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SvetlanaButosky t1_jbab9dz wrote

Reply to comment by Gamusino2021 in /r/philosophy Open Discussion Thread | March 06, 2023 by BernardJOrtcutt

According to their arguments, it is because the victims never asked for it, they were forced into such horrible fates because we continue to exist, meaning we are deliberately perpetuating their suffering knowing that a percentage of them will always suffer.

Therefore we have a moral obligation to stop this once and for all, if we cant create a suffering free Utopia (which is near impossible), then it would be easier and more practical to just blow up earth or something similar.

They have basically compared the options and found total annihilation of life to be much more achievable so that's why they went for it.

To be fair, a suffering free Utopia is not totally impossible, its just very hard to achieve and will probably take thousands of years if not longer, it would be much easier and create much less victims if we just blow up earth. lol

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Gamusino2021 t1_jbaer0k wrote

"meaning we are deliberately perpetuating their suffering knowing that a percentage of them will always suffer."

Again, there is two independent things here. The existance of the "happy ones" and the existance of those that are so un happy that would want to cease to exist. The first doesnt affect the second. Those who dont want to exist can cease to exist if they want to.

Now they can say that if the happy ones continue existing and reproducing then there will be some new "Unhappy ones" that will have to pass through suffering until they decide to suicide. But that amount of suffering is supersmall compared with all the happiness. And also, if we dont bring a person into existance then this person cant even decide if exist or not. By making new people we are giving them the choice to exist or not for a very small risk of suffering briefly.

Its like for them 1 "unit" of suffering is more important than 1000 "units" of happiness and the choice to exist or not.

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lyremska t1_jbdke2q wrote

> The existance of the "happy ones" and the existance of those that are so un happy that would want to cease to exist. The first doesnt affect the second.

It does, if the existence of the happy ones relies on the suffering of the others - like it does in our world.

> Those who dont want to exist can cease to exist if they want to.

Which in turn will make other people suffer (family, closed ones etc).

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Gamusino2021 t1_jbf0glp wrote

Number 1 is totally true. But that doesnt mean we should make humans extinct, that means we should fight for justice.

Number second is not a valid argument, because yeah, that would make other people suffer, but making humans extinct would make them lot more suffer, so its not a valid argument to make humans extinct

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