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[deleted] t1_irip067 wrote

Reply to comment by X_PRSN in A Pennsylvania prison gets a Scandinavian-style makeover – and shows how the US penal system could become more humane by JBupp

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QuillVance t1_irisutq wrote

You should really read the article or alternatively just stop wishing for the unnecessary suffering of other people.

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BidenSniffsYaKids t1_irjqz75 wrote

lol we have teens car jacking people at gun point everyday in Philly. We have pre teens murdering the elderly with traffic cones. The criminal population of America and the criminal population of Denmark, Norway, and Sweden are not equal.

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[deleted] t1_irkbcmx wrote

I didn’t know you thought children should spend the rest of their life in prison. Maybe we should just kill them on the spot and save everyone the effort hu? Since they are clearly sub human beings?

Seriously. What do you think when you say “pre teens do X terrible thing?” Cuz what I hear is a complete failure to ensure they had a chance to even be normal.

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[deleted] t1_irito6v wrote

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bk1285 t1_irja1vb wrote

You got the link to your research that you completed on Scandinavian prisons?

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[deleted] t1_irjbbh5 wrote

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bk1285 t1_irjd28p wrote

Oh so basically you have no expertise in the matter and the conclusions you drew from your own “research” should be ignored

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[deleted] t1_irjet34 wrote

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bk1285 t1_irjg6ka wrote

Yeah but I’m not the one cutting that I did research…you are

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[deleted] t1_irjget5 wrote

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bk1285 t1_irjuh9w wrote

So I have a BA in history, a BSE in Secondary Education, and a MA in clinical mental health counseling so I’ve done plenty of research but I never purport to go against what a majority of studies will say

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ItsjustJim621 t1_irjq0q9 wrote

What’s a “real” college?

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[deleted] t1_irjv3ej wrote

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ItsjustJim621 t1_irjvm71 wrote

Lol ok. You can get the same education from an online school as you would a B&M school for 1/4 of the tuition….But go on with your ad hom attacks. Not a good look coming from a graduate from a school that turned a blind eye to kids getting raped all in the name of football

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[deleted] t1_irjx98y wrote

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ItsjustJim621 t1_irjxeqr wrote

You do realize they’re not the only online school right? Purdue, WGU, heck, even Ped State….but go on…nobody cares where you went to school….nobody on here nor your employers

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[deleted] t1_irjy0q8 wrote

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ItsjustJim621 t1_irjye8f wrote

Umm, me…I’m doing it….bachelors in cybersecurity, and following it up with a masters.

So you’re saying the certification exams for IT certifications are a joke? Like the CCNA, CISSP, CySA, CCIE etc….those are a joke to you? Those are literally educational, instructive, and rigorous.

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[deleted] t1_irk7k3j wrote

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[deleted] t1_irk8fym wrote

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bk1285 t1_irk91ry wrote

Defund what? That’s just horrible branding…reallocate funds to ensure services are done well…If you have your home robbed while you are at work, what good is the police coming to your home? Why not have social workers who are trained to help you file a report and are able to put you in contact with programs and other services who may be able to help you?

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LittleLight85 t1_iriz4ru wrote

>Prisoners should not live better than our working class.

This doesn’t make the point you think it does

>We have a different culture than Scandinavia. Norwegians aren't killing each other over literally nothing daily like Americans.

Yeah, the extreme socioeconomic inequality is a major driving force for crime in the US. We have a culture that keeps people poor and desperate, or mentally ill with no resources, and wonder why there’s a crime and violence problem.

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[deleted] t1_irj37p9 wrote

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Joe_Jeep t1_irjq7e8 wrote

The culture problem comes from inequality and decades(really centuries) of damages inflicted on the poor and minority groups in general

Your idea seems to be continuing to punish it out of the folks already in a terrible position

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X_PRSN t1_irivpa8 wrote

I think where you and I have an opportunity to come to further agreement is find common ground on the definitions of "comfortable" and "nice." See, I think prisons should, in fact, have swimming pools and tennis courts. But I also don't think of them as luxuries. I think of them as necessities - because attending to one's mental health means more than weekly visits to a shrink or going to group. It's also finding good outlets for stress, and because people are individuals, it's logical to offer as many recreational and creative outlets as can be practical. And I really don't think I'm suggesting anything that's out of reach for any working class citizen.

