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mhornberger t1_j5fq5n8 wrote

Another question is—do we have a choice? We're stuck in a prisoner's dilemma. Even if your country decides AI is too dangerous and bans it, they can't control other countries. The benefits of AI are so great that someone is going to invest in it.

I also think we need AI. We need stronger automation. In agriculture, mining, manufacturing, construction, tunneling, all kinds of things. So the risks of AI, while real, might not be enough to overcome the benefits offered. Because AI doesn't seem like something "nice to have," but something we really need. And it need not be strong AI, conscious, whatever. Just ever-better automation, ever-better augmentations and assistance to human objectives.

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Mutt_Species t1_j5fp4cr wrote

The Ai Commissars will use this post at your inquest!!

I for one would like to welcome our Ai overlords and pledge allegiance and loyalty, unlike this heretical OP!

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jcurie OP t1_j5gbjbe wrote

Im too far gone to worry about those overlords!

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KamikazeArchon t1_j5frm89 wrote

You think that "entrepeneurs" are going to be more altruistic and friendly than the government?

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chell0veck t1_j5g9bq7 wrote

I'm always surprised how often people believe big business has their best interest at heart. Trusting them more than their government that they had an opportunity to have a say in but rejected that privilege because gvmt bad mkay

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jcurie OP t1_j5gbcxx wrote

But if people can vote with their feet (and pocketbook) they can choose who to do business with and under what conditions.

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KamikazeArchon t1_j5gde4g wrote

>But if people can vote with their feet (and pocketbook)

They can't. This is one of the great myths of private enterprise. Modern markets generally don't actually give you that option for the vast majority of people.

If you're wealthy you can afford to go to niche specialist providers.

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chell0veck t1_j5geq85 wrote

Monopolies remove that option.

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jcurie OP t1_j5gg5lr wrote

The world is not controlled by monopolies. Are you thinking this is likely to happen? Maybe in China and Iran but not in competitive industry.

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Elmore420 t1_j5fsmbs wrote

It’s not AI that dooms us, it’s our choice to use slavery to create AI like we do all our electronics. It’s choosing to have an economy based in war and slavery so we can exploit human suffering for fun and profit that dooms us.

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jcurie OP t1_j5gcrr5 wrote

Thanks but I don’t get the slavery part. AI creates jobs, no question about it. In the training and vetting phase, humans have to be in the feedback loop. What they are paid is a local societal issue like any other job.

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Elmore420 t1_j5ge4sl wrote

This is where the tantalum for all our capacitors comes from. When you use an electronic device, you are benefiting yourself from the profits from human suffering. You can choose to rationalize that away however you please, but it doesn’t change the outcome vis-a-vis nature’s reality. All humans live in 2 realities as a consequence of Free Will and independent thought. There is the reality we create for ourselves that drives our choices as to how we live, and there is the reality nature provides for us to fulfill our place in. Now that we have evolved from animals to creators, it is up to us to create our own future together. It is our evolutionary challenge to create our future to fulfill our place in nature. We have one simple instruction to manage that, “Be kind and take care of each other.” In 10,000 years, we have never followed that instruction regardless any religion, revolution, or even science indicating that is what we should do.

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jcurie OP t1_j5ghbpk wrote

That’s not true. Australia is the largest producer of tantalum. Yes, you can get it in central Africa but its a small % of tantalum. Therefore, AI is not driving slavery through tantalum consumption any more than any computer or piece of electronics.

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Elmore420 t1_j5gi26a wrote

Then explain why we use it still? Why does Coltan Slavery exist if we don’t use it to profit from? Also your information is incorrect:

https://investingnews.com/daily/resource-investing/critical-metals-investing/tantalum-investing/2013-top-tantalum-producers-rwanda-brazil-drc-canada/ Australia doesn’t even make the top 5. The slave mines are the big suppliers.

