nondualistic perspective. It uses an example to demonstrate how Bergmann’s dualistic flow works….if I’m identified with my my reasoning skills then I will feel free and therefore enter the flow state while reasoning. Not sure where you’re getting the art and academia idea from.

varmisciousknid t1_j7z37kr wrote on February 10, 2023 at 12:59 PM

I suppose I am making a bit of a leap. He says he's identified with reasoning and can enter flow while reasoning. What kind of tasks do people do while reasoning? Academic type tasks, as opposed to doing more artistic tasks which don't involve reasoning such as improvisation

Gloomy_Scene126 OP t1_j7zfsr7 wrote on February 10, 2023 at 2:40 PM

Yes I mean you’re not wrong in saying that one can be identified with academic tasks and dissociated from artistic tasks or vice versa, which ultimately determines the situations in which theyre able to enter into the flow state; but these are just more examples demonstrating how Bergmann’s dualistic flow works. It’s not really being suggested that academic and artistic are specifically two types of flow, because this isn’t central to the point being made by the article.