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crua9 t1_j6xh5er wrote

So here is the thing. There was a report on the news a week ago about how there was a ton of nurses that didn't go to school. They used a degree mill to make it look like they went to school.

Then during it, the people in charge of doing the national test (which you need to do in order to be license. There is no way around this but to be legit licensed) brag about how only about 30% of them passed the test and how this proves how hard it is to be a nurse.

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But what that told me is the restrictions of having them go to school is too high as is and the system is built on pure BS.

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Carl_The_Sagan t1_j6yh9gy wrote

Why is that your conclusion? Don’t you want your relatives cared for by someone who is educated in the field?

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crua9 t1_j6yiv4r wrote

Can they do the job yes or no?

What was said in this report is there was 0 evidence of anyone that got bad treatment.

Anyways, I think in the future when we get humanoid robots we will be able to use them for basic medical. Maybe even make it where a robot or more advanced AI can remote in.

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Carl_The_Sagan t1_j6yot42 wrote

It’s very hard to loop in one person into bad outcomes in a hospital system with team based care. These systems are very good at obscuring and limiting liability. I personally am not thrilled about people faking credentials who are direct responsibility for others health.

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crua9 t1_j6ytto1 wrote

Keep in mind they are only faking the degree. They still have to be license. This is a separate thing and can't be faked. Without this, the person legally can't be a nurse.

I'm not saying training is bad. I just know how back logged nurse schools are and nursing degrees go way beyond medical like any other degree like I couldn't give a flying f if my nurse took art class or world religion. So it comes back down to. Can they do the job yes or no

Any case, it is likely in a number of years this won't be a problem with robotics

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em_goldman t1_j6zs1ws wrote

I’m a doctor who works with a ton of nurses -

  1. It’s a vocation that needs to be taught from a human, to a human, mostly in the setting that the work will be done.

  2. It’s important to have a basic understanding of medicine to be a nurse so you don’t accidentally kill someone when something happens out-of-the-algorithm.

Example: someone with too high of a blood sugar needs insulin. So if they’re in a state called diabetic ketoacidosis, they have an incredibly high blood sugar, so you’d think the first step is insulin, right? But insulin causes potassium to move into cells, and people’s total body potassium is super low in DKA because it’s getting peed out, despite their potassium blood levels looking fine. So if you push insulin, you’re going to cause all the potassium to shift into the cells, which can give someone a heart attack.

You can (and do) train people to memorize algorithms like “potassium and fluids, then insulin.” But I want the nurses who work with me to be their own smart, critically thinking, educated selves - it’s safer, it’s more rewarding, and your team gives better care.

  1. Most schools nowadays, for anything, are outdated and largely bullshit. My medical classroom schooling from my school was disorganized and useless. I learned the material using 3rd-party online resources and Anki. My in-person training is what matters the most.
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crua9 t1_j70o455 wrote

Based on 3, I'm assuming you are agreeing with me that it is pure BS. The hands on is needed. But forcing them to take stupid things like art or whatever that has nothing to do with the job is BS money making crap with the excuse of "well rounded".

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As far as your first part. IDK if AI should teach doctors yet. Like eventually I think robots will have to be good enough for the basics. I imagine at some point, any humanoid robot you have in your house will double as bottom level medical care. Like they are good for finding if there is a problem, dealing with cuts, and so on. Not so much with fixing a broken bone or whatever.

But at some point it will have to be better and adapt. I don't think we are anywhere near this.

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Anyways, I can see at some point nurses and doctors being complete replaced by robots in many areas. Like there is 2 options.

Option 1: Many hospitals, homes, etc will have humanoid robot. A human doctor can remote in through the robot and control it, feel, hear, etc as if the doctor is there. Maybe even smell depending on if the hardware allows for it or there is some brain implant in the doctor.

Anyways, this makes it where the person can be at home, a hotel, or even the moon. And the doctor can interact with the person as if they are there.

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Option 2: The AI will keep getting better and better to the point where human doctors will be obsolete.

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Both cases, your job is safe. But there will be a time where just like truck drivers today can see it with self driving around the corner. The ones driving today are likely the last generation in that career.

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monsieurpooh t1_j71aba4 wrote

That is true for a lot of jobs. Go to a software engineering interview at a typical big company. Compare the skills you need for the job vs the ones you're being tested for. Very little overlap.

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