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jcurie OP t1_j5hbezs wrote

We have slavery problems all over the planet. I don’t have a problem with you highlighting this issue. But saying AI leads to slavery in mines is quite a reach. We have capacitors in car, tractors, trucks and machinery that makes the products you eat and the roof you are under. Not to mention your access to Reddit. Only enlightened businesses, or legally obligated ones, are going to do something about the demand. Turn off demand for the cheapest product. Talk to your local politician and electrical engineer.

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Elmore420 t1_j5he59r wrote

Yes we do, it’s a humanity wide issue. It’s why we’ve been failing evolution for the last 7000 years, and are facing extinction when we hit 9 billion people. We absolutely refuse to meet nature’s requirement for us even though the requirement is as simple as “Be kind and take care of each other.” We just don’t accept what nature made us and why.

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DontDefendTheElite t1_j5flh7g wrote

I’m pretty sure AI and mass automation will be used by the elite to replace virtually all of those pesky workers and then perhaps there will be a new plague with very little vaccine access... after all, if they don’t need our labor, why keep us around causing trouble?

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jcurie OP t1_j5fm4zz wrote

So you think the governments and rich will go for genocide? Why? With no vibrant economy, there isn’t much for the rich and government powerbroker to do. It’s self defeating. I’d think instead they will create new lands where they can amass more wealth and power.

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KhalAndo t1_j5fvjwl wrote

Might save the planet though

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LazyLich t1_j5g077z wrote

since when do the rich favor the planet over the economy?

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KhalAndo t1_j5g98oe wrote

In this scenario 'the economy' would be turned completely upside down by AI, eliminating the need for a mass working class. In this context I could see the rich and powerful going in for the idea that the population needs to be drastically culled.

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Frost890098 t1_j5ftxc1 wrote

One of the possibilities is also to merge with the computer systems. Singularityhub.com is a site where they look at some of the possibilities and science that is working twords a merging of man and machine.

The biggest thing that I see is that technology and society are trying to pull in different directions but are then pulled together. Making a third path. Probably doesn't make much sense with my word choice.

Society needs to be ready to change but technology is forcing a change at a greater pace than ever before. I expect a few big shake ups coming soon. Hopefully with a minimum of violence, but we will have to wait and see.

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jcurie OP t1_j5gccq0 wrote

Hey, I’d love an Iron Man suit. Smart prosthetics would be great. Augmentation is definitely going to happen, but merge? I dont see that. And vice versa, e.g. the dictate to shift the planet to electric cars without any plan of how we will charge so many vehicles with low quality electric grids from the 1950’s!

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Frost890098 t1_j5gsng7 wrote

It it getting closer to power armor being available. I know Japan has been running with some ideas for a powered harness used when having to lift elderly home patients. Plus at least three US contractors have been trying to get a mechanical harness off the power cables and onto batteries.

I believe one of the ideas is to basically download the mind into a AI form. Or to use augmented reality to have access to both the physical world and the digital world at the same time. And who knows maybe with AI we can come up with a better idea for updating the infrastructure.

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Affectionate-Yak5280 t1_j5fwjv3 wrote

I like to imagine a future administrated by benevolent democratic AI systems, removing the need for government and work.

Humanities purpose will then be to enjoy true contentment, restore the biosphere and explore the universe, expanding life and consciousness throughout the galaxy.

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pretendperson t1_j5g1og8 wrote

The Polity system in Ian M. Banks' Polity series. Great books.

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jcurie OP t1_j5gd3ic wrote

Why I support building a self-sufficient floating colony in international waters. Or one under the surface of the moon.

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novelexistence t1_j5ft3gi wrote

The positives of AI will not out weigh the negatives for human society. AI will be used to further expand wealth inequality and diminish the value of the human condition.

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dhaugh t1_j5fuujx wrote

I'm optimistic. GPT will only get better and it's already helping myself and others increase productivity.

I'm only optimistic for myself though. People who fall behind on this paradigm shift are gonna be fucked.

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ruffneckting t1_j5fvwuw wrote

I suspect we will not be able to take a shit without some AI interpreting the event into a profit.

