t3hmau5 t1_ismantr wrote
Reply to comment by Yerm_Terragon in TIL that before the invention of regfrigeration in 1851, ice had to be imported to Australia from Boston, Massachusetts. The ice blocks travelled through the tropics inside ships insulated with timber, straw, peat, and sawdust by stumcm
I get australia...but why did Europe have issued with ice?
PublicSeverance t1_isnkg4e wrote
Ice used to be dirty with soil, sawdust, pollution or poor hygiene.
European ice harvesters would store the ice in in underground pits for insulation. The melting ice water picked up dirt and covered the blocks. Or the blocks were covered in saw dust for insulation.
Americans stored their ice above ground in huts. When the ice water melted it dropped out the base and benefit was creating an evaporative cooling effect.
Both types of harvested ice were good for refrigerators, or cool rooms, making ice cream, but only the American style ice was good for mixed drinks.
Yerm_Terragon t1_ismbdec wrote
Well, first a guy had to convince people that drinks tasted better with ice in them. That same guy also tried to transport ice across the ocean. So he had a limited amount of time to try and sell a limited amount of ice and hope it would catch on. It wasnt that Europe didnt like ice, it was just an inconvenience to get it there
t3hmau5 t1_ismfja1 wrote
I more mean climate wise Europe should have been capable of their own ice production if they wanted it. No?
Yerm_Terragon t1_ismhohm wrote
They did, but the guy trying to convince people to put ice in their drinks could only harvest it from North America.
t3hmau5 t1_ismiazt wrote
As a cold beverage lover I salute the efforts of that one dude, apparently a revolutionary!
TWiesengrund t1_ismivx8 wrote
That's a pretty US-centric view. Ice has been used in drinks on a larger scale since the 16th century but mostly for the rich feudal class. The Alps were a big trade center for that but of course nothing like what we got in the 19th century. It only really took off with early industrialization but it was a known commodity before.
plytheman t1_isp9d0m wrote
I think there's a few story lines getting crossed here. I can't speak to the OP comment about North America creating the trend of iced drinks in Europe, but it seems like Frederick Tudor and the resulting ice industry was pretty influential in promoting ice in cocktails, etc.
From New England Historical Society:
>Frederic Tudor expanded his business to Charleston, Savannah and New Orleans, developing new sales techniques along the way.
>He gave bartenders free ice for a year after teaching them how to keep it frozen in a ‘refrigerating jar’ and how to make cocktails like the Smash. He sold ice to Havana coffee shop owners and the keeper of the Tivoli Gardens after teaching them how to make ice cream.
Also:
>Between 1844 and the early 1850s, the remarkably pure ice from Wenham Lake in Massachusetts became a fashionable luxury among the British aristocracy. The best London hotels put up signs advertising Wenham ice. It was said you could read a newspaper through a block of Wenham Lake ice two feet thick.
>Wenham ice inspired the popularity of cocktails like sherry cobblers and mint juleps in London. No fancy dinner party was complete without it, and Queen Victoria insisted on it.
>A competitor to Frederic Tudor, the Wenham Lake Ice Co., had promoted the stuff.
b0nz1 t1_iso5vuq wrote
That sounds absolutely ridiculous and 100% made up.
Yerm_Terragon t1_iso7u0y wrote
Yeah, it does. Thats because we arent too keen these days on teaching social history.
Refrigerators only started to become commonplace 100 years ago. Before that we had to use ice boxes to keep things like meat and dairy cold, and those didnt even exist for 100 years before that point. So, you have to think that we are talking about 200-300 years before household refrigeration methods would even exist. We couldnt just make ice, we had to get it from somewhere it already was. Remember the opening scene from Frozen where they sawed ice blocks out of a lake? Not just done for a cool scene, ice harvesting use to be an actual profession. Then you just need to acknowledge that Canada is the largest landmass that will have year round ice, so thats where they got it from.
Sounds a lot more believable now, doesnt it?
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