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SawkyScribe OP t1_j6n8p4y wrote

Reply to comment by boxer_dogs_dance in Cruise Ship Blues has given me a new fear by SawkyScribe

I think for me, as much as there are issues with all forms of travel, I think those problems are amplied by the compactness of the ship.

People are hooking up in hotels yeah, but on land you have a much wider pool of people so rates of transmission are probably lower. Better access to appropriate healthcare after the fact is also available on land.

On the same topic, there's also the unique challenge of sexual assaults on board. >!Most cases were reported to be crewmates assaulting passengers as the relaxed atmosphere causes people to drop their guard. In the instances where there are rapes, it's hard to persecute because the quality of evidence rapily decays before than can reach land. Then when they hit land, they can again use flags of convenience so that their staff can't be persecuted under X country's legal board.!<

As for price, I can't speak to this personally, but I've read of people racking up massive bills due to misunderstandings of what can be considered "an all inclusive vacation". Some of that is consumer responsibility, but I'm sure cruises don't go out of their way to communicate costs to consumers.

With the labor situation, again the issue is the unique environment compounds on existing issues. 6 people sleeping in a cabin made for 1 with no ability to inform labor authorities of malpractice for weeks on end. It's not like it's ok when resorts do it either.

The accessibility angle is one I hadn't considered before. I am glad to hear that more people can enjoy more experiences due to cruise liners.

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boxer_dogs_dance t1_j6nagwz wrote

I am very happy to learn more and correct my practice where there are issues. Life is complicated but I boycotted and protested against South Africa back in the day and try to not actively collaborate with injustice.

As for boats, I like them and my grandfather served in submarines.

On my limited cruise experience, mask use is varied. There are signs warning about hand washing and specific signs instructing people to use a paper towel to touch the door to the bathrooms.

As for price, in my experience, all rules are disclosed ahead of time, but much like Casino resorts, if you get drunk and make a poor decision, there is no sympathy from the company.

Thank you for promoting the book.

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Hartastic t1_j6ocmwv wrote

> On the same topic, there's also the unique challenge of sexual assaults on board.

This is also a lot different than 30 years ago. There's basically no public area of a modern ship not covered 24/7 by security cameras.

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SawkyScribe OP t1_j6osk0e wrote

The issue is cameras don't magically fix the issue.

I think an environment that's constantly splashing drinks leads to cases of dubious consent. You see two people share a drink at a bar and then head to a cabin and the thread of evidence ends there, none of the conversation involving revoked consent is captured.

Few convictions lead to persecutions. Again, if it's bad on land, I think it's worse on a boat with fewer third parties to assist.

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Hartastic t1_j6osyj1 wrote

> You see two people share a drink at a bar and then head to a cabin and the thread of evidence ends there, none of the conversation involving revoked consent is captured.

Sure, but if they're crew they're already someplace they're not allowed to be and will lose their job for.

And there's no way to deny most of what happened.

This doesn't mean crime is impossible but being a serial rapist crew member is basically impossible. Kind of the same way murders still happen but you don't have the serial killers with 50 victims of our grandparents time because forensics are so much better than they used to be.

> Few convictions lead to persecutions.

Note that your source is, basically, the closest cruise ship equivalent of ambulance chasers. Not that some of what they're saying isn't correct but take it with a grain of salt.

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SawkyScribe OP t1_j6ow7fv wrote

It is a firm representing the victims but it's not like the cruise liners themselves will be upront with the statistics.

>They'll lose their job

That's an issue I came across in this article. Cruise liners can very easily say "he's not a sex pest, he just violated company policy".

You're right that you probably won't get repeat offenders due to CCTV, but the environment of 24 hour good vibes and festivities reminds me too much of college campuses which don't have an amazing track record for sexual offenses. I can only imagine how much of this stuff goes unreported on ships for fear of retaliation.

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Hartastic t1_j6ox20o wrote

I definitely feel like you have this idea in your head of what a cruise is like that is not that close to what it is actually like. Outside of a tiny subset, a spring break atmosphere it is not.

Generally it's closer to a week at a resort hotel that people bring their kids to.

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