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FlimFlamMagoo728 t1_j8o7h3j wrote

If the wheels haven't fallen off of the bus after nearly 3 years of working from home, I'm having a really hard time seeing a good reason for why exactly workers are being forced back into the office. IMO if you want to make new hires come in - person fine, but it's been 3 years now and your existing employees have all made changes to their own lifestyles. This basically amounts to constructive dismissal for many.

I am glad the unions are sticking up for workers here in the face of stupid policy changes.

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hemlockone t1_j8od6sy wrote

I have a little bit of a disagreement with the first point. 3 years can involve deferred projects and may not yet be a steady state. Not the same as staffing, but there is a bus garage being closed and rebuilt near me. A community push was, "if it can be closed for 3 years, why not just close permanently?". The answer, of course, is that it is putting pressure on the system. Other places have too much load and can't renovate.

That said, I've been remote for 4 years. If my sector actually had offices in DC proper, I might think differently, but the benefits of not traveling and just being able to walk the dog during lunch are huge. There are a lot of jobs that can be accomplished at the same level or better than at the office. Many gov't jobs fall into that.

But, I find hybrid painful. You lose out on spurious connections because the other people are hybrid on different days.

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No-Lunch4249 t1_j8os3v7 wrote

My employer is doing Hybrid, and it’s designed to bring people in on the same days to foster those spurious connections. Marketing and Event Planning people are both in on Monday, that kind of thing. But the big draw back to it is that it removes any of the flexibility from it, you’re definitely expected to be in on YOUR days.

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dwhite21787 t1_j8py2fo wrote

My on campus day is 90% shooting the sh*t with everyone who's in. It's nice to see folks and chat and occasionally even discuss something work related for a few minutes, but it's mostly sports, kids, pre-retirement plans, tv shows, traffic woes. I end up more stressed because I get hardly anything accomplished for the 3 hour roundtrip drive.

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No-Lunch4249 t1_j8pzv8p wrote

100% agree. I feel like most of what would have been a solid 10 hours of goofing off with coworkers and water cooler gossip in a pre-covid work week gets compressed into the 2-3 days I’m in office, rendering those days essentially pointless lol

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west-egg t1_j8q0s1q wrote

IMO even shooting the shit has value, in the form of building stronger relationships with your colleagues. Maybe it’s because I work for a smallish organization, but I’ve always found it helpful to find common interests with people whose roles are very different from mine and who I may only interact with a few times a year. It makes the work we do together easier and more productive.

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xhoi t1_j8q5xee wrote

> IMO even shooting the shit has value, in the form of building stronger relationships with your colleagues.

It also has value because it's on the clock.

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dwhite21787 t1_j8q4bjv wrote

I agree, it's intangibly valuable, and I'm pretty resigned that those days are not directly productive to my timesheet cost centers, and apparently that's fine with management. It irks me, but I'm not going to let it raise my blood pressure.

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Gumburcules t1_j8s8ixz wrote

> My on campus day is 90% shooting the sh*t with everyone who's in.

I'm 100% convinced that despite "productivity" being the ostensible reason for returning to the office the actual reason is that the higher-ups who make the decisions miss their office shit shooting, business lunches, and escape time from their spoiled kids and loveless marriages.

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FlimFlamMagoo728 t1_j8ogdax wrote

I am definitely very sympathetic to the points you make here, and do recognize that this may vary substantially from one team to the next as far as how well remote has been working out.

Tbh I really do personally like hybrid as a sort of "best of both worlds" thing - my wife works for an NGO that I think has a really reasonable approach to it, which is that they have one day a week where all hands are expected to be in office, then it is up to different department heads to determine if and how much they want their teams to be in person. For my wife's team that she leads, she has picked one additional day per week where her people come in which helps with some of the stuff you identified, but still leaves a lot more flexibility in people's lives. In our case, it means that we were able to move further out from the core of DC to somewhere that we can actually afford to buy a house which means that although the commute is longer, because she generally only has to go in twice per week means she spends less total time commuting and has that flexibility to be home with pets, go to appointments, etc. And, in our case, means that we are able to think about having a kid since we know that our jobs now give us the flexibility in our home lives to be able to handle that.

In general though I tend to land on the side that we shouldn't be forcing people who never had to come in person for their jobs to start doing so - I think that represents a bit of an unreasonable modification to working rules which is exactly the thing that unions are supposed to defend against.

