Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments

DawnExplosion t1_jdn176z wrote

Look, I'm a conservative-ISH person. I'm not into the woke stuff. However, what is this outcry over drag? I just don't get it. I'm afraid the Right is using it as a smokescreen to hide something worse on their side. I've only been to a few places that had drag queens and they were funny and nice. I just don't see the problem.

7

Riftus t1_jdnmjzx wrote

>I'm afraid the Right is using it as a smokescreen to hide something worse on their side

Of course it is. That's how it has always worked. With the last 15-20 years of social progress for queer folk, the pendulum is now on the other side and being deathly transphobic has become normalized. The drag community is being used as a scapegoat for wueer people and will be tossed aside once attacking queer people themselves becomes normalized (more than it already is)

28

EveArgent t1_jdp5dnf wrote

What "Woke stuff" do you object to?

I'm really wondering, I do not understand this perspective and I am curious what the problem is.

4

DawnExplosion t1_jdpjyad wrote

I don't want to ever hurt anyone's feelings. But I think it is moronic to say there are more than two genders and that men can have babies. I think it's pure racism to be anti-white. I think it's leftist fascism to criticize those of us who value the family unit. Why can the left believe as it wants and that has to be law? Why can't I disagree?

0

EveArgent t1_jdpp8mn wrote

I wasn't trying to start fight and I don't think responsibility for the comment below me if it starts to fight. I was just really curious.

It's weird that the left thinks the right is fascist and the right thinks the left is fascist and that's a really dangerous place for us to be in.

My question is does it hurt you in any way to let other people define their gender differently? Besides that, you disagree. Like what harm does it do? The thing is, the left isn't trying to make it law that there's more than two genders, they would rather just be left alone and be allowed to exist.

It's a difficult place to be in because one sides very loud trying to defend their personhood and one sides very loud trying to defend their beliefs. But I truly think that both sides could probably be happy if everyone just agreed to leave everyone else alone. Like there's no harm in someone identifying as not a man or a woman, as there is no harm in someone identifying as a man or a woman. It's just something they deal with. I don't fully understand. But that's ok. I don't have to understand everything.

Your can absolutely disagree.

In my view, It's just that on one hand saying that someone else's identity is invalid threatens their personhood and agency to make choices and have a personal freedom. And it does nothing to you to let them do that. But denying it denies their personhood which historically has led to murdering and genocide and that's what they fear.

I think it's interesting that we've become so afraid of each other and it's really sad because honestly I don't think either side wants to hurt the other. But I think both sides are scared of losing their personhood and are reflexively lashing out where it's not needed. That makes me sad.

But thank you for sharing. Sometimes find it difficult to get into the headspace of someone who sees things differently and I think we could all use that kind of interaction. Understanding is what we need as a whole people. And things are just so high emotion that it's hard to get there sometimes.

Anyway. I wish you love and good fortune.

5

DawnExplosion t1_jdqo3gx wrote

Beautifully written. You've given me a lot to think about. It's nice to have honest conversations without name calling. You're right, I agree that most folks don't want to hurt anyone. I certainly don't and fully support free expression. I think what offends my sensibilities is the extremists that seem to drive the conversation (or at least get the news coverage).

2

EveArgent t1_jdx7sx7 wrote

Yeah. It's like they do it on purpose so that we don't get together and fight them for basic human rights or something like France right now.

Thanks for being a cool guy and having an open mind for conversation to happen. I'm glad I could be a cool person in this exchange too. Our country really has a yelling at people problem and I think it's very unproductive and divisive.

1

gdex86 t1_jdpo9io wrote

Except there are more then two genders. Since gender is a social construct. Even if you meant sex sciences answer is "most people fit these two boxes. Generally. Ignore those ones sticking out of the side. But we also have all these other boxes for people that definitely don't fit in those two."

