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Koffeekage t1_j2yzapf wrote

It looks to be a manufacturing issue not a design flaw.

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DMurBOOBS-I-Dare-You t1_j2zs8cj wrote

I called this like 3 days ago ... team Green was having NONE OF IT.

Now they look dumb for trying to equate it to Nvidia's issues.

−140

Ship_Adrift t1_j30o4vm wrote

That name guy.... Cheesus.

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Legitimate-BurnerAcc t1_j30tfy0 wrote

I used to say sheesus at my old job but then got fired for saying it.

Really confusing when “merry Christmas” was often said and pushed to be said at the end of phone calls.

−50

FalloutNano t1_j34ubcq wrote

Good. The Christ Jesus is the world’s only hope.

−1

Optix334 t1_j30qkym wrote

Equate it to Nvidia issues... Which were also proven to be manufacturing problems or user error?

Weird flex

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DMurBOOBS-I-Dare-You t1_j31yxce wrote

Nvidia issue confirmed to be a design flaw - there is a big difference between an engineered flaw and a minor production issue, but Team Green can't stop sucking Nvidias dick long enough for self reflection.

Sheeple gonna sheep and line Nvidias pocket back ad infinitum. ThEy CaN dO nO wRoNg!

−4

DeBlackKnight t1_j32hkbs wrote

It's crazy how people can watch the same videos from the same handful of content creators and come to wildly different conclusions. The issue with the 12 pin connector is primarily user error. No amount of issue with the design can be used as an excuse for leaving the connector so clearly unplugged as to cause the overheating issue.

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Optix334 t1_j3333xo wrote

as someone else has pointed out to you, it was Definitively proven as User Error, and a small amount of manufacturing issues where some debris was left in the connector to cause the short. Here's a nice Gamers Nexus video where they spent thousands of dollars going to professional laboratories for analysis and trying to melt the cables:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ig2px7ofKhQ

Check your bias. You look stupid here.

3

Titanofthedinosaurs t1_j3esd3e wrote

Nice cherry pick, its a design error that can potentially induce a user error due to the lack of proper secure connection.

Edit: https://youtu.be/ig2px7ofKhQ?t=1344 literally from the section before you linked.

0

Optix334 t1_j3ew9wn wrote

"It required being VERY unseated AND ALSO pulling the cable at an angle. We tested it unseated without pulling at an angle, and it didn't fail even if it was equivalently unsocketed"

I feel like you didn't listen, or you replied to me by accident because that timestamp you edited in just supports the conclusion that it was user error.

Yall really so deep in your own bias that you're trying to equate a clip that appears to be inconsequential, and was proven such via dozens of hours of testing and analysis including X-Raying the connectors, to massive thermal issues. Get real. They almost couldn't make the connector fail when they were trying. Who's actually cherrypicking here?

1

-domi- t1_j2yp14m wrote

A "limited number." Sure, it's not an infinite number. But after AMD went out of their way to pile on nVidia, low key claiming they intentionally picked a different power connector, because nVidia's were melting, you'd think they'd take this more seriously. Considering the power connector affected less than 1% of RTX cards, and this is hitting double digits of people with a horizontally-mounted GPU (which is the standard layout).

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Mike2220 t1_j2ysirx wrote

I see they're also going for the long con of trying to disrupt Nvidia's card naming scheme 3 generations down the line

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ben1481 t1_j2yqlc7 wrote

AMD always has a weird way of putting their foot in their mouth.

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twnznz t1_j308m69 wrote

Take board, advance board, swap heatsink, resell board

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Dracogame t1_j30xma4 wrote

To be fair marketing and product development are two different things.

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Blastoxic999 t1_j2zgttk wrote

How are we supposed to know?

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maxximal t1_j2zs2hf wrote

Fry some eggs on your gpu while gaming. If you don't get food poisoning, your 7900xtx gpu is toasty and it's time for rma.

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Creepus_Explodus t1_j2zwyoz wrote

Radeon Software has hardware monitoring built in. If your junction temperature reaches 110 degrees C, your card is thermal throttling. When this happens, the clock speed of the GPU gets cut back significantly which shows as stuttering in gameplay.

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Blastoxic999 t1_j2zx75q wrote

So, if it gets too hot too fast and it lags, that means it's thermal throttling?