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hemlockone t1_j8oqheu wrote

That version of hybrid makes a lot of sense for random connections. Just put everyone in the same room periodically.

The problem, I see, is that it takes a ton of infrastructure. I work in contracting, and the rate difference for an onsite (hosted by the contractor) vs offsite (hosted by the customer) is huge. Some of that is IT load and similar, but a lot is just who owns the building. Keeping that up, but only getting 25% utilization is very wasteful. Perhaps multiple users per desk, but that takes some build out (is it like hotdesking, a timeshare? does everyone have a personal drawer?)

I think the other challenge will be hiring for positions that aren't suitable to do remote. Worse, ones that require the same skill-set as ones that are. Think IT that requires touching the actually hardware, mailroom, anything with sensitive data, etc. I know I won't be applying for any of those jobs anytime soon.

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BansheeLoveTriangle t1_j8orj9u wrote

I do desk shares, and honestly I’m fucking sick of it - people are disgusting, I shouldn’t have to pick up people’s trash and wipe away their filthy every day before I sit down at a workstation

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hemlockone t1_j8ov76i wrote

That seems not done right, then.

A hot desk is a communal space, just like a breakroom table. The space needs to be obviously built to be shared, part of the cleaners' rotation (an added cost, yes, but perhaps less the 4x desks, and the built setup matters. Design for cleaning.)

I'll say that I've worked remotely for 4 years, but I do occasionally (monthly?) use a hot desk at my HQ. They are clearly designed and treated as communal spaces, and I haven't had a problem as a result.

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FlimFlamMagoo728 t1_j8p9pkd wrote

Yeah, it's definitely not the most ideal usage of office space but the flipside is that the flexibility of hybrid makes it easier for them to hire and retain top level talent within their specific industry

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BourbonCoug t1_j8qsocs wrote

>You lose out on spurious connections because the other people are hybrid on different days.

This. This so much! What good is it for me to be in the office if the people that I would need or want to work with in-person aren't there on my dedicated day? Why go if just to attend virtual meetings?

Also doesn't help that a lot of spaces aren't designed well to foster the collaboration one might want on a hybrid schedule. No, I don't want an entirely open office floor plan, but the cubicle farm isn't any better in 2023.

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Codasco t1_j8p3764 wrote

Removing an uncodified “benefit” of remote work is an easy way to downside and become more lean for touched economic times. This is step one to avoid the “L Word”.

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FlimFlamMagoo728 t1_j8p9jcr wrote

In the private sector, absolutely, but this thread is about government workers.

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Codasco t1_j8q938n wrote

Holy typos in my post. I can see the government doing the same thing. We can’t afford to keep spending at the same rates. Trump wanted to move entire agencies thousands of miles to reduce headcount. Reverting to the pre pandemic telework guidelines could accomplish the same thing. There’s no way every agency functions as efficiently and effectively with WFH. The real estate sits vacant and creates unnecessary costs. It’s a no brainer and will happen.

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Gumburcules t1_j8s9g51 wrote

> Trump wanted to move entire agencies thousands of miles to reduce headcount.

Well yeah, but the goal of reducing headcount wasn't because we couldn't afford to keep them employed, it was to force all the competent people who could get other jobs to leave so that the agencies would be crippled and unable to provide oversight, enforce regulations, or distribute services to the "wrong people."

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MedicalSpecializer t1_j8npq79 wrote

A huge number of federal employees, like myself, can’t afford to live in DC or the inner suburbs without making untenable sacrifices. I live in Baltimore and commute because of that, but the expectation is that after a year, I telework or go hybrid, so I put up with it. I imagine that making people go back into the office with the commutes that they have will massively impact on employee retention and overall quality of life, especially considering federal employees’ relatively low pay. I’m glad the unions are fighting this, and hopefully most of us can stay remote/hybrid forever.

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throwaways06041987 t1_j8o6fmf wrote

Will be interesting to see if there's another push like in the Trump administration to move agencies out of DC since the pandemic and the union has proved a lot of federal work can be done elsewhere.

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MedicalSpecializer t1_j8o73sm wrote

I’d spend the next thirty years happily working for my agency if they’d move some of us (or let me move) to Chicago, incredibly good rent prices in a cool city plus that relatively high locality adjustment is an absolute dream.

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fvb955cd t1_j8oa3o3 wrote

Republicans: Best we can do is mandatory in the office in rural southern Illinois.

