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rshorning t1_j2diqa2 wrote

Reply to comment by radioli in China hoping rocket that can send people to the moon will be ready to launch by 2027 by Saltedline

A robotic mission is a far cry from sending people to the Moon. It did not follow a similar sequence to an Apollo mission...but rather the Surveyor and Ranger missions. Don't get me wrong, these are impressive technical accomplishments, but there is a whole lot more to get done.

And claiming that China is going to establish a long term base may be a goal, but the technical accomplishments that need to be done is so immense that it boggles my mind to think of what will be needed. Apollo only had people staying on the Moon for three days. Anything longer than about two weeks is genuinely still in the "infancy" stage and you are fooling yourself if you think it is otherwise.

I admire the determination, but isn't it funny that I get so much hate simply by saying China isn't perfect?

I'll also say that CCTV is not really followed because it is propaganda and so biased against anybody but China that it is largely a joke outside of China. I would dare say it isn't credible as a news source other than to see what the official government position of the Chinese government and the Chinese Communist Party happens to be at any time.

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radioli t1_j2etrey wrote

What a mis-read. There is NO HATE, just frustration.

  1. In my past comments in this sub, I never said any word like "China (esp. in space industry) is perfect". They are just a fast but decent group of people catching up.
  2. I mentioned CCTV regardless of its propaganda, just to point out that the manned lunar program and moon base plan have been MADE PUBLIC FOR YEARS. And they have been hot topics in the science and tech circle as more details are disclosed. It is not anything "secret" like redditors always brag about. And anyone can find and follow TONS of Chinese sources about what the Chinese did and are going to do, from their gov, industry, academic institutions, space and tech enthusiasts and even social media, and check them out, IF ANYONE READS CHINESE. There is no need to hide or fake such huge space programs now. The more you read, the deeper you know, and the harder it is to fake. It is the lazy, arrogant and lying western media that make everyone blind from what is really happening in other countries. Political lens makes people stupid.
  3. It is true that in the coming decade, for China or other space power, getting human to stay on the moon for half a month is an enormously difficult goal. I didn't expect beyond that. After all, it is planned to be "short-term" or "mid-term" mission at best by 2035, 12 YEARS LATER FROM NOW. As planned their core base in the lunar south pole will come earlier than the manned landing (roughly 2030). It is way more about a series of plans than a cold-war style one-time show-off. Today's Chinese are not Soviet Russians, show-offs cannot please or feed these realistic people. 2030 is not so far away, we will see.
  4. So far China had never lost (or even significantly injured) any astronaut in her space programs. For the public this has become a norm. Space is always highly dangerous, but gov and the space industry has to manage risks, either high up to the space or down to the earth. I don't know where you could get an impression that China or any major space power could (or even need to) risk any astronaut's life just to ram for a cold-war style trophy.
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radioli t1_j2fcxwx wrote

You just made a WRONG ANALOGY you probably didn't know.

Surveyor was a series of flyby + orbiting + landing missions.

Ranger was a series of flyby + orbiting + crashing missions.

None of them brought sample back home. The first pile of lunar sample was brought by Apollo 11 astronauts. Chang'e 1, 2, 3 (2007, 2010, 2013) had probably done much more than the Surveyors and Rangers. After all, they are late-comers.

Chang'e 5 was a lunar sample return mission in 2020. It was a combo of 4 modules, a lander, an ascender, an orbiter and a returner. It worked like this:

  1. After reaching the lunar orbit, the lander+ascender seperated from the combo and landed on the surface.
  2. After collection the samples were carried by the ascender, which lifted off from the lander and docked with the orbiter+returner.
  3. The ascender transferred the samples to the returner in orbit and left.
  4. Then the orbiter+returner accelerated and returned.
  5. The returner seperated from the orbiter and landed on earth.
  6. The orbiter passed Sun-Earth L1 Lagrange point and then entered the lunar DRO for VLBI tests. It is still working in orbit now.

Step 1-5 was a robotic miniature of the sequence of Apollo 11 mission. It was surely not an equivalent, but enough as an experiment to develop the pattern of crewed missions and further lunar mining projects.

The information above are all in ENGLISH, as accessible as a few clicks on Wikipedia.

As currently disclosed, the 2030 lunar crewed mission won't need some behemoth like Saturn V, but two or more CZ5DY launches to dock a crewed ship, a lander and some boosters together in LEO. Then the combo will bring astronauts to the moon and return like Chang'e 5. There are still 8 years to get this plan done. And this is just part of the moon base project.

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