Doctor_Box
Doctor_Box t1_j20sx2j wrote
Reply to comment by HermitAndHound in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
It's really unfortunate how animal agriculture takes over terms like "protein" and now "regenerative farming". We have more choices than the two you have laid out. It's not only a choice between farm animals or destructive intensive monocropping (which we already do to feed animals now btw).
First look at the macro. The majority (more than 50%) of cropland is used for feeding animals so by taking them out of the equation we have freed up a ton of land and possibilities. Once we no longer have such a high requirement on crops grown we can look at changing how we grow them.
Now ignore what cows are to you for a second and just think about what they do for the soil. They are eating whatever is growing there processing it, using a huge amount of those nutrients to grow, and depositing the rest on the ground as fertilizer. It's an open loop system where the majority of nutrients go to the cow then the cow is carried off the farm to be killed and eaten and those nutrients never return to the land that grew the cow.
Instead we can look at composting, crop rotation, letting land go fallow and other farming practices to keep the nutrients on site. These include no till farming where we minimize the soil disturbance and keep it healthier and intercropping where multiple crops are grown at once in a way that support each other and balance the nutrient requirement in the soil.
Finally in a alternate universe, that I want to stress does not actually exist, where we have to have cows and sheep in the field to maximize the productivity of that field during fallow years then we could treat those animals like service dogs now. We let them live out their lives doing what they do for the soil, but we do not have to kill them every year and breed new cows and sheep to take their place. Cows live for 20-25 years. We would need a tiny number of animals to accomplish that task. If we kept to the bare minimum number of animals for keeping the soil healthy we would effectively have a vegan population because there would be so few of them.
Doctor_Box t1_j1wpmx9 wrote
Reply to comment by snowmannn in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
Unless you're Amish and using Oxen to plough the fields today this argument does not hold water. Farming can and has modernized and changed over time. Having this romantic nostalgia for culture, tradition, or the way things were is not a good reason to continue harming and exploiting animals.
If cutting throats of animals at a fraction of their lifespans is integral to your way of life then it's time to change.
Doctor_Box t1_j1uim5x wrote
Reply to comment by snowmannn in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
>I think and hope there will always be a market for locally raised sustainable livestock.
Why, once there is a lab grown perfect alternative, would you still hope there are locally raised animals getting their throats cut?
Doctor_Box t1_j1tycv9 wrote
Reply to comment by HermitAndHound in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
>But not keeping animals would be wasting an opportunity. They can turn stuff that we can't eat into something we can while producing fertilizer and doing chores around the farm.
That's why I only eat dogs and cats. No need to support factory farming when I can eat locally from my back yard. I live in the city and can't have chickens so I raise dogs for meat and while they're growing they work for me and do things like get me a beer from the fridge. A mutually beneficial relationship for the 8-12 months I let them live.
There's also a great option for those stuck in apartments. You can order online from a great family owned business! https://www.elwooddogmeat.com/
I'm also looking to get the laws changed so we can eat humans who naturally pass away. I would hate to waste an opportunity!
Doctor_Box t1_j1telyy wrote
Reply to comment by Tuggerfub in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
Where do the cows, pigs, and chickens get what they need then? Everything you need comes from plants (except for B12 which is bacteria).
We are omnivorous I agree, but that only tells you what you can eat and not what you have to eat. There are plenty of people thriving on a plant based diet.
Doctor_Box t1_j1svyis wrote
Reply to comment by boynamedsue8 in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
I'm not sure what radical changes you made to your diet but meat is not really required and heme iron has some other detrimental effects. I can't argue with your specific case but if you are interested in trying again here are some resources.
Vegan society recommendation: Good plant sources of iron include lentils, chickpeas, beans, tofu, cashew nuts, chia seeds, ground linseed, hemp seeds, pumpkin seeds, kale, dried apricots and figs, raisins, quinoa and fortified breakfast cereal.
A pro tip is to add citrus or a vitamin c source to your meal to help with absorption and avoid caffeine around the meal which can decrease absorption.
Doctor_Box t1_j1sqzqd wrote
Reply to comment by atrophy1999 in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
Why would you replace meat with a single plant source? The point is we can free up so much agricultural land you can grow a variety of plants and still not use as much land (or fertilizer) as what is currently used growing food for cows, pigs, and chickens.
Also nutrient density makes no sense when comparing plants to meat. Plants are generally more nutrient dense but less calorie dense. Maybe calorie density is what you mean, but considering the obesity epidemic I don't think calories are an issue for most people in first world countries.
Doctor_Box t1_j1sq1dk wrote
Reply to comment by boynamedsue8 in Soaring fertilizer prices could see millions more undernourished by Vucea
Anemia is an iron issue. Plenty of plant sources there. As for protein, all plants have all the essential amino acids in varying amounts. As long as you're eating a variety of plants(not highly processed refined stuff) and getting enough calories, you're getting enough protein. Otherwise focus on beans, lentils, legumes, nuts and seeds for maximum protein. There are also things like Seitan made from wheat that is 75% protein by weight.
Doctor_Box t1_j1s80f7 wrote
The majority of crops are being grown to feed animals. We could easily skip the middleman and just eat plants which would vastly cut down the amount of crops we would need to grow.
Doctor_Box t1_ixowpx6 wrote
Reply to Palaeolithic hunter-gatherers used culinary seasoning in food preparation, according to analysis of the oldest charred food remains ever found by marketrent
The paleo anti plant crowd is in shambles.
Doctor_Box t1_jckdanp wrote
Reply to Global fresh water demand will outstrip supply by 40% by 2030, say experts by filosoful
Animal agriculture is hugely wasteful and resource intensive. Luckily lab grown meat and precision fermentation is coming online to hopefully mitigate a lot of the damage since people cannot be bothered to change habits.