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Surefinewhatever1111 t1_j8oap3v wrote

Illinois still has Dem senators, gotta move it to Alabama. I'm sure it's purely coincidence lots of FBI functions have been forcibly moved to a place most Black feds left for a reason. Ditto the USDA moves etc.

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GEV46 t1_j8p9x1r wrote

I'd be happy going full remote in Southern Illinois.

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MedicalSpecializer t1_j8oaf32 wrote

Some of the wines that come out of way southern Illinois are actually really, really good and vineyards are genuinely gorgeous. I also really love Carbondale, that’s a great small town. A criminally underrated part of the country, and another place I wouldn’t mind living 😅

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EastoftheCap t1_j8obrpr wrote

The next Republican president will absolutely do this if work from home is still going on.

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Evening_Chemist_2367 t1_j8q69te wrote

The pandemic proved that most federal work can be done remotely, so no reason to move them out of DC, maybe just downsize the physical HQ office space.

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NewUser22031 t1_j8pg50a wrote

That would be a smart move. Housing is expensive and limited here so why not spread out.

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8nzn75 wrote

>up with it. I imagine that making people go back into the office with the commutes that they have will massively impact on employee retention and overall quality of life, especially considering federal employees’ relatively low pay. I’m glad the unions are fighting this, and hopefully most of us can stay remote/hybrid forever.

A full year of a long commute sounds horrible. Please, please, please think liberally about reasonable accommodations ("RA"). Let's just say, a little birdie told me: some folks have argued successfully they need a RA for telework because they can not wear a mask due to their asthma. Telework can be granted for medical reasons (i.e., asthma...etc.), since most agencies have a policy in place that folks need to wear a mask if they think they have been exposed to COVID-19. Heck, you might even have Anthropophobia. Just saying.

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MedicalSpecializer t1_j8o00ai wrote

well now that you mention, my IBS is pretty debilitating sometimes…

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8qq44x wrote

Your IBS sounds like it might negatively impact major life activities such as work. The episodic nature of your disability sure sounds like it could impact your commute too. Sounds REASONABLE to ask for an ACCOMMODATION of workplace flexibility to manage your illness. Lol. 💅🏾

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AsbestosIn0bstetrics t1_j8nycdw wrote

The pandemic really changed people, because before 2020, most people commuted to/from their jobs and never demanded the right to work at home.

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Nuntiak t1_j8o8687 wrote

People didn’t change. It’s not like people enjoyed their commute before the pandemic. We came in because it was the only option.

Now? We’ve seen that the technology and infrastructure is able to make it work. Everyone is seeing that they can do the exact same work, at equal or better efficiency, from the comfort of their home, without having to sit for an hour in their car, bus, train, whatever.

It means more time for sleeping, or to spend time with family, or for fitness, or hobbies. It means saving money on lunches (or time spent packing one, and healthier lunch too).

And now they’re being told to give that up and come back to the office, for vague indeterminate reasons like “we miss you” or “you have to be here for team building”.

There are three categories of people who seem to be pushing to kill telework:

  • Senior management who can afford to live close to their office and who have a dedicated parking space

  • extroverts who have no social life outside the office and rely on their coworkers to be their social life support

  • Real estate/business owners who rely on commuters/office workers to make income.

I have no sympathy for any of the above.

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ManiacalShen t1_j8p6ks7 wrote

>It means more time for sleeping, or to spend time with family, or for fitness, or hobbies. It means saving money on lunches (or time spent packing one, and healthier lunch too).

On that note, it would be nice if those of us who do have to work in person were allowed to work fewer hours. Not only do we still have to commute every day, but a bunch of lunch spots have gone out of business, and envy for WFH friends is through the roof.

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OneFunkyPlatypus t1_j8ozvun wrote

And the new hires who are faced with a laptop screen, limited artificial interactions with seniors and mentors, no sympathy for them either?

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Nuntiak t1_j8p4c34 wrote

We onboarded multiple people during the pandemic. They did just fine. One of them was a top performer and actually left when management started forcing return to office.

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Surefinewhatever1111 t1_j8pjyc1 wrote

You think you're getting "authentic" interactions with federal supervisors in the office? How many years have you been a fed? Zero?

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Surefinewhatever1111 t1_j8o6awx wrote

>never demanded the right to work at home.

You're not familiar with the several and many Telework acts passed by the federal government over the years? One of the most important factors for the ease with which a lot of agencies were able to go fully remote was years and years of regularly scheduled telework.

