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Agent-Quinn t1_j2rpkuw wrote

Agreed. Boycott Turnpike until its made affordable.

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courageous_liquid t1_j2s2hph wrote

...oh boy, wait till you learn how unaffordable the giant network of roads in PennDOT ROW are.

Roads are expensive as fuck but nobody knows/cares because it comes out of the gas tax.

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Lawyerdogg t1_j2upbg7 wrote

It's all these welfare queens living out in the middle of nowhere. Us upstanding metropolitans have to foot the bill for all the 4 wheel drive dickheads who live on a 5 mile road with one house.

Roads aren't that expensive. The guys that bid on the work inflate their price by like 300%. They use shit quality materials and stretch everything out as much as they can. Then you have tolls, obviously not going towards roads or bridges. Taxes, wars for oil, emminent domain and subsidies all go towards keeping wages down, healthcare high and unions obsolete. There's just no more money after that to fix the roads.

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courageous_liquid t1_j2urevb wrote

Just some very minor disagreements -

>They use shit quality materials and stretch everything out as much as they can.

Partially true, the aggregate mix is typically specced out in the RFP and can't really be deviated from but the contractor will do everything they can to bend on that.

>Then you have tolls, obviously not going towards roads or bridges.

Again, partially true, turnpike tolls go to a lot of things that aren't roads or bridges (ITS projects, SEPTA until the lawsuit) but the turnpike on average does a pretty decent job at road maintenance.

>It's all these welfare queens living out in the middle of nowhere. Us upstanding metropolitans have to foot the bill for all the 4 wheel drive dickheads who live on a 5 mile road with one house.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not but unironically yes, a thousand times yes. AADT of like 35 and gets repaved every 4 years vs. 100k AADTs that are basically pothole centrals. Unreal.

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MRG_1977 t1_j2uysm0 wrote

PA Turnpike is the most expensive single toll road (not crossing a bridge) in the world end to end and yes it is poorly paved compared to other toll roads in the Midwest and Northeast.

Portions of 95 that are tolled around NYC are in worse shape as well as several toll roads around Chicago. Not many others though.

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NEBook_Worm t1_j3cuzmw wrote

Because the state extorts money from the turnpike and gives it to PENNDOT.

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NEBook_Worm t1_j3cuulz wrote

Yeah, totally no one on welfare in the cities. Sure buddy.

In reality, it's the city transit systems taking money from PENNDOT and the state extorting the turnpike to get it back.

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Lawyerdogg t1_j3ddzu2 wrote

No, it's mostly republican rednecks using up all the taxes and encouraging people to be morons. Stupid people like to pay taxes.

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NEBook_Worm t1_j3ecjqj wrote

Yeah, big cities totally don't have huge welfare districts.

Oh...wait.

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TheUltimateSalesman t1_j2s0fk0 wrote

Why don't they just raise the taxes/tolls on trucks, or better yet, trucks whose destination isn't PA.

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Agent-Quinn t1_j2s0udc wrote

That would target large businesses, corporations and the wealthy whom are sending these trucks around Better have a regressive tax on the working class. Remember these large trucks and trailers destroy roads quickly due to weight. They should be paying 90% of the operational costs.

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TheUltimateSalesman t1_j2s2q08 wrote

>Remember these large trucks and trailers destroy roads quickly due to weight

exactly.

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Finrodsrod t1_j2sg3dc wrote

> That would target large businesses, corporations and the wealthy whom are sending these trucks

Can't have that! I am a temporarily embarrassed millionaire. How dare you suggest my future taxes to go up!?

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IamSauerKraut t1_j2tbbgd wrote

Why? Beccause of a law passed by the legis which requires to PTC to do things in a certain way, including handing large chunks of the proceeds of tolls to PA north of I-80 for road projects.

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NEBook_Worm t1_j3cv6cl wrote

Exactly.

No one talks about the state extorting the turnpike commission.

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jralll234 t1_j2sbjjn wrote

How would you implement taxing vehicles that aren’t destined for PA?

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31spiders t1_j2sodl1 wrote

Semi’s you mean? Their log book has destinations for all deliveries.

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jralll234 t1_j2suoad wrote

So you’re going to demand to see every log book? I don’t know seems cumbersome as hell. Plus the feds aren’t going to like that for vehicles traveling on federally funded interstates, and someone could make constitutional arguments against it as well.

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31spiders t1_j2sw50i wrote

Well they’re also going to file the toll roads on their taxes. You COULD just inspect the ones getting off certain exits that are expected to be interstate travel 1st, last and whatever is closest to MD/DE. There’s multiple avenues to this, don’t act like it’s impossible.

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jralll234 t1_j2t6zb8 wrote

I’m pretty sure the constitution guarantees interstate travel, so it would get shot-down on that, but also, if PA were to start this, surrounding states would do the same as retribution. It’s a horrible idea.

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whomp1970 t1_j2xn396 wrote

> So you’re going to demand to see every log book?

This already happens with fuel taxes, and has been this way for 20+ years.

If you buy 200 gallons in New York, and drive all the way to, say, Illinois, the fuel tax is divvied up between all the states you pass through.

See: IFTA

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WikiSummarizerBot t1_j2xn513 wrote

International Fuel Tax Agreement

>The International Fuel Tax Agreement (or IFTA) is an agreement between the lower 48 states of the United States and the Canadian provinces, to simplify the reporting of fuel use by motor carriers that operate in more than one jurisdiction. Alaska, Hawaii, and the Canadian territories are not required to participate, however all of Canada and Alaska do. An operating carrier with IFTA receives an IFTA license and two decals for each qualifying vehicle it operates. The carrier files a quarterly fuel tax report.

^([ )^(F.A.Q)^( | )^(Opt Out)^( | )^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)^( | )^(GitHub)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)

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IamSauerKraut t1_j2tbhus wrote

Cripes... they cant even keep the weight stations open on a regular basis. And TT's go by them without stopping all the time.

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31spiders t1_j2tq8k9 wrote

I have one by my house that ALWAYS has a state patrolman stationed at (it’s not a weight station it’s a grade warning/runaway truck ramp deal but required to stop and they enforce that). Weigh stations might be different idk believe me though if Pennsylvania taxes it….they WILL get that money.

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IamSauerKraut t1_j2wv6se wrote

Based on what I saw during a recent road trip, PSP needs to do more enforcement as to TT's.

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NEBook_Worm t1_j3cv2ok wrote

Sure, let's pass more costs on to consumers. They can afford it.

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TheUltimateSalesman t1_j3cx5tt wrote

So you think it makes more sense to make non-commercial users of the turnpike pay? And not the trucks that cause the roadway to fall apart?

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NEBook_Worm t1_j3czd71 wrote

It makes sense to stop the state extorting money from the turnpike commission. Then take away the tolls completely, because the damn road is finished.

0

[deleted] t1_j2s8f14 wrote

It never will be. The maintenance costs are massive, it's been plagued by induced demand from the start, and the most frequent travelers will keep using it because time is money for truckers and business travelers.

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Modestkilla t1_j2srygl wrote

I might, it is up to $12.60 a day for me to get to work and back. It’s not like I’m driving into freaking New York City, it’s really insane.

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NEBook_Worm t1_j3cunge wrote

Blame the state for extorting money from the turnpike.

1