Submitted by PoorIsTheNewSwag t3_zvzck3 in worldnews
pewpewpewouch t1_j1sb6h1 wrote
What's so sad about this whole thing is that some rando mental racist idiot walks into a salon, kills a few foreign people, an then both Turkey and Kurdish supporters are using it to talk shit about each other.
Even on Reddit.
KryptosFR t1_j1tfkza wrote
I'm tired of people comparing the Kurds with the PKK.
It's like saying all Germans are Nazis, or all Palestinians are in the Hamas.
Aytanri- t1_j1u04d4 wrote
Well, the Kurds rioting in Paris are in fact PKK-Sympathizers. All of them made the specific decision to wave Flags of the PKK, Öcalan, or other PKK-linked Groups, yet no Flags of the Kurdish Regional Government of North Iraq.
They were literally shouting slogans like: "we are PKK" or "Freedom for Öcalan"
And to absolutely nobody's surprise, one of the "important community figures" that got shot by the old Frenchman was an official actual PKK Member with the codename "Evin Goyi".
France protecting the PKK is nothing new, it was known for years. Now the snake France fed, came back to bite the hand from which it was fed.
BanBreaking t1_j1tkl9l wrote
nobody in Turkey says all Kurds are terrorists. We've had this discussion internally on a public level for the past 15 years. What's sad is that European countries still support terrorists even though they recognize the PKK as a terrorist organization.
Localbearexpert t1_j1v0jye wrote
Imagine not supporting a country because they have a terrorist group inside them. How many does the fucking us have?
KryptosFR t1_j1tormc wrote
Name one European country that supports terrorists (with reliable source).
BanBreaking t1_j1tqcfn wrote
look at the protests in Paris. you might not be aware since you weren't hit by the PKK before unlike Turkey, but they are waving PKK flags on the streets of paris and this is allowed for some reason.
KryptosFR t1_j1tr0rz wrote
Ever heard of free speech? It doesn't mean the country supports terrorist.
Or should I consider every confederate or Nazi flag in the USA meaning the whole country supports fascism?
BanBreaking t1_j1tsecd wrote
Oh I'm sorry free speech? try going out in Berlin with a Nazi flag and see what happens to you
BloodAria t1_j1u9mek wrote
That argument doesn’t work in Europe, they ban Nazi symbols. Holocaust denial, public support of terrorist groups like ISIS, only PKK gets a free pass for some reason despite being recognized as a terror group.
The US is at least consistent because of the first amendment, not much is truly illegal when it comes to public expression.
Left_Share3227 t1_j1tryag wrote
So you would have all imprisoned/shot for expressing what they feel is right ? That’s what I’m hearing ?
BanBreaking t1_j1tsi9w wrote
shot? who said anything about shooting them? I see where your mind is at.
How about we don't support terrorsm in any way shape or form? how does that sound to you?
Left_Share3227 t1_j1ttj9k wrote
All depends where you want to draw the line. Cause the Kurds were protesting. Not terrorizing.
Your literally pointing all blame at the protestors going crazy because their people were killed.
What would you do if your mother, brother, child was just casually enjoying their coffee/lunch at a cafe during a protest an someone opens fire on them ? I’ll tell you what you would do you would get any other human you could to take too the streets an demand answers.
Answers the French Government dosent have because it wasn’t them who organized the shooting, so now you have no way to take out your rage so what do you do ?
Are you from turkey ? Im sure Erdogan considers all “protestors” “terrorists”. Ecspecially when they actually want too hold a Democratic election.
Edit: also good try trying to flip that “I see we’re your mind is at” bullshit on me. You clearly are a racist.
Aytanri- t1_j1tz5ce wrote
They were attacking Police, burning cars, destroying private property, even in Cities outside of Paris.
If that isn't organized terror, than I don't know what is.
A Turkish Student in Paris was brutally murdered a few weeks ago by getting shot in the back of his head.
https://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/turkish-student-killed-in-armed-attack-in-paris-179426
Did you see any French Turks rioting in the Streets? Making Kurds responsible? Running after Kurds in the streets, like the PKK-Sympathizers did when they saw Turks during the riots? Vandalizing the City? No, you didn't even see any News Articles by foreign Media mentioning this.
BanBreaking t1_j1tu7eq wrote
If my mother/brother/sister/father was shot drinking coffee I wouldnt wave an ISIS flag m8. its literally that simple. From your comment I gather that you're 2 steps away from waving an Al Qaeda flag. all it takes is a family members murder.