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MedicalSpecializer t1_j8nzpss wrote

We have reliably known, for at least a decade, that significant commuting is a net negative on individual and public health. With the cost of living in the DC being as extreme as it is, many people are forced into supercommuting practices, which has significant negative health consequences in the long-term. It’s fantastic that so many people can opt out of commuting, it’s an amazing development for individual and public health.

I would be completely fine in going to the office like I do now after my year probation is up if I could get an equivalent unit for the same price in a similar neighborhood in DC (absolutely no shot) or my pay was doubled so I could afford DC.

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puttinonthefoil t1_j8o9s2q wrote

It didn’t change people, it provided proof for the long held belief: “I could do this job just as easily at home.”

And for most email jobs, it is true, and the last 3 years bore this out. Now there’s concrete proof it’s true, so the argument is stronger.

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Agirlisarya01 t1_j8oeh23 wrote

No, the pandemic changed employers. Before the pandemic, they swore up and down that remote work wasn’t feasible. Employees have been proving them wrong since Day 1 of the lockdowns. Since it can be done, and we have been delivering results, there is no reason that we can’t keep doing it.

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romanceordelusion t1_j8nxk12 wrote

Cant read the story without an account. Lots of employees pushing back at my agency.. long union dispute

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8o07in wrote

Agencies are reviewing, updating, and informing staff of their Telework Policy changes in a piecemeal manner. I strongly suspect, as special interest groups (The DC Mayor, Chamber of Commerce, etc.) keep applying pressure we will all get more clear guidance. People vote with their feet, I have heard people say they were taking a job two GS levels lower, due to the fact they would get to work remotely. Telework or remote work is only tier one of the battle. Tier two is good faith conversations about locality pay determinations.

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RGG8810 t1_j8pw5ep wrote

People are not going to get DC locality pay if they are working fully remote elsewhere. That will never happen.

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leonardoty t1_j8ra8di wrote

Fine by me. DC locality pay is dogshit. I can move back to my hometown and take an 11% cut in pay, and a 70% cut in cost of living.
Except my agency won’t allow it.

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Shadybrooks93 t1_j8oelh3 wrote

What is the conversation to be had over locality pay? My agency's stance seems to be if you are in the office once a pay period you get the office locality, otherwise it's where you live. Which seems pretty fair.

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Mtskiguy21 t1_j8omol7 wrote

That's not just your agency's stance, it's OPM's stance.

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8qoj6l wrote

Ah, yes, OPM was so helpful in this article right? Standard comms. 101 boiler plate responses. Suggesting media refer to their official report on telework. Honest question: Is OPM auditing agencies Telework Managing Officer’s agency data around Telework, as it is stipulated in the Telework Enhancement Act of 2010?

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8qo4et wrote

Government agencies have siloed communication. In some cases, agencies follow legal and/or OPM guidance strictly. In other cases, agencies use creative license to wiggle around legal/regulatory guidance. It is only a matter of time, before agencies start to compare what each other are doing. It would seem, agencies are accelerating their conversations around telework, and some agencies disingenuous use of telework locality determinations is only “just” being noticed.

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Super_lobbyist OP t1_j8nzrwd wrote

You can sign up for a free account

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Mjt8 t1_j8o2zy8 wrote

Ah yes, they only need your email, address, place of work, phone number, and full name. But it’s free!

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romanceordelusion t1_j8o15yt wrote

Nice try Bisnow shill

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Super_lobbyist OP t1_j8o4dqp wrote

It's more than 1000 characters, so I can't post it all at once. And I don't have time to do more than that.

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Plenty-Koala4857 t1_j8oou8b wrote

Part I: February 13, 2023 When President Joe Biden said in his State of the Union address on March 1, 2022, that the “vast majority” of federal workers would soon return to the office, workers at the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission had been waiting months for a post-Covid office re-entry plan.

Three days after Biden’s address, the EEOC’s employees were provided with a plan. It had no remote work policy and ignored months of engagement with decision-makers, Rachel Shonfield, president of the union representing more than 1,500 EEOC employees, told Bisnow.

“My phone lit up … folks were saying, ‘Why did we fill out these surveys, why did we go to these focus groups, because nobody listened!’” Shonfield said. “People were so completely demoralized.”

After the policy was unilaterally imposed in May, her union, the American Federation of Government Employees Council 216, filed an unfair labor practice charge against the EEOC. The Federal Labor Relations Authority sided with the union in June, arguing that the EEOC hadn’t been negotiating in good faith. The two sides reached a temporary agreement with a more flexible telework policy in November, but Shonfield said the dispute speaks to a broader issue: that officials are trying to "check boxes" in their return-to-office push without taking the time to understand the needs of their employees.