More than that, though, and for better for for worse, prisoners live in a community of their own. The more reflective that community is of society in general, the more well-adjusted they'll be, which I believe will lead to lower recidivism, and maybe - just maybe - begin to transform the US into a less violent culture. Not saying it'll happen overnight, obviously, but an evolution in that direction, starting with how we treat the people who break society's laws, can be a good thing.

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[deleted] t1_iriwegu wrote

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X_PRSN t1_irixruv wrote

Frankly, yes.

I mean, we don't have to be talking about the local country club. Any YMCA is going to have these. (Since we're talking specifically about swimming pools and tennis courts, I happen to know of several in my town that are free.) And there are programs for lower income folks to assist with fees, as well as access to mental health care. It's really not as impractical as you're suggesting.

But this is a tangent from my original point, which is that as a society, we owe it to ourselves to ensure that the people we remove from society for a time don't make things worse for themselves or us when they come home. That means changing our collective attitude. Discussions like ours are part of that evolution.

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LittleLight85 t1_irizsr2 wrote

A Y membership is like $50/month. I wouldn’t say lower income people are utilizing that much.

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Relax007 t1_irkpfzh wrote

My local YMCA has free or reduced rates for low income families. Is that not done everywhere (or is $50 the reduced rate)? I haven’t been a member in years and I can’t remember how that program works.

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devinchi18 t1_irjkhbf wrote

I like the way you think and speak. Have an ASU

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[deleted] t1_irj3y2j wrote

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random6x7 t1_irjae9w wrote

Once upon a time we did. My mom basically used the community pool as our summer babysitter (ah, the 80s). The one we went to as kids is gone now, but we were in an emphatically working class neighborhood to the point that we got free lunches at the community center in the summers. That park, with the community center and the pool, didn't have tennis courts, but it had baseball diamonds, soccer fields, a street hockey rink, and basketball hoops, both indoor and outdoor. And a playground, and free events like concerts. Our disinvestment in our communities should not be an excuse to treat people who are even worse off in an even shittier way.

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DarthEeveeChan t1_iritg0m wrote

It doesn't have to be the point of incarceration. I think prisons should normally be for rehabilitation. Studies show that most crime is out of desperation rather than malice so I think if we can use prisons to help people be better ready to succeed in society instead of using prisons to deter people from crime out of fear then we will, overall, improve the crime rates.

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[deleted] t1_iriue1z wrote

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EnOhVeHey t1_irj2fsx wrote

I mean, so you strongly dispute it based on science? Or your feelings?

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[deleted] t1_irj5ngi wrote

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EnOhVeHey t1_irjv5co wrote

Like which?

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[deleted] t1_irjwj7p wrote

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EnOhVeHey t1_irk4ore wrote

Like which specifically?

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[deleted] t1_irk67m8 wrote

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EnOhVeHey t1_irk853h wrote

You really are as useless as I thought you were.

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[deleted] t1_irk8y5s wrote

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EnOhVeHey t1_irk9v87 wrote

Half of my family is police force (my uncle just graduated yesterday!) so that’s a dumb assumption on your part. And what does the police force have to do with our prisons you act like the police are judge and jury.

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dratseb t1_irix3cj wrote

Who’s going to tell mr “I don’t want prisons to get comfortable and nice” about club fed?

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Grouchy-Estimate-756 t1_irjc3s5 wrote

What in our current system of incarceration is actually helping rehabilitate inmates? Do you really think it's working, as it is? People should be held accountable for their actions but throwing them in prison doesn't seem to actually do that.

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[deleted] t1_irjckpu wrote

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Grouchy-Estimate-756 t1_irk0zsx wrote

It has to be imagined if we want it to exist. Continually choosing the option that doesn't work and saying "well, there don't seem to be other options" doesn't make it a good choice.

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Grouchy-Estimate-756 t1_irk15z0 wrote

Maybe we have to start looking at why Americans are killing each other over literally nothing?

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