Left_Share3227 t1_j1tunsc wrote
I mean no I don’t follow islam. But you ignored most of my points which makes me feel like your intentionally blinding yourself so you can feel right so ima just stop typing
Jus remember if you ever go west protesting dosent equal terrorism.
An what they did after the shooting which was “riot”also dosent equal terrorism.
You give me the feeling you don’t like Kurds as a people in general.
BanBreaking t1_j1tuuol wrote
I'm not blinding myself. What I'm saying is grief doesn't naturally result in waving terrorist flags. Do you think that's normal?
Also I never said they are terrorists. But supporting terrorists and wabi f the flags of groups which have murdered civilians should be illegal. Oh and meanwhile, European news such as Euronews and BBC call these terrorists "freedom fighters". If that's not making light of the situation i don't know what is.
Also; i take it that you'll wave some sort of terrorist flag more in line with you beliefs then?
Left_Share3227 t1_j1tv8vx wrote
Dude are obsessed with flags or something ? This may be hard to believe but not everyone is concerned with what flags are at a protest.
Nope if I’m at a protest I’m their to protest. Just because a protester brings a flag to a protest in your mind means all people are protesting support for that flag ? I hope that isn’t your opinion on it because that would be a very simple minded an outright idiotic thought.
Edit: You “I never called them terrorists”. Also you on the protests because you saw a flag. “How about we don’t support terrorism of any kind.”
This is becoming a bad debate my friend you keep making me feel like I’m more right.
BanBreaking t1_j1tvyty wrote
are you fucking insane? Obv I'm concered about the flags because flags are historically representative of what ideology someone supports? if this not clear as day for you westerners? then why ban nazi flags in germany? you are contradicting yourself on so many levels.
​
>“How about we don’t support terrorism of any kind.”
yeah directed at the french government for allowing that shit.
​
if you think you are more right after this you havent had enough bombings in your home town my friend. if you are French, maybe the Paris bombing wasn't enough for you to understand how much of a threat these things pose.
Arcsindorei t1_j1v8nm0 wrote
Those protesters very clearly demonstrated PKK flags, and expressed their support for their leader. The thing is, even though the EU recognizes PKK as a terrorist organization they do very few to stop their activities. Especially France and Germany, possibly because Kurds can vote in these countries and political parties want their votes. How can they get their votes? Just sit and watch them waving their flags, do nothing to stop PKK supporters financing PKK. European countries may not be directly supporting PKK, but they are definitely doing nothing against them.
[deleted] t1_j1tvafk wrote
[removed]
sleep-woof t1_j1uko3i wrote
>I don't blame you for mistrusting them
says the guy with the profile picture of a nazi ally...
PackTactics t1_j1uo0jz wrote
Coughs except sometimes hundreds of billions of dollars of international aid every once and a while Cough
CakeEnjoyur t1_j1usxxi wrote
Maybe let the Kurds control their own lives? The UK learned this lesson with Ireland. Turkey should be like the UK and not get terrorised because they can't let go of their colonised peoples.
Arcsindorei t1_j1v6rp7 wrote
The UK didn't learn any lesson with Ireland. Keeping Ireland just for the sake of imperial pride did not make sense for the British; Ireland was not that valuable. Otherwise why would they oppose Scottish independence? Could it be related to the natural resources they possess?
More than half of Kurds in Turkey are happy with their Turkish citizenship. So it is actually a minority that supports separatism and terrorism in Turkey.
CakeEnjoyur t1_j1vl1fy wrote
What about Syria that Turkey is currently invading so the Kurds can't have their own country? I never meant that the UK learned anything from that, but the IRA got most of what they wanted. You shouldn't be so obtuse to not understand what I meant.
Arcsindorei t1_j1vv4x0 wrote
There are just so many wrongs with your point of view mate.
First, what you are implying is that if sovereign nations don't want terrorists attack them, they must negotiate with them. This perspective suggests that the US should have made official contact with el qaida, or ISIS so that they stopped attacking their country. This is complete bollocks, you never negotiate with organizations that are recognized as terrorist.
Second, just like there are Kurds in southeastern Turkey, there are Turks there as well. Turkish people, language and culture have been present in that region for hundreds of years, and Kurdish nationalism and separatism completely ignore this fact. They do not have the right to found their country in Turkish territory.