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Creepus_Explodus t1_j2zy0eq wrote

Essentially, yes. It's a protection mechanism for the GPU to prevent overheating, so it slows down to reduce temperature. Stuttering can have other causes though, so it's just an indicator that thermal throttling may be occurring. To actually validate it, you need some way to monitor the GPU temperature under load. You can enable an overlay in Radeon Software that shows your hardware stats during gameplay, or use some other software like GPU-Z or HWInfo.

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Blastoxic999 t1_j2zygn4 wrote

So what's the problem here with those AMD GPUs? The GPU overheats and it gets damaged? The GPU throttles too fast even tho it was not hot?

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Creepus_Explodus t1_j2zzgyz wrote

GPU junction temperatures are meant to be between 70-90°C on these air coolers. Thermal throttling should never occur unless something is seriously wrong. The card is designed to maintain peak performance at all times, while staying within the power and thermal limits. When a card thermal throttles it is exceeding its thermal limits, and must reduce its performance to maintain stability. Shutoff temperature is at 115°C, your card will actually just turn off to prevent damage when it reaches that temperature.

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Masters_1989 t1_j310sir wrote

Great series of responses.

That was very well said, and very helpful information for someone that doesn't know about GPUs like the person you replied to. Nice job - was a pleasure to see.

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onecrazyguy1 t1_j30pk04 wrote

I usually just drip water on some of the metal components and am careful to avoid the PCB.

−5

JaggedMetalOs t1_j31avgw wrote

The problem is you get terrible performance because the cooler isn't working, so the chip gets hot and slows itself right down to prevent damage.

Current theory is there isn't enough liquid in the vapor chamber so it stops working when the chip heats up.

1

JCastin33 t1_j30139g wrote

From a few videos I've watched about it, it looks as though a part in it is not well designed, specifically the vapor chamber. That being said, I don't think AMD has come out and said what the issue is specifically yet.

Anyway, it seems like the vapor chamber gets locked up and stops cooling properly, resulting in temps climbing to 110°, and then the GPU slows itself down to try drop the temps, which fails, so it just keeps slowing itself further.

0

ChrisFromIT t1_j30v9pa wrote

I don't think it is junction temperature that is reaching 110 degrees C, it is the GPU hotspot reaching 110 degrees C.

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Comander_K33N t1_j310bmt wrote

110c!! Holy moly. Old 3090ti would run at 70c, which was normal. At that temp my case was putting out some serious heat. Can’t even imagine 110c.

1

JaggedMetalOs t1_j31b1ay wrote

The problem is the cooler isn't actually moving the heat to the fins, so the heat is trapped on the chip and so the exhaust temperature is probably cool...

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DeBlackKnight t1_j32ihr9 wrote

So for one, the heat coming out of your case is solely do to the amount of wattage being used. A card can run at 60c peak and still pump out 40c+ air if it's drawing 400-500w.

For two, we are talking about junction (or hotspot, in Nvidia's case) temp, not edge temp. I do not believe for a second that anything other than a watercooled 3090ti is running at 70c junction temp. If you're comparing a watercooled cards' temps to a reference cards temps, I don't know what to tell you.

I believe that the AMD GPUs in question actually maintain fairly decent edge temps, while actively thermal throttling due to junction temps.

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sonoma95436 t1_j377yov wrote

Also has to do with efficiency. Die size shrinks generally help efficiency. Heat is wasted energy. Optimized in a perfect scenario it would minimally heat.

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BobisaMiner t1_j3lxt92 wrote

In computer chips pretty much all energy ends up as heat. But it's also not wasted energy like it would be in an internal combustion engine.

1

sonoma95436 t1_j3ndd43 wrote

Why not. In a ICE you can recover some wasted heat with a turbocharger. How do you recover wasted heat with a CPU? In fact you have to use more energy to cool it.

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BobisaMiner t1_j3ohwj6 wrote

Sorry I wasn't clear. My point was heat in a cpu is a by-product by design and yeah it's always going to be 100% wasted. I guess it heats our rooms, that's something.

But in an ICE where heat(thermal energy) is what is converted to movement.

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sonoma95436 t1_j3oy1wy wrote

In a ICE expanding heated gas from combustion is converted to mechanical energy but waste heat is inefficiency. More direct heat to energy would be a steam engine which is external combustion although steam is released which is a waste heat.