Very few people are anti white and anti white isn't part of wokeness in general. The woke people want an honest teaching of our history so people learn how racism ended up shaping the history of this country be it the treatment of black slaves, indigenous peoples, Asian immigrants, even the histories of the non waspy Europeans that eventually got folded into white. Because know about and being honest about it helps keep from repeating the same or similar mistakes. Even the dreaded idea of white privilege is that the world treats you differently on how you are perceived racially and while life isn't all roses and joy being white there are several places where it does make it easier and if you are white you maybe don't notice because it's never effected you.

Again very few seriously criticize the traditional family unit. They criticize that it is the ultimate end goal and the best option for everyone. A married mom and dad is fine, but so is two married moms, two married dad's, a mom and dad that are separated but co parrent, single parents, and even whole family raising a kid. It's like when people say feminism criticizes the family unit. No it doesn't. It wants the idea of a stay at home mom to be an option women opt into because they want to, not be the only path forward when pregnant.

4

EveArgent t1_jdppgg8 wrote

I have personally decided to start using the terms, "stay at home father" and "working father" because I think it's funny. And asking people. "Is your wife ok with you working?"... It's because it's such a ridiculous thing that men say to us. Like who fucking cares. They're not the owner of women. Lol

4

Kabloosh75 t1_jdoc687 wrote

There's been this push for drag shows to be performed in front of minors like it is some sort of family friendly activity.

I think it depends. Like if I saw a parade float with some drag queens on it I think it's harmless fun.

However, if you've ever been to a drag queen bar it can get nuts there. Not really a place for kids.

I do not think we should be criminalizing men wearing dresses and putting on makeup but I also don't think we should be taking kids to the bar to watch drag shows even if it is being "catered" to children.

−5

TheArchitect_7 t1_jdodtnw wrote

If you’ve ever been to a BAR, it can get nuts there. Not really a place for kids.

Weird argument. Some events have kids in mind, some don’t.

13

[deleted] t1_jdn34y2 wrote

[removed]

−23

mikeyHustle t1_jdn3k8o wrote

You're reading sex into places where it isn't. You're the one pushing sex into these situations. The drag performers aren't acting sexually. The kids aren't perceiving any sex. They're hearing average childrens' stories read by people doing performance art.

You don't understand the difference between sex and gender, and your comment is getting very violent about it.

29

[deleted] t1_jdn5ogj wrote

[removed]

−17

Yen-sama t1_jdnb637 wrote

Men dressing in women's clothing for theater is a centuries-old phenomenon. It's not a fetish, it is an art form.

18

BethiIdes89 t1_jdndd0d wrote

Drag is in no way a fetish. People do drag for a ton of reasons. Could someone do drag as a fetish? Sure. But it's in no way inherent to what drag is and certainly isn't happening 99% of the time. If you read a book, watched an episode of Drag Race, watched "Paris is Burning," or just talked to a drag queen, you'd know that. But instead you'd prefer to call them all pedophiles, which is horrifying and hateful. A drag queen making sexually lewd jokes at an adult show does not mean they're a pedophile or trying to evoke anything other than a laugh. And not all drag queens make sexually lewd jokes.

You don't know what you're talking about, and I don't think you're interested in learning. You can't come to a conversation in good faith by calling an entire group of people pedophiles. Educate yourself or mind your own business. And if you're actually interested in protecting kids, go talk to a CPS worker about the reality of what child abuse actually is in this state.

13

[deleted] t1_jdnees7 wrote

[removed]

−11

BethiIdes89 t1_jdnk3dw wrote

No, you're not listening. Again, you're assuming people do drag as a kink/for sexual gratification. That's not the reality. There are lots of reasons to do drag--entertainment, commenting on gender stereotypes, getting to express a part of yourself that doesn't conform to what's traditionally expected of your gender (there is such a thing as drag kings), political activism, and making money as a performer, to name a few reasons.

If a drag queen is doing a library reading for kids or some other event where there's a high likelihood of kids being present, they're not making sexual jokes or comments. If a drag queen makes those jokes at an evening show for adults and a kid happens to be there, that is not on the drag queen. That's on the parents for bringing their kids to a show that's not meant for kids. If a kid goes to a sexually explicit movie that depicts straight people, is it the filmmakers and actors' trying to enact a fetish on those kids? Or does that only apply if the movie depicts gay people?

