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[deleted] t1_itvsnxr wrote

Can anyone ELI5 how companies like Google and MS got so project bloated during the last decade? Felt like projects and staffing for the sake of it, not actually to fulfill actual user needs.

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GrinningPariah t1_itwa40u wrote

Hiring freezes and layoffs actually end up being counter-productive to curbing bloat.

If you're a mid-level manager and you know that the company goes through cycles of hiring freezes or layoffs, does that incentivize you to run a lean organization where you only have the engineers you need? Of course not, because everyone is going to be asked to cut back.

Instead, you're incentivized to hire as many people as you can when you can, specifically so that the cut backs aren't as painful when they come. If you're overstaffed, you can weather a hiring freeze and you can afford to lose some to layoffs.

But everyone else is doing the same math, and so everyone tries to be overstaffed, so the company ends up massively overstaffed, which forces leadership into more hiring freezes and layoffs because those are the only tools they have.

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[deleted] t1_itwdj0b wrote

Of course these companies rake in cash, but this, at big tech TC this defensive tactic seems so expensive and wasteful... but thanks to you comment, I realize that is isn't really the concern or dynamic.

In "tech hubs" this style of staffing has really disrupted our local economies in ways that have been harmful to communities and made civic systems unsustainable. This isn't a "get out, tech bro" complaint - but a systemic recognition. Seems so pointless.

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bigbadbruins92 t1_itvtv2u wrote

Product Managers are no longer afraid of pissing off engineers.

The engineers used to be able to push back, internally.

That, plus none of these companies having actual consumer technical support means the only feedback they get is from KPIs they define themselves. A lot of this crap is actually seen as successful endeavors...

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Destination_Centauri t1_itvznja wrote

F ' C K - B O S T O N !

G O - H A B S !

Sorry... sorry, couldn't help it.

But yes, I absolutely agree with your comment! Middle management is really destroying a lot of company reputations unfortunately, much to the dismay of the talented teams of engineers working below them.

Probably the best example of this tragedy: Boeing.

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coffeesippingbastard t1_itx0bws wrote

> Middle management is really destroying a lot of company reputations

I think this is inevitable for any large enough popular enough company.

SOOOOO many people in management consulting/finance who picked up some coding because "that's where the money is"

There is a non trivial amount of "influencer VCs" in social media.

Google/Meta will have to sort out their cultural cruft fast otherwise they'll go the way of IBM.

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tvtb t1_ity9gjw wrote

Google killed several projects that users enjoyed (eg. Reader) but they couldn’t find a way to monetize.

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