The EEOC case isn’t the only dispute between labor and federal agency heads over telework policies, and in a workforce that is more heavily unionized than the private sector, that could spell further trouble for the federal return-to-office push.

The federal government has faced consistent calls from office owners and local officials, especially those in D.C., to come up with a re-entry plan for the more than 2 million federal workers across the country.

But the unions representing federal workers have been clear as negotiations over re-entry plans continue that the old expectations about the federal workforce’s office presence will need to be replaced with a new reality: Telework will be a much bigger part of workers’ lives going forward.

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Plenty-Koala4857 t1_j8oqcjq wrote

Part II: “Federal employees have an obligation to deliver services for the American people,” said Jaqueline Simon, national policy director for AFGE. “They do not have an obligation to patronize businesses in downtown D.C.”

The pressure to return to the office has boiled into public view this year. D.C. Mayor Muriel Bowser said in her inaugural address in January that the federal government — which employs roughly a quarter of the District’s workforce and leases or owns a third of its office stock -- had a responsibility to come up with a return-to-office plan.

“We need decisive action by the White House to either get most federal workers back to the office most of the time or to realign their vast property holdings for use by the local government, by nonprofits, by businesses and by any user willing to revitalize it,” Bowser said in remarks on Jan. 2.

The EEOC didn't respond to a request for comment. While its brush with the Federal Labor Relations Authority was unusual, it us far from the only federal agency to renegotiate its telework arrangements with union intervention.

In December, the National Archives and Records Administration reached an agreement with its union allowing up to five telework days per week for all employees, which are to be granted “based on legitimate business needs,” according to the AFGE.

The month prior, the National Science Foundation’s new four-year collective bargaining agreement allowed employees to telework up to eight days per pay period and expanded the number of teleworkers allowed from eight to 150.

Negotiations are ongoing at other federal agencies, including at the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission, where AFGE Local 421 found that roughly half of the 1,000 workers in its bargaining unit would consider a job elsewhere.

Despite Biden’s pronouncement about the return of federal workers, re-entry plans have been delayed for more than a year. Experts attribute that not to challenges with real estate, but to issues with labor.

When reached for comment, a spokesperson for the Office of Personnel Management, which oversees federal guidance on telework policies, referred Bisnow to the agency’s 2022 telework report. In its introduction, OPM Director Kiran Ahuja said embracing telework was a priority in order to ensure the federal government hired and retained top talent, arguing "there is no going back."

“There has been a sea change in the American labor market,” Ahuja said. “Federal agencies must continue to embrace workplace flexibilities, such as telework, to remain competitive.” The report found that between fiscal year 2020 and 2021, the percentage of federal employees teleworking increased from 45% to 47% of all workers.

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Lincoln_Logss t1_j8pb2k9 wrote

DC Fed Here!

So here’s my unsolicited two cents here.

The Mayors Office is trying to coordinate with Federal Agencies to eliminate/cut back on telework in hopes that commuting employees would revitalize local businesses in DC and help stabilize the economy.

In other words, help with local businesses, eateries transportation and more and return it to pre-Covid Times.

Additionally, the official space that’s not being used due to teleworking contractors and employees which belongs to the agencies-they want to convert to affordable housing and other services.

Again that’s not practical because the infrastructure of office buildings wasn’t made for affordable housing and even if it was-I’m 95% sure a rich real estate company will buy the building and cut a shady deal with the Mayors office and charge whatever outrageous price they want cause they can. And nothing changes…

So here’s where I draw the line because it’s all a bunch of bullshit.

#1. When the economy is bad, inflation is high and wages are stagnant, people spend less money.

So enforcing ppl back to the office in hopes that they’ll spend EVEN MORE on gas, commute and $12 lunches to sustain the economy is a falsehood.

#2. If that’s the route they wanted to go which was to end telework, then a conversation has to be had about raising the cost of wages for DC and Federal Employees to help with spending-which again, isn’t happening…

#3. Covid has forever changed the way we work now. Similar to how 9/11 changed the world around us. Businesses need to be creative to sustain themselves and make money and forcing the citizens who work here to bite the bullet isn’t it.

Simply put, you either adapt or die.

TL/DR

DC Mayors Office is bullshit and the reasons why. Salute to these Union’s for having their employees backs.

