Darkassassin07 t1_ixhw79q wrote
Reply to comment by rededelk in Giving ambulances, fire trucks priority at traffic lights could cut their travel times, Winnipeg study says by Mutte_Haede
That's the law up here too. Unfortunately people are unable to be immediately aware of every change in their surroundings the moment it happens, especially changes that happen behind them at speed. This makes it take some time for traffic to recognize an emergency vehicle and react to it.
You can't just blast through an intersection that has green lights for crossing traffic just because you have lights and sirens on though. You still have to drastically slow down if not stop completely, ensure traffic actually sees you and stops, then proceed. (how cautious varies from police department to police department, as well as far more care taken by EMTs) A vehicle comming at you at speed from an unexpected direction isn't necessarily going to be seen just because it has some extra lights on it. It helps, but it's not enough. People passing through a green intersection aren't really looking for traffic suddenly racing out of the already stopped lines of traffic to their sides.
Everyone's attention at an intersection is already on the traffic lights: If the lights can detect on comming emergency vehicles and automatically flip red for cross traffic and green for through traffic; the intersecrion is made safe to pass through much quicker without having to wait+check for cross traffic to recognize an emergency vehicle and stop. This system is already common in many larger cities throughout North America.
BlooperHero t1_ixlakcs wrote
>(how cautious varies from police department to police department, as well as far more care taken by EMTs)
In my experience police cars will turn on their sirens as they enter an intersection without slowing down at all, even though they didn't have them on in the first place any immediately turn them off afterwards, because they think that's legal and if it's legal there's no reason not to do it. Kind of surprising I've never seen one get T-boned.
Also in my experience ambulances do not do that.
nowhereman1223 t1_ixi24s8 wrote
Pretty sure if you can't be reasonably aware of what is going on around you (including behind you) then you should not be driving.
No they shouldn't be "instantly" aware. But if you are operating a 2+ton blunt weapon you should know what is around you.
Darkassassin07 t1_ixi5btb wrote
I never said people aren't reasonably aware of what's going on around them. Just that changes in your environment take time to recognize and react to.
My point is just because you've turned your lights and sirens on, doesn't mean you can drive however you like and expect everyone to be aware and out of your way immediately. It takes a short while for people to recognize your presence, and longer still for them to think through what exactly to do about it and perform that action. We don't live in a world of robots. People take time to react to change.
If you're at or approaching a traffic light with cross traffic passing through it, you can't just expect to flip your lights on and stomp on the throttle. You're going to get t-boned. You may have had your lights and sirens on for a while as you headed towards this intersection, but you are just entering this particular flow of cross traffic. They have not had time to even realize you're there let alone react to your presence.
Traffic lights that react to oncoming emergency vehicles though would inform drivers to stop before the emergency vehicle even approaches the intersection. You're no longer relying on lots of people to switch their attention and change their behaviour, just keep following the lights they were already focused on.
nowhereman1223 t1_ixi6m5o wrote
>My point is just because you've turned your lights and sirens on, doesn't mean you can drive however you like and expect everyone to be aware and out of your way immediately. It takes a short while for people to recognize your presence, and longer still for them to think through what exactly to do about it and perform that action. We don't live in a world of robots. People take time to react to change.
Who said they would flip the lights on at the last minute and mash the throttle?
I'm referring to an emergency vehicle coming up to the intersection with the lights and siren on.
And yes people can be expected to see and react to this within 10-30 seconds. If they can't then they should not be driving as the damage they could do in 10-30 seconds is incredible.
Darkassassin07 t1_ixi7dss wrote
The paragraph immediately after the one you quoted addressed this. I'm done with this conversation. It's going in circles.
nowhereman1223 t1_ixi968c wrote
It is going in circles because your arguments don't make sense and stem from the premise that Drivers don't need to pay attention because they can't and Emergency vehicles flip lights on and mash the throttle once they reach an intersection.
Both are wrong.
Darkassassin07 t1_ixic0se wrote
>Drivers don't need to pay attention because they can't
Not at all what I said, intended, or implied. Words you've chosen to put in my mouth.
For the 3rd time: people have reaction times. It takes time for people to notice, process, and react to changes in their environments.
Never said people don't react to changes. Never said people don't see changes. Didn't even say peoples reaction times are enormously long. Just that they exist, vary, and have to be factored in.
>Emergency vehicles flip lights on and mash the throttle once they reach an intersection.
A singular extreme example amongst many far more reasonable examples, specifically to demonstrate providing 0 time for people around you to react. It doesn't happen in the real world because, as I mentioned above, you'd get t-boned for it. Obviously you have to take more care than that.
BlooperHero t1_ixl9mso wrote
>Emergency vehicles flip lights on and mash the throttle once they reach an intersection.
Police cards do that all the time. And then turn off the lights after, because there was never an emergency they just didn't feel like obeying traffic laws right then.
BlooperHero t1_ixl9o4e wrote
>I'm referring to an emergency vehicle coming up to the intersection with the lights and siren on.
If you're approaching the intersection, drivers on the perpendicular road can't see or hear you at all yet. You're not on the same road. They can't react until after you get there.
Mitthrawnuruo t1_ixjdvbw wrote
You’re right, but most people shouldn’t be driving.
nowhereman1223 t1_iy80v85 wrote
and that is my point.
BlooperHero t1_ixl9oe4 wrote
Emergency vehicles approaching intersections in stopped lanes are often not visible to approaching from the other direction because there are other vehicles (not to mention buildings) in the way. They have to be at the intersection to be seen.
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