1

BobisaMiner t1_j3lxk6d wrote

I'm pretty sure your 3090ti puts out more heat, since it can eat a lot more power(450W TDP). How hot the card gets has little effect on its heat output.

1

Joebranflakes t1_j30j0d3 wrote

The nice thing about a “limited” number is that it can be limited to “one” card, “all” cards or anything in between.

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rogerflog t1_j31yl78 wrote

Yep. More half-truths from the Marketing department to downplay product issues and do damage control.

This PR statement would be a refreshing change:

“We’re sorry to have wasted your hard-earned money and time with a product that fell short of expectations. The issue with the product is _______ . AMD makes a lot of great products and there are some design and/or manufacturing issues here that are not up to our high standards. AMD will work with customers who purchased these products and begin returns, exchanges or other accommodations so that you can continue to enjoy using AMD products. We apologize for delivering you a product that did not meet your expectations and if you contact us at ________ , we’ll make it right for you.”

3

JaggedMetalOs t1_j31c5si wrote

> “all” cards

None of the cards sent to reviewers had the issue, so we know there are at least a couple of working examples :)

1

flash246 t1_j2zb1i4 wrote

Nice.

So AMD GPUs don’t work and NVIDIA GPUs are overpriced. What a great year for new computer parts

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Ramental t1_j31ae2a wrote

AMD GPUs are also overpriced, though. It's not even a question of Red vs Green. It's a question if you want to pay +200-300$ on top of an already expensive GPU or "fuck no".

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xXCreezer t1_j31hw8o wrote

Overpriced vs less overpriced but overheating.

Im over this generation

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Ethario t1_j30z4fe wrote

Pretty much how it always has been.

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jem5x5 t1_j325v8d wrote

"A curious game, Professor - the only way to win is, not to play".

2

Enschede2 t1_j31b6bf wrote

The problem is that amd support seems to have been telling people since day 1 however that this is not covered under warranty

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AfraidOfArguing t1_j35v3nj wrote

Wasn't this mentioned to be Digital River and not AMD themselves? Digital River is well known for being incredibly difficult to work with.

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dustofdeath t1_j2z11l7 wrote

What about the yet to be sold tens of thousands of cards? How many of those are broken?

And then end up sending to warranty for 3 months and you pay the post fees if you get a new damaged card.

2

thyrodent t1_j35dqjj wrote

Reminds me of my lockdown era Msi 3080ti . Had to replace the thermal pads and paste. Dropped almost 30 degrees under load. Why is this so hard on devices being sold for almost $1800

1

Punker1234 t1_j2ysajl wrote

If they know it's limited, why not just provide serial numbers for owners to check? Or some sort of reference point? This feels like they're avoiding responsibility to likely save money/face.

−9

nmyron3983 t1_j2yxz2z wrote

I think to do that they would have to identify a faulty batch or component batch that would isolate it to specific serials.

It may depend entirely on a specific as-yet to be determined confluence of parts and circumstances to have it occur for an owner. So they are being asked to self ID if the issue arises.

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Punker1234 t1_j2yzqwg wrote

Totally. But if they're stating it's a "limited number" of cards, they must have some data otherwise them saying it's limited isn't true. So release that data on effected cards. If they're saying limited because "we've only had 1000 emails about it", that's disingenuous to me because there are probably lots of people that aren't away it's an issue and are losing performance.

3

Spicy_pepperinos t1_j30o11r wrote

I mean "limited" isn't really making a statement about the absolute number of cards effected. It's just PR talk, and having data that it's limited doesn't mean they know the exact serial numbers effected.

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Buddha_Head_ t1_j30xtzc wrote

If they've batch tested their current stock and couldn't reliably reproduce the issue it would show that it isn't impacting X amount of the total.

The more impacted cards reported can help show a pattern that could help pinpoint specific faults in manufacturing.

Let's say all the throttling cards so far have shown up in the Northeast US. It will take some time to narrow that down to a truckload of defective components that dropped 3/4 of a load in NY and the remainder of that original load in MI.

3

throw4jklfj t1_j2z3bkd wrote

It's just PR words. There are a limited number of cards out there, so saying "a limited number are experiencing issues" is technically