You're relying on old, harmful stereotypes of gay people as pedophiles, whether or not you recognize it. Most adults-- gay, straight, and everything else out there--are sexual beings, and we all say sexual things and sometimes talk about it in performances, movies, books, etc. Is this inherently enacting on a fetish?

And to answer why drag queens are performing in front of kids, for example, reading a book at a library, it's about kids learning about acceptance of people different from them and because drag queens are like walking cartoon characters and that's fun for kids.

Again, you probably should try to learn about what is actually happening instead of making generalized statements that are based on stereotypes meant to demonize and harm a group of people.

9

[deleted] t1_jdnl0u6 wrote

[removed]

−9

BethiIdes89 t1_jdnlh7n wrote

if you're not willing to actually have a conversation and back up anything you say, fine. But I hope for your kids and my kids' sakes that if they one day turn out to be gay and want to do drag, that you can still love them and treat them a full human beings.

9

SeptasLate t1_jdo1x0r wrote

Where are you that you can't currently keep your kids away from drag story time without the government protecting you?

3

Thisfuckingwebsite t1_jdnlnbz wrote

They do it in front of kids for the same reason you let kids watch you at the doctors - to show that there is nothing to fear

6

TherabbitTrix0 t1_jdpx2uj wrote

Where is the group of drag performers that say they MUST perform in front of kids?

Why were alter severs only allowed to be young boys for so many years…hmm. I can’t stand people arguing about drag performers when there is a whole other group of people that are abusing kids.

3

PettyAndretti t1_jdn3wxq wrote

Just thinking about that show “To Catch A Predator” and how they exposed husbands, fathers, police, firemen, faith leaders, & community leaders. But NEVER a Drag Queen…

But yea man, woodchippers, fuck yea

20

[deleted] t1_jdn5gi6 wrote

[deleted]

−26

Yen-sama t1_jdnbhgr wrote

Plenty of examples of white, straight, god-loving men that end up being sexual predators and pedophiles too. 🤔

10

[deleted] t1_jdnclsx wrote

[removed]

−1

Yen-sama t1_jdnczbw wrote

Okay, but we aren't out here attacking and outlawing that entire demographic as a whole, even when the chances of a child being abused by that demographic is much higher than a child being abused by someone from the drag community.

14

[deleted] t1_jdndwi1 wrote

[deleted]

−5

BethiIdes89 t1_jdnmpwi wrote

Hey, guys, we've been doing government wrong! We should all just trust this guy and base all policies that impact people like him on his gut nstead of evidence and experience!

7

Thisfuckingwebsite t1_jdnlz2b wrote

So you must want to ban church and christianity then, too, right?

7

[deleted] t1_jdnmykv wrote

[deleted]

0

Thisfuckingwebsite t1_jdnnvzg wrote

Agreed but since you seemingly want to ban all transgenders from (existing? i guess) around kids because some (which youve failed to cite or identify) allegdly groomed or abused kids

So logically, more than just the individuals in the church, to be consistent with your stance on transgenders, you must be against all of Christianity right?

2

[deleted] t1_jdnp9fh wrote

[deleted]

1

Thisfuckingwebsite t1_jdnq520 wrote

Nah you just delete comments when your weak ass idiot thoughts get exposed. Theres a reason nobody respects you,. Its because of who you are, as a person

5

[deleted] t1_jdnr3xu wrote

[deleted]

0

Thisfuckingwebsite t1_jdnrhs1 wrote

I love dem pedos

2

[deleted] t1_jdnseem wrote

[deleted]

0

Thisfuckingwebsite t1_jdnsw34 wrote

Screenshot

of a comment

thats been deleted

PURE galaxy brain. Keep it up fatty you are cracking me up

6

[deleted] t1_jdnt9d9 wrote

[deleted]

1