Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments

HollowVoices t1_j0yf7ye wrote

I firmly believe that complex intelligent life is INSANELY rare in the universe. Rarer than what the experts calculated. There are simply way too many factors that have to be exactly right to get to the point where we are. Other planets would need a somewhat similar set of events and requirements.

Goldilocks Zone, The right amount of iron/nickle in the core for a really strong magnetosphere, a stupid amount of water, plate tectonics to recycle the crust and prevent stagnation, a strong tide - which requires a large moon - (may or may not require a planetary collision), at least a few mass extinctions, and most importantly, millions of years of stability.

It's a tall order, and intelligent complex life on other planets may not require all of these, but they would definitely require the majority of these things.

We are a rarity, we should be treating our planet and each other much better than what we are.

55

boundegar t1_j0ygg41 wrote

Another thing I haven't seen mentioned: We spent almost all of our million years in the Stone Age. What if there are a dozen species we would recognize as "intelligent" sprinkled throughout the galaxy... and they're all hunter-gatherers?

24

Manarus t1_j0yh6lx wrote

Or due to distance we could only see the time when they were in the stone age or before

13

escaai t1_j0ys8ct wrote

I think Fermi's Paradox talks about this. It would mean that the other civilization started almost at the same time as us (50-80k years is literally a second in the grand scheme of things). If they're behind us, it would mean that we're the first, hence we won't mean anyone until we discover them. If they're first, we would see the domination of their galaxy (if it's close enough to us). The first one makes it even more unlikely added to the other necessary things for life to begin (2 simultaneous life forms starting).

1

boundegar t1_j110tid wrote

Well that's the way it is in Traveller - but that's TTRPG, not reality. All of the "Major Races" started colonizing the stars in about the same century, so that when they find each other, both sides are strong. That makes for a better game, but there's no reason it's likely to happen.

2

AnotherClicheName96 t1_j0yhd85 wrote

Billions of years of beauty and blind luck and yet we still fight over petty little things. Really wish world leaders would open their eyes to how miraculous it truly is that we get to be here.

14

FlunkStone t1_j0ykll6 wrote

Yet insanely rare can mean billions of planets that possibly have intelligent life. Universe is just too damn big.

9

Till_Complex t1_j0yo8h2 wrote

Other theories are fun and nice, but this is my most feasible guess.

99.99% of all life in the universe could be basic microbes and that's still much, much more than enough for several other space-faring lifeforms to exist.

5

HollowVoices t1_j0yonk5 wrote

I'm with you 100% on that. There's DEFINITELY life out there. It's just 99% or more are microorganisms, single celled dudes and their slightly more complex buddies.

3

r55r44 t1_j0yoqyk wrote

Yeah the problem is we have a sample size of 1 for intelligent life, so trying to guess (with any actual degree of confidence) how many other planets have it as well is impossible. Maybe one day we'll have a much better understanding of every scientific field and will be able to offer a decent explanation, but we're nowhere near that.

4

kyinfosec t1_j0yp02w wrote

I've read that our large moon intercepts many asteroids that would have stopped development and the same could be said that larger planets farther away planets like Jupiter and Saturn are also needed to keep asteroids away.

3

returnFutureVoid t1_j0yqv4l wrote

Don’t forget Jupiter with its size and huge gravitational pull. The asteroid belt also.

2

JimCon24 t1_j0yqs23 wrote

Depends, our concept of intelligence is extremely narrow, really we just base it on how good we are with tools and communication. There could be life out there that developed a completely different form of consciousness that we couldn't even recognize as life or intelligent.

3

HollowVoices t1_j0yui76 wrote

Honestly, the scariest thing to me when it comes to intelligent life in space, is an intelligent hive mind.

1

figl4567 t1_j10bw95 wrote

Hive mind civilizations would be amazing to study. I'm more scared of an galaxy devouring ai.

1

androk t1_j0ystbp wrote

Also, why would evolution necessarily push towards a truly intelligent species? Humans were pushed to something like 30 breeding pairs (people theorize) If they had died the earth would have a vastly biodiverse set of life, but no civilization.

