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moskowizzle t1_jchy0cf wrote

Reply to comment by staresatmaps in Victory! Minor League Baseball Players Are Finally Unionized. by theworkeragency

There are independent teams just a few miles outside of NYC. The veteran (i.e. highest paid) players make a few thousand a month and that's only in-season. I last worked for one of them back in 2009 and the veteran cap was $3000/month. I'm assuming it's gone up at least a bit since then, but it's not like they're making bank. Rookies made $800/month.

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staresatmaps t1_jci0n1b wrote

Because why would they pay more? They probably have zero fans that actually care if they win. Those leagues embrace the mickey mouse family event atmosphere. Look at the USL Championship in soccer. They pay more because they actually want to win and embrace fans that care. Those baseball teams are usually in little tiny towns with no people too.

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moskowizzle t1_jci332t wrote

I'm saying that these are teams in major metropolitan areas.

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staresatmaps t1_jci3hhn wrote

Give me an example?

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moskowizzle t1_jci3mtb wrote

New Jersey Jackals and Rockland Boulders. A little further out you have the Sussex County Miners.

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staresatmaps t1_jci4pqb wrote

They both play in a league with a tiny salary cap and wierd player rules trying to be farm teams in everything but name. I wonder how many fans they have? I bet they would get a lot more if they took themselves seriously.

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moskowizzle t1_jci4wie wrote

Jackals draw about 2000/game, but they're moving to a stadium that's about 2x the size of Yogi Berra Stadium.

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SmarterThanMyBoss t1_jci4cam wrote

Lookup the Frontier League. It's the only league I'm familiar with (I worked for a team that used to be in the league - but the team was in a small town and the league outgrew it). They have teams in the Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Chicago areas. Those are the only 3 teams I can think of off the top of my head. I'd guess the other teams are all near major markets or the main attractions in tertiary markets.

Independent baseball (and high-level college, wooden bat leagues) is awesome and well-supported by their local communities.

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staresatmaps t1_jci5g3v wrote

Do you think it could be bigger if they started paying players more and getting better players or fans just don't give a shit about that?

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SmarterThanMyBoss t1_jci7xww wrote

No. It's great for what it is but it will never compete to get "the best" players and honestly, except for the big time prospects (that are only hyped because the MLB fans are excited about the future), no one cares if you're a "2nd division" player or a "5th division" level player. They're all GREAT baseball players and it's fun to watch them play up close and personal. Independent ball has a niche where fans can get up close and personal. Stadiums are small (but often very nice and they host lots of tournaments for high schools and colleges) and attendance is low and you have access to players and coaches like you don't get at other levels.

I've seen or worked at all levels of baseball and there is something special about every level. The majors are a huge spectacle. The best players in the world trying to win the championship of the entire world. But they're also distant. You can't see them. You can't touch them. Many of them dislike you (check out comments many made about how great it was playing without fans or media during the covid year).

AA and AAA (and to a lesser extent A) are young guys trying to take that last step to a lifetime dream. Or veterans who are 1 injury away from getting back. The promos are more fun. The stadiums are smaller. The atmosphere is chill because no one knows who won the AAA championship last year except people who were in the stadium.

College Wooden bat, and Independent leagues are hit or miss but the good ones are great. The shitty ones are guys playing on community college fields with 43 fans but the good ones can get 2-8k fans. The promos and fan engagement is awesome. You can usually walk right up to the fence and get autographs. Players often don't have a tunnel, so they walk through the stands and get high fives from the kids. I worked for a team like this (medical) and just sat on the edge of the dugout. I'd get kids all the time that wanted so and sons autograph (or even mine which was weird since I'm just a fat guy with a team tee shirt) and I'd get it for them between innings. Some of our players went on the the majors. Most didn't. All of them were very very good college players and it was high level, fun baseball.

For what it's worth, I've been told by "baseball people" and from what I've seen have no reason to disagree, that in terms of quality of play, good Independent league ball is equivalent to being slightly below AA but definitely better than A. (Again, it varies greatly. I'm sure there are shitty leagues that are really bad. The Sugar Land Skeeters had Roger Clemons just a couple years after he last pitched in the majors and Tracy McGrady -very good baseball player- shortly after his NBA career).

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staresatmaps t1_jcj4ucb wrote

To be honest, this way of thinking is just so foreign to how I think. Maybe because I'm mainly a soccer fan. But soccer fans do not support minor league teams. Nobody will show up unless its an independent team. Even the biggest teams in the world, maybe a few dozen people are showing up for the reserve teams. I get the "entertainment" thing, but why would any serious fan care at all about a reserve team or a faux reserve team.

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