Submitted by Smilefriend t3_11cmza5 in worldnews
onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4ayk5 wrote
Reply to comment by thatsnotwait in Israelis and Palestinians meet for talks on how to de-escalate recent wave of attacks by Smilefriend
Israel has already made any concession that makes sense, including 5 different offers of sovereignty to the Palestinians. All refused in favor of violence.
The fact that redditors have an extremely short memory and are ignorant on the issue, does not mean Israelis forget this senseless and endless violence.
thatsnotwait t1_ja4c3g7 wrote
They're being refused by what is essentially a dictatorship, and none of the offers were particularly fair to begin with.
But yeah part of the issue is that there is no offer that "makes sense" to both sides. It doesn't make sense to Israel to vacate settlements they annexed decades ago, and it doesn't make sense for Palestine to become the only country since WW2 that accepts the legitimacy of losing territory by military conquest.
onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4czon wrote
> They're being refused by what is essentially a dictatorship, and none of the offers were particularly fair to begin with.
What dictatorship? I don't follow. Also the offers were extremely fair. The last one Olmert made was so good I doubt they will ever get anything even close to it.
Very stupid of their leaders, but you can always count on the Palestinian leaders to fuck up their people ever since the 30s.
> But yeah part of the issue is that there is no offer that "makes sense" to both sides. It doesn't make sense to Israel to vacate settlements they annexed decades ago, and it doesn't make sense for Palestine to become the only country since WW2 that accepts the legitimacy of losing territory by military conquest.
Israel has already agreed to dismantling settlements historically, as it actually did in the Gaza strip (And only got tens of thousands of rockets in return) and as it offered to do in many of the suggestions to the Palestinians. Again, your comment is factually not true.
Regarding the Palestinians losing territory: Hey buddy, you declare a genocidal total war attempting to (Actual quote) "Annihilate" the other side? Better be prepared for a total lose as well.
The Palestinians are extremely lucky that Israel is not even 1% as cruel as their leaders, or there would be exactly 0 Palestinians in the WB and Gaza ever since 67.
[deleted] t1_ja4vcms wrote
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onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4vt57 wrote
Yes, there are. You try and declare your intentions to murder someone and engage in an armed conflict with him, you lose, you are lucky to be alive. It's not that hard logic to follow.
LargeSubject8 t1_ja4wsp9 wrote
You’re talking about wiping an entire people off the planet. There is no excuse or justification for that.
onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4xee3 wrote
............... 🤦♂️
"Wiping entire people off the planet" Was factually the Palestinian leaders goal, still is by the way.
I said, that Israel is clearly not interested in such barbaric things, as it factually could do it military wise.
Are you even paying attention? Or just looking for reasons to hate me?
[deleted] t1_ja4ymhr wrote
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yaniv297 t1_ja5evcq wrote
You know if Israel actually wanted to annhalite Palestinians, they could have done it in about an hour, right?
That guy you're talking with is absolutely right, Israel were far from perfect at times but they were never ever genocidal. While a genocide is the stated intention of Palestinian leadership even today.
yaniv297 t1_ja5hg0h wrote
> it doesn't make sense for Palestine to become the only country since WW2 that accepts the legitimacy of losing territory by military conquest.
First of all, Palestinians never had a country or official territory to begin with. Some of the Israeli offers were very fair in the circumstances.
You say it "doesn't make sense" to accept the loss - why? What's the alternative, what's the Palestinian end game, to win the war and conquer Israel? Israel have one of the world's best and most modern armies, state of art intelligence that knows everything in Gaza strip, a top class airforce, the Mossad, Shin Bet, etc. Plus Israel have the USA on its side, and they have nukes.
So option one: keep fighting this truly hopeless fight hoping for some miraclous win, while living in povetry and hundreds of innocents on both sides die.
Option two - accept defeat and a peace deal, build a country that's smaller than you wanted. The world will celebrate this unlikely peace - A truly peaceful Palestinian country will be immediately beloved worldwide and will be showered with donations. Palestinians have often worked in Israel and with Israelis. Over time, if true peace holds, the new country can benefit greatly from Israel's riches, jobs and technologies.
But according to you, option two "doesn't make sense", because, well... Why?
Ahneg t1_ja64omf wrote
Offering up nothing more then my personal opinion here I believe that if the Palestinians choose peace and play their cards right they could be enormously economically successful. I’ve never been but from what I hear about Gaza and their climate and beaches the place could be another Monte Carlo, and the religious tourism in the West Bank would be off the charts, if people felt safe.
yaniv297 t1_ja6ywky wrote
Yeah well, the Tel Aviv beaches are gorgeous and the Gaza coastline is the continuation of them. With all the "publicity" of the conflict, a peaceful solution would be historic world news and will cause a huge financial bloom. There's so much potential to make Gaza truly a beautiful thing. Sadly, the population there is not very educated (lack universities, etc), but this can change with times.
dmastra97 t1_ja7ds7y wrote
I guess you have to put yourselves in their shoes. If part of your country was taken over would you just accept it?
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