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YIMBYYay t1_jai283c wrote

The city is currently parking ambulances and dump trucks on millions of dollars worth of Strip District property. How about start with the low hanging fruit and relocate that, and use the process from selling the land towards the training facility?

And $120 million!? Are they building a skyscraper?

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LostEnroute OP t1_jaicrex wrote

How about we use the campus for everything but the Cop Lair? That sounds cheaper and more impactful to City services. That Strip District car prison needs to get back on the tax roll ASAP.

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Excelius t1_jaic7r6 wrote

> The city is currently parking ambulances and dump trucks on millions of dollars worth of Strip District property.

I think that was part of the original plan for the site, though from the City Paper article it sounds like that may have been one of the items that got cut due to the cost inflation.

https://pittsburghpa.gov/press-releases/press-releases/5397 > The project will save millions of taxpayer dollars currently spent on leases by relocating public safety operations and public works storage from around the city to the campus. The City plans to bring Emergency Medical Services headquarters from Shadyside, Police Headquarters from Chateau, Police Training Academy from Allegheny West and the vehicle repair shop from the Strip District. The plan also includes building an indoor firing range on the campus to move it from its current location in the Highland Park neighborhood. Locations that will be vacated that the City currently owns can be sold to be put back on the tax rolls and redeveloped to benefit neighborhoods.

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Excelius t1_jaj75ef wrote

> And $120 million!?

I'd be really curious to see a detailed breakdown of where the costs are expected to go.

I'm actually wondering if the city might have gotten itself into a bad deal with the free land from the Federal government.

As far as I can tell the original buildings were all left in tact, which probably means the city is on the hook for the demolition costs. That could easily run into the millions of dollars before even talking about building anything new. And those buildings are old enough that I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if they were filled with asbestos.

According to the City of Pittsburgh press release when the land was acquired, the facilities would be required to be "net zero" under 2019 city legislation, requiring them to produce as much green energy as they consume. Which sounds nice in theory, but undoubtedly adds substantially to the up front cost, unless they can get some state or federal grants to foot the bill.

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YIMBYYay t1_jamyabf wrote

I think that you’re onto something. Asbestos mitigation and demolition alone will be very expensive. And construction costs are up nearly 30% since 2020, so that’s a lot of it.

Also, the city put themselves in a bind with the net zero requirement. It’s one of those things that sounds good but is in fact prohibitively expensive to execute and, frankly, overkill in green building. It’s just another example of the city having outside organizations (GBA for example) and activists craft policy.

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Excelius t1_jan35ui wrote

The original press release also noted that the site would include stormwater runoff mitigation measures, since this property is within the drainage area of Washington Blvd with it's flooding issues.

I imagine that retention ponds or whatever probably aren't nearly as expensive as net-zero energy requirements, but it's an added expense none the less. I would argue that's a bit more practical with immediate local benefit, than trying to tie this project in with solving bigger far more complex issues around climate change.

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mmphoto412 t1_jaic50x wrote

Why, the city already owns that property. What would be the point in needlessly moving it?

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Excelius t1_jaigl6s wrote

Strip district is prime real estate now. Could probably sell the land for a few million to a developer that will put it back on the tax rolls, and then move those operations to a less expensive area.

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mmphoto412 t1_jaih1t5 wrote

I understand that point of view. However the city in the past seems to have a habit of selling valuable real-estate far below market value to someone who is politically connected.

Also, by the time the city buys land and builds another facility, they would likely spend more than whatever was made by selling the property.

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Excelius t1_jaiibs0 wrote

> Also, by the time the city buys land and builds another facility, they would likely spend more than whatever was made by selling the property.

The city doesn't have to buy land. This site is the former Veterans Administration hospital campus and the federal government gave the land to the city for free.

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mmphoto412 t1_jaijil1 wrote

They scrapped plans to do this, and to make it exclusively a cop playground. Meaning this property is no longer available for this. Someone posted this elsewhere in the thread.

Nonetheless, they would likely spend more on a replacement then whatever they would make on a real estate sale.

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Excelius t1_jaila52 wrote

The land already belongs to the city, it was transferred in 2020.

They city may have scaled back their initial ambitions for the site given the ballooning costs, but the land will still be there and could be further built out at a later date. Assuming they didn't expand the scope of the police training center to include the portion of the land that would have been used for vehicle maintenance and storage.

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OnyxFiskar t1_jajbnim wrote

Part of the stipulation of the federal govt selling the VA hospital and all the facilities was that the city HAS to use it for public safety. They legally are not allowed to use that property for any other purchase. The cost of relocating all of those operations from the strip would dwarf the revenue from what they would recouperate from selling the land and the added tax revenue. Its not even close.

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Excelius t1_jajeq99 wrote

> The cost of relocating all of those operations from the strip would dwarf the revenue from what they would recouperate from selling the land and the added tax revenue. Its not even close.

Certainly, I wasn't imagining those things would somehow recoup the entire cost, merely offset it.

Apparently not all of the existing operations are on city owned property, in their press release the city claimed that the move would "allow the City to save millions of taxpayer dollars on leases of private properties used by the Department of Public Safety and to move key City-owned properties and parcels back onto tax rolls".

It didn't specify which operations were on city owned properties, and which are on leased properties, nor the time horizon that the "millions in savings" might be realized.

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