Third, the matter in Syria is not exactly the same with Kurdish separarism in Turkey, or Irish separatism in 1920s UK. YPG in Syria is an illegal organization as it violates a sovereign nation's territory, sells its natural resources to overseas nations like the US, then with that money buy heavy weaponry to arm their millitants. It just happens that their millitants use mortars and similar explosives on civilian structures in Turkey, in support of PKK. It is true that they want to found their own state, however every action they have taken so far has caused obvious security threats to the countries surrounding them. Turkey, Syria, Iraq have every right to defend themselves and act against such threats.
Kurdish nationalist just have to find a peaceful solution to their problem. Otherwise they just become terrorists.
feckdech t1_j1vc38n wrote
I'd guess the Kurds are in the same situation Jews were at before 2WW.
Only after the war, the British decided to give Israel region to them. That rose conflict, Arab/Muslim world has for centuries considered their land, even if historically it was once Jewish.
What's worse is that we can't make peace. Everyone's claims are valid in their own eyes. That's what's been happening with Ukraine. And now Serbia and Kosovo (Kosovo unilaterally declared independence, US was the first to recognize), Turkey and Kurds, Israel and Palestinians. India and Pakistan (Kashmir and Bangladesh).
BanBreaking t1_j1tw55t wrote
Thank you komşu. at least someone has their wits about them. people on here saying bat shit insane stuff.
nafarafaltootle t1_j1wnuw4 wrote
>It's like saying all Germans are Nazis, or all Palestinians are in the Hamas.
This is an insult to Germans. Practically nobody in Germany supports nazism.
voiceof3rdworld t1_j1upu4d wrote
The guy who commited this act wasn't mental racist, he was a white supremacist terrorist.. this was an act of terrorism yet no one is calling it that
nooo82222 t1_j1v6whv wrote
Waaaaiiittt. In non American countries it’s mental health issue. In the US it’s a gun control issue or how the US is full of racist people or something
Localbearexpert t1_j1v0eug wrote
Fuck the both sides thing, people should be talking shit about Turkeys government and their constant genocide of Kurds.
Arcsindorei t1_j1v6zs2 wrote
Well, in this context people should be talking about rising racism and neo-nazism in Western Europe.
Localbearexpert t1_j1vty5u wrote
Prob should.
escap0 t1_j1vur85 wrote
18% of Turkish citizens are Kurdish. 18% of the Turkish military is Kurdish. There is a Kurdish political party in Turkey called The Peoples' Democratic Party. It controls 56 seat out of 600 in the Grand National Assembly with hundreds of provincial and municipal councillors.
Turkey’s beef is with the PKK and the YPG.
Basically you don’t know what the F you are talking about.
Localbearexpert t1_j1z831u wrote
Tell me more about how acceptable it is to speak Kurdish in Turkey.
escap0 t1_j1zk2tc wrote
Glad you asked. It is very acceptable. I lived there over a decade. Plenty of Kurdish spoken daily. It would be hard to even go a single day in public without hearing some Kurdish. What is not allowed is Kurdish as a primary language in the public education system. You can learn any language as a secondary language, but they want Turkish to be your mother tongue. Private schools can teach any language as well. A secondary language is very common in Turkey. Usually it is English.
LiedAboutKnowingMe t1_j1tfmrm wrote
None of this would have happened if they weren’t forced to be refugees in the first place.
Don’t both sides this.
Turks should come out in support. You can rephrase it. “What’s so sad about this thing is that some rando idiot walks into a salon, kills a few foreign people, and the Turks still can’t find it in themselves to support the victims of this senseless attack because of their own bigotry.”
Yagibozan t1_j1tg6nx wrote
Overwhelming amount of Kurds in Europe are either from Iraq and Syria, or they are economic migrants from Iran and Turkey.
A large portion claimed asylum to obtain residency/work permits.
LiedAboutKnowingMe t1_j1tir89 wrote
Get lost.
I hope people are more immune to this type of redirection since the George Floyd uprisings brought about more awareness of how systematic issues can be so easily dismissed.
Yagibozan t1_j1tl1lq wrote
> Get lost.
Wow I'm so intimidated lol
another-masked-hero t1_j1tmtci wrote
> Turks should come out in support. You can rephrase it. “What’s so sad about this thing is that some rando idiot walks into a salon,…”
Why did you remove the “racist” description that the original commenter had for the attacker? Sounds like an omission unless you’re trying to make a point that I don’t get.
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