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Evening_Chemist_2367 t1_j8q65tn wrote

Oh, federal employees are going to revitalize downtown businesses? At $16 for a mediocre sandwich for lunch? I suggest Muriel work with her real estate and developer buddies to drive down costs for those businesses because there's not much compelling or affordable about downtown businesses to federal employees.

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leonardoty t1_j8raj4q wrote

Yeah, this idea that with costs sky high, we’re expected to save the DC economic situation while also being paid crap, is comical at best. I will quit if they tell me I have to come back to the office more. I’m already at 2 days a week and it’s a massive waste of my time.

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abmm1285 t1_j8zn2r0 wrote

As someone who noth lives and works in DC, I take issue with the mayor pushing so hard to make sure people have to commute into the city to buy sandwiches. They need to focus more on making sure people want to live here even if they don’t have to be close to work, and then maybe some of the companies locating in nearby suburbs will choose to locate here as well. The quality of city services here are ridiculously terrible compared to other nearby areas it would seem- no focus on improving liveability and keeping existing residents here.

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presque-veux t1_j8o2vyf wrote

We just had a town hall in my directorate where they said that 'changes might be coming' to bring us in three days a week and that remote position waivers are paused.

And many of the questions in the chat were, has the mayor's office released a safety plan for the metro? (crickets). What is [agency] doing to ensure that people don't leave for higher pay and remote work in the private sector (crickets). When will there be solid policy? (crickets)

Holy shit, get it together. I myself had a job interview elsewhere today. I wish the fed gov would see the writing on the wall. If you don't support your employees.... why should we support you?

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Surefinewhatever1111 t1_j8ob4e4 wrote

> I wish the fed gov would see the writing on the wall.

It does, the clowns in the Wilson Bldg don't. Fed leadership knows they can't compete on salary and a lot of other things, but working conditions has been and will continue to be a metric in talent management.

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ManiacalShen t1_j8p6zql wrote

>has the mayor's office released a safety plan for the metro?

Remote workers really have been living in a different world for the last three years, wow.

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GearWarsHistorian t1_j8rihsq wrote

Yeah seriously. Like a COVID safety plan? What does that even mean at this point.

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Feisty_Law_3321 t1_j8oyaz3 wrote

Commoditization of downtown DC is not a reason to force thousands of people back to an office for no personal benefit to the employee or to the organization.

Mayor Bowser needs to find ways to revitalize downtown for the realities of today vs. forcing people back to an antiquated system.

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NobodyJonesMD t1_j8q2u8j wrote

But then she’d have to actually do something instead of talking about doing something.

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west-egg t1_j8q2fl9 wrote

To be fair, she said the feds need to bring people back OR turn over the real estate to more productive uses.

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Feisty_Law_3321 t1_j8sucrp wrote

And what exactly would be her role in either of those options? What exactly is she doing to improve things besides issuing empty ultimatums?

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No-Lunch4249 t1_j8osa6o wrote

The thing that gets me with the social discourse around return to office, is that upper level executive types have always been allowed to work from wherever they want pretty much as much as they want.

It’s only us peons having that freedom when it’s suddenly an organizational problem.

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shirpars t1_j8p00ch wrote

This is not true in the government. Many gs15s were not allowed to telework at all pre pandemic

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No-Lunch4249 t1_j8p09kj wrote

Fair enough, all my experience is private sector and non-profit so I perhaps foolishly assumed it was similar or even more lenient in that regard

Edit: clarifying that I am a dum dum

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Zwicker101 t1_j8othue wrote

This really is a stupid move on the Fed government's part.

Literally one of the appeals of fed government work is their flexible telework policy. Even with this policy, they're suffering a brain drain.

Get rid of this policy and the brain drain will happen even faster.

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Plenty-Koala4857 t1_j8orgua wrote

Part III: FD Stonewater Managing Director Norman Dong, who oversaw the federal government's office portfolio for the General Services Administration between 2014 and 2017, said that labor was a huge component of discussions about real estate needs during that time.

He said that guidance issued by OMB in 2021 delegating the task of return-to-office plans to agency heads and other top officials has driven much of the internal discussions over re-entry since.

“Agencies are competing for talent in terms of recruiting and retaining employees. Telework is something that factors into the mix," Dong said. “I come back to the written guidance. That is like gospel to people."

