Surur t1_j1v7x2q wrote on December 27, 2022 at 5:30 PM

Reply to comment by mocha_sweetheart in Driverless cars and electric cars being displayed as the pinnacle of future transportation engineering is just… wrong. Car-based infrastructure is inefficient, bad for the environment and we already have better technologies in other fields that could help more. An in depth analysis by mocha_sweetheart

> the exact same people are paying before and after

This is obviously not true. For one, building rail is much more expensive than building roads, and buses destroy roads much more than cars.

In addition, especially in Europe, PT is heavily subsidized while cars pay much more than they consume. Per user, rail users get 8x as many subsidies as car users.

Lastly, PT is much more likely than cars to be used by those on low income.

So, in reality, the people who pay for PT and the people who use it are not actually the "exact same people".

Idrialite t1_j1xfq9i wrote on December 28, 2022 at 2:49 AM

Poor people create rich people's wealth. The tax subsidies used for public transit may not come directly from poor bank accounts, but it is the result of their labor.

Surur t1_j1y88t8 wrote on December 28, 2022 at 7:22 AM

Sorry, Marx, we are talking about reality, not your communist manifesto.

Idrialite t1_j1zeqhk wrote on December 28, 2022 at 3:22 PM

Try running a multi-billion dollar business without janitors. Or cashiers. Or stockers. See how that goes in reality.

This isn't even entirely Marxist yet. I haven't stated an opinion on who should own the results of labor. But the labor of poor people is worth far more than they receive in income. It's just undeniable.

Surur t1_j1zj49u wrote on December 28, 2022 at 3:53 PM

> Try running a multi-billion dollar business without janitors. Or cashiers. Or stockers. See how that goes in reality.

There are probably plenty of businesses which run like that, especially with work from home these days.

And as automation increases, are you just going to attribute more of the revenue to the remaining workers, or will you admit the capital can create money without workers?