2

MiamiMedStudent t1_j0ygwia wrote

You're looking at things with an earthly brain . Get rid of all the scientific facts because physics outside of our atmosphere is much different. So if you take your human created laws into that sphere you will be confused.

1

HollowVoices t1_j0yoapd wrote

Scientific facts, physics, and laws don't really change if you're a different planet... That stuff's constant, bro.

4

MiamiMedStudent t1_j196nk0 wrote

Actually thats completely wrong . Thats where metaphysics comes from. They noticed that in space the laws we know on earth aren't the same. I'm the dumbest guy but im sure that in space gravity changes. Therefore physics changes. Do you know what entropy is? How the fuck is there entropy with no gravity.

You're someone with a much better vocabulary then me id expect this to be low hanging fruit for you

https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn19429-laws-of-physics-may-change-across-the-universe/

Shoutout to the 3 idiots that upvoted you. Dont know how to disseminate information. Took 1 Google search

1

Wash_your_mouth t1_j0yqmlg wrote

Yes. When people say something like "of course there are aliens, there are trillions of starts out there" I always think trillions is a very very small amount for that argument.

1

CalligrapherDizzy201 t1_j0yrep2 wrote

Where’s this millions of years of stability you speak of?

1

HollowVoices t1_j0yuu2x wrote

It's been pretty stable these last 64 million years. Otherwise we wouldn't be here. No catastrophic solar flares/storms, no additional asteroids/comets, relatively quiet volcanic activity... Really all we've had to deal with since the dinos are the cyclic ice ages.

1

BigFatM8 t1_j0ysmca wrote

That's not a very open way to look at it though. What makes you so sure that an intelligent, complex species would need all those things at all? You can only say all that because your only sample is every species on earth.

1

HollowVoices t1_j0yuzkl wrote

Because so far, we're the only example we have. Could intelligent life exist elsewhere in the universe that didn't have all that we had? Sure. Entirely possible, but not super probable based on what we know/understand.

1

BigFatM8 t1_j0yx123 wrote

Understandable but does that really matter when we know so little?

It's like someone from an isolated Tribe saying it's not super probable to travel to the moon based on their info.

When we're talking about Space, we are probably even more clueless than that Tribe.

1

coffeebonez99 t1_j0zbhek wrote

btw I watched like 3 videos and am speaking from what I remember so please point out anything that I share if its wrong

the natural way solar systems form and then settle over time is extremely rhythmic, consistent, and repeated on a scale that is almost infinite to us

been watching lex Fridman and saw a podcast of him speaking to an astronomer, I can't find it now but I'll try to soon and link it. his name was Bork or Bjork I think, and he's a white dude with a stylish haircut if u look at thumbnails to find him

I'll try to explain what I remember and some is going to be wrong, watch it though it was really good: he speaks about how during the course of every solar system, it starts out chaotic. collisions every second. as it settles, and more collisions happen, more settling also happens. eventually, all the asteroids and comets form an oort cloud around the solar system. an insane amount of massive rocks and fragments that are all moving right beside eachother- give it long enough and they find their own orbit around the sun that is collisionless. ours hasn't settled long enough for these asteroids to have found their own collisionless and synchronous orbits, and you see this twice a year when earth passes through the taurid meteor stream- where Earth's circular orbit aligns with 2 points on the oval-shape orbit of these asteroids. nasa just bumped a threatening taurid meteor actually

basically what I'm getting at is that, it sounds like, every solar system, over time, settle and fall into a kind of golden age in terms of the "chaos" that is space, the perfect amount of chaos for life to begin and thrive. the sun being at a life supporting temperature + having a long life span remaining, the planets have accumulated much of the material debris vis their own gravity/moons, and the outer asteroid belt has also settled enough(still millions+ of collisions happening out there every second but is fairly contained in some way or another, and maybe even acts as a filter for catching the huge stray objects that can hit the inner planets)

just makes u wonder, how many times has earth really been wiped out by a meteor/floods caused by meteors and covered up with earth? if u watch Ancient Apocalypse on Netflix, it's amazing how far back civilizations go, so much further back than I realized- Egypt even is so much older than we thought. could be hundred thousand years+ that humans have been building huge cities and being wiped out

1