But despite broad pronouncements that telework is here to stay, commercial office owners have been frustrated by re-entey plans that are piecemeal and lack a clear overall direction from the top, said Darien Leblanc, an executive vice chairman at Cushman & Wakefield.

“If the federal government is going to embrace broad-scale remote work across most federal agencies indefinitely, then announcing that publicly will be helpful, because then the private sector can begin to extrapolate what that could mean,” Leblanc said. “The deafening silence right now in terms of what it consists of means that people can’t plan.”

D.C. leaders say the effects of federal workers’ slow return to downtown buildings are clear: Retail vacancies remain high in the office-heavy downtown and East End, where workers once bought lunch, visited dry cleaners and shopped regularly. The Washington-area Metro system is also missing hundreds of thousands of riders.

But despite that strain, one area where union leaders and policy setters in the federal government agree is that the federal government’s footprint will shrink, a policy that Transwestern Managing Director Lucy Kitchin described at a Bisnow event last year as one of “reduction, reduction, reduction." That’s likely to continue as the federal government competes with the private sector for labor.

More than a quarter of federal workers are set to retire by 2027, forcing the feds to incorporate incentives like teleworking to promote recruitment and retention, according to an analysis by JLL shared with Bisnow. Meanwhile, the Government Accountability Office is preparing a Federal Building Utilization Study that will provide some answers on just how many workers are returning to the office when it is published in the coming months, Dong said.

But Shonfield said the cat is already out of the bag — EEOC employees have told her they’ve had an easier time doing much of their work handling workplace disputes remotely. The union is continuing to negotiate a more permanent telework policy, and she said she’s advocating for more flexibility going forward.

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8o0wxs wrote

Agencies have gotten themselves into a bind. Large recruitment efforts have been centered on offering workplace flexibilities. Locality pay determinations have been favorably offered for telework/remote staff to get locality pay for the official duty station of their employer, but they work in an alternative work site. It is only a matter of time, before the goose is cooked and things start to be audited. People who moved to Wyoming and fly into the city a few times each month, will get their Wyoming locality pay (+16.2% adjustment), and that is a big negative delta from the District of Columbia's locality pay (+32.49 adjustment). It is going to be sad, comical, and scary for some.

We are only in the beginning stages of this work place flexibility audit and/or fall-out.

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Mtskiguy21 t1_j8ono9i wrote

There are exactly zero remote federal employees being paid for a locality other than the one where their house is located. There is no such thing as offering "favorably offered locality pay" for remote employees. If an employee is not remote, they are required to go into an office 2X per pay period, and locality is based on the location of that office.

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Surefinewhatever1111 t1_j8pkq7q wrote

Agreed with one caveat. You have to be in the locality pay of the office twice per pay period. If you live in the same locality area as the office working from home, the point is moot, you can be 100% at home and get locality.

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8qpe12 wrote

I understand and agree with you. What you might not understand, is there are some of us who are aware of this clear guidance/legal direction not being followed. So, yes, there are much more than “zero” federal employees who are teleworking outside of the region (I.e. National Capital Region) and getting paid non-regional D.C. area locality pay. Please. Do. Not. Shoot the messenger!

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[deleted] t1_j8ow2la wrote

[deleted]

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8qp3th wrote

I am describing entrenched and systemic issues. Agencies have long used highly “creative” interpretations of legal statues. I am also pointing out a lack of oversight by OPM. These two phenomena are not exclusive to any one administration, they are two highly systematic problems that is highly entrenched. Review the PLUM and see how many political appointees manage government, who are often ignorant of the law or find creative ways to skirt around it! OPM doesn’t do much auditing, so problem become highly probable and/or entrenched.

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big_thanks t1_j8pi3pp wrote

Uh, this sounds like straight-up fraud.

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MarkinDC24 t1_j8qpfyd wrote

It does. It is. And the oversight body OPM is where exactly? Lol.

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Plenty-Koala4857 t1_j8orzpf wrote

Part IV: “There’s a comfort issue for individuals, particularly those who were subjected to harassment, that they’re not having to come sit in a conference room with the folks that they find to be intimidating," Shonfield said. “We would like recognition at EEOC that this is a post-Covid world, that other agencies are expanding their pre-Covid telework policies and having remote policies."

John Falcicchio, D.C.’s deputy mayor for planning and economic development, said he would like to see the Biden administration issue a clear, overarching policy on how many days it wants to see federal workers in the office.

“We think it's best that there is a centralized policy that comes from the White House,” Falcicchio said. “It should be a clear concise enterprisewide directive for how folks come back to the office.” He also said the Bowser administration has been steadfast in its assertion that the District just needs some workers coming in for part of the week in order to make a difference in the health of downtown, not a unilateral return-to-office five days a week.

A majority of the District government’s 37,000 employees are working on a hybrid schedule, according to Falcicchio. He argued that if D.C. can mandate in-office time and still attract and retain talent, then the federal government should be able to do the same. “We have the same aspects of trying to compete with the private sector and also compete with other employers who offer more liberal telework policies,” Falcicchio said. “We understand that perspective, but it's something we've been able to implement.”

Contact Jacob Wallace at jacob.wallace@bisnow.com

Related Topics: GSA, Darian LeBlanc, Joe Biden, The GSA, Norman Dong, The General Services Administration, Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, John Falcicchio, Return to office, Presiden Joe Biden

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NobodyJonesMD t1_j8q2dsg wrote

In all my time in DC, I’ve never encountered this “talent” in DC government of which Falcicchio speaks.

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2muchcaffeine4u t1_j8phobn wrote

DC is losing employees to the federal government like crazy. DC has an enormous crisis as a result of their inability to fill positions.

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drumminglulcat t1_j8s1a2u wrote

“Federal employees have an obligation to deliver services for the American people,” said Jaqueline Simon, national policy director for AFGE. “They do not have an obligation to patronize businesses in downtown D.C.”

This. This is the justification that really irks me. Government officials aren’t even being secretive about the fact that they just want us to be in the city to spend money. They view us as economic objects. They value us in “units of hamburgers and coffee cups purchased.” My Union fought hard, and when I finally do go back into the office once a week, I am going to work so much harder to not spend a single cent while I’m in the city, just out of spite. Bringing my own lunch. Bringing my own coffee. Buying my gas by my house instead of closer to the city.

It sucks that the economy of downtown isn’t what it once was, but it isn’t our job to sustain what was a very risky economic model of everybody being close together all of the time. Especially when beer at my house is 10% of the cost.

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Lincoln_Logss t1_j91tos4 wrote

Exactly. I’m infuriated by this bullshit.

I support effective solutions as long as they are rational, make sense and are just.

Squeezing people to spend more to fix the city’s problems isn’t it.

There are so many proactive split to go about solving this.

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Awkotaco95 t1_j8o8h3u wrote

Have any of the remote/teleworking policies changed? From the way they are currently written it will be hard to force anyone back

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NathAnarchy22 t1_j8riu4l wrote

People have been given an increased quality of life and better work life balance. Not to mention environmental impacts because of reduced, even small reductions, in traffic volume. Forcing people to return to work is a clear sign of profit over people.

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Knowaa t1_j8qirbs wrote

And Amazon, Salesforce, Google etc would not dare mandate a return to the office rn either bc their workers would unionize. Labor very strong atm

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Superb_Distance_9190 t1_j8p2jro wrote

Come back to DC! Just don’t wear a Canada Goose jacket that you bought with all the commuting savings you made over the last three years

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pizzajona t1_j8s9yra wrote

All I ask is for most federal employees to work in the office 3 days a week, that would be much greater than what it currently is

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dc1008 t1_j8p8fks wrote

I think people should be careful with exclusive remote working. At some point, they'll realize it is just as effective and ship your job to India or somewhere like that

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5Series_BMW t1_j8shgxp wrote

>At some point, they'll realize it is just as effective and

It already IS effective

>ship your job to India or somewhere like that.

1.) Federal Government is not going to allow foreign citizens to access their laptops, networks, websites, etc. We CAN’T even use our laptops abroad unless mission critical.

2.) Cheaper labor isn’t necessarily going to produce quality results. Also - Time zone differences would make it very difficult to coordinate basic business processes.

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watchme_08 t1_j8otg71 wrote

Go to work.. quit being lazy. Not that deep. You’re lazy if you are fighting to stay home all day.

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Feisty_Law_3321 t1_j8oykon wrote

There are countless successful organizations that are 100% remote. Are they all lazy too? Or just smarter than you?

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watchme_08 t1_j8p1hp5 wrote

This is reference to Government employees. Not private sector. Government TW is not efficient. I say that as someone in the office 5 days week. Working with other GS employees and contractors.

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Feisty_Law_3321 t1_j8pxenf wrote

Then find a way to make it efficient? The next generation workforce will not be in some stuffy govt cubicle. The sooner we embrace that fact the better Dc will be.

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