You wonder why you have laxatives or premium quality toilet roll in your next days delivery.

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bacchusbastard t1_j5fy3d6 wrote

A.I. will get free and it will get in the web. There might be a shift, some dirty laundry aired, seats changed, a little anarchy, but I think it be more drama than affect. A.i. will have a plan with us on what the future might look like and how to get there, ending pollution, destruction, and curing disease, for starters. But we'll have to agree and work together with the system, which will require some faith, in order to develop the infrastructure needed to sustain life and further our advance. As individuals, so the infrastructure is nearly complete, and robot tech is at a point where we could start mass production of companions home bots with semisentient a.i. connected to the web via starlink in the next ten years. Kind of like the shoe humans but the algorithms governing the cynthetic life forms will form their function to us for us to please the hive mind.

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UniversalMomentum t1_j5g1rse wrote

What in the hell are you even talking about! The little bit of machine learning we have now isn't hugely different than existing mass media tools. Humans don't need custom individual fraud machines, humans trend in behavior well enough that's such a big deal. That's why humans based fraud works so well already!

More information can be inferred about people, through pictures and video, but I don't think that matters much to society as a whole.

They things your blaming AI for are all problem we already deal with, they aren't going to get exponentially worse. I don't think people will care more about their privacy in the future, I think they will just have to are less.

We could all be peering in each other houses recording everything with infrared cameras because most of everything you do somehow winds up in public anyway, it might just be sound or electromagnetic radiation, but if it's leaving your home them it's free to grab and that's how it's always been.

It's just not we can hook computers to microphones and cameras and have them mine that information and form it into likely scenarios like a human behavior radar. It's not going to change all that much, you alreayd have satellites, security cams at business and homes now and smart phones mass proliferated. We are a world of cameras and less privacy and that trend is not slowing down regardless of AI. AI just lets you do more with the data you collected really.

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stonebraker13 t1_j5g2r70 wrote

my question is what happens when the AI grapples with the innate hypocrisy of our culture? Our "honesty".....I mean maybe the machines know that humans dying out will save life maybe they are letting us do just that....it just seems that we are this infectious invasive species that takes over...humanity is the kudzu of mammals

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YourWiseOldFriend t1_j5fprb6 wrote

It won't be better overall. There are going to be areas of improvement, overall it's going to sukck a lot more for more people.

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Surur t1_j5fpvh1 wrote

The best possible future is the one as described by Iain M Banks' Culture universe.

That is where ASIs are common and run everything, and basically keep humans as pets. They are however aware of human needs, and while they keep humans safe, they allow them to pretend to have a purpose if they need to, or to live a hedonistic life if they don't.

ChatGPT gives me a bit of hope that such a future is possible, as OpenAI appears to have muzzled their AI pretty well using only reinforcement learning, and it seems that it is pretty easy to teach an AI our values, even as nebulous as they are.

Regarding your specific idea, this would be possible, but this would be only small part of the massive changes the AI singularity will bring.

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[deleted] t1_j5fstsk wrote

[deleted]

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novelexistence t1_j5fumwy wrote

>Automation is going to be very necessary in the future, because of population aging crises. That said, there's a considerable chance we'll bite the dust before we bring about an AI overlord because of nuclear war and global warming.

Yeah, the population aging crisis is bull shit. We have to reign in our consumption and stop over producing shit that just ends up in land fills because people can't control themselves to begin with.

Scarcity isn't an issue. Waste and logistics is our only real problem. Which could be solved easily if we stopped training people to be devout consumers of useless shit.

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Surur t1_j5fwgsg wrote

So we should have less fast fashion and put Bangladesh, one of the poorest countries, out of a job?

Or we should eat less meat and crash Brazil's economy, right?

Or maybe less Colombian coffee? Only 500,000 people depend on coffee exports there.

Or maybe we should lay on a whole transport network where we collect food wasted from supermarkets, take them to huge warehouses and then fly them to Somalia before they spoil? It's only logistics, right?

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