Submitted by PhoOhThree t3_z2ke4h in television
1987-2074 t1_ixkoh9f wrote
Reply to comment by [deleted] in Andor - Episode 12 Finale - Discussion Thread! by PhoOhThree
This is one of the weird complaints I have with the gender/racial inclusion of the Empire in recent SW depiction. Complaint isn’t even a good word for it, but observation doesn’t quite work either.
Yeah it’s great for casting great actors, but space Nazis being an “equal opportunity workplace” (for humans) just feels odd.
Compared to the Original Trilogy where the space nazis(Bad) were all carbon copies of one look/uniform/race/gender and the Rebel Alliance(Good) was a melting pot of species and different looking, different outfits, different races, and different genders. All the way from the people who just walked in to join, to the people leading.
BoxSweater t1_ixkxqgz wrote
> Yeah it’s great for casting great actors, but space Nazis being an “equal opportunity workplace” (for humans) just feels odd
I like it. There's no reason to expect that bigotry with space-Nazis would play out the way bigotry with Earth-Nazis did. In a place with huge amounts of species diversity it makes sense to me that you could have much more bigotry targeted towards the more obvious outgroup.
kaoisa t1_iy77kaj wrote
agreed. I feel like if we discovered there were aliens, it would no longer be the difference between humans and cultures and skin color, it would be humans versus aliens.
AlwaysOptimism t1_ixl36m3 wrote
Why would racism necessarily exist in Star Wars? Racism was borne out of racial slavery
1987-2074 t1_ixl6jrv wrote
A little deeper thought than I intended to go with my previous comment. Because Star Wars is a medium intended to be viewed by our world’s eyes. Biologically speaking, race doesn’t exist. We all know and are aware that the idea of race exist though, and has power.
In the Star Wars wars universe it makes sense to not have a system of patriarchy with “white men” being those in power, as their worlds are different than the current world we live in. But that is what we were were presented in the original trilogy, white men in a powerful fascist government that wore similar outfits/gear to nazis. Which is why I mentioned that it was odd personally, to have non-white men being portrayed as space-nazis in recent Star Wars adaptions.
As the article below delves deeper into. The idea of racism derives from what can be gained in creating and supporting it. The Star Wars universe in all adaptions, presents people doing things for money at the detriment to others. Therefore, racism as we understand it in our world surely exist within the Star Wars Universe. It has been simplified though to the fascist Empire is just very xenophobic.
>It is critical in understanding that racism did not begin with...race. The roots of racism stem from differing religions, the mission to Christianize, and the global acceptability of owning those of a different faith. It was acceptable for Christians to have non-Christian slaves, Muslims to have non-Muslim slaves, or African peoples to own others from enemy tribes.
>However, in the late middle ages, slave owners began to pivot toward making a profit when the Portuguese began their exploration and triggered Western exploitation of African goods, services, and bodies. Original justifications were because African peoples were not vastly Christian, but after Christianization, slavers needed a new reason to justify their highly-profitable industry.
AlwaysOptimism t1_ixndb1z wrote
I appreciate the thoughtful response. I don’t know why I’m getting downvoted for a totally reasonable question.
Racism doesn’t necessarily exist in an hypothetical alien civilization of humans. It makes sense to utilize it in Star Wars as a reflection of our human society.
1987-2074 t1_ixo2h7n wrote
Don’t know why you’re getting downvoted either. I gave you an upvote.
If anything I’d think my take was more controversial.
Andor purposefully did a lot to expand upon the daily life of the empire. Having the Imperial officer being a family man with wife and kid in the earlier episodes for example. Portraying the empire as being as being varying degrees of “bad.”
kimchi_paradise t1_ixlguj0 wrote
>Therefore, racism as we understand it in our world surely exist within the Star Wars Universe. It has been simplified though to the fascist Empire is just very xenophobic.
>Because Star Wars is a medium intended to be viewed by our world’s eyes.
Luckily, Star Wars is a fictional universe set in the very distant past.
All fictional medium is intended to be viewed by the eyes of this world, but thankfully doesn't necessarily need to be interpreted as such.
With far more interactive and intelligent species and mechanical objects (ie droids), the concept of race as we know it gets diluted to the point that it no longer matters what our definition of race is, but what each of the characters' definition of race. Ewoks are considered a race, regardless of their skin color. Same with humans. Same with Chewbaccas lol.
So it's not completely out of the ordinary to see someone human with a different color skin in the empire, and then again with the resistance, as race does not exist like that. It would be weird to see an Ewok with the Empire though, since it's been implied that that race does not really have a reason to be there.
Sometimes, it does get a little tiring though whenever there's like 2 black people and people are like "INACCURATE!" in a completely fictional setting, and then go on to explain why it shouldn't be like that and yadda yadda. Like, their race has no bearing on them being there so why does it matter? They could be Indian or Asian and it would still not make a difference. Let me just enjoy the show. Le sigh lol.
Takseen t1_ixu75h2 wrote
"White men everywhere" was just a trend with early US film making. I remember a joke about Lando Calrissian "Look a black man made it to space!" because to the best of my knowledge he was the first black dude in Star Wars.
The Empire has no in universe reason to care about skin color, and is already sufficiently Nazi coded without needing to harm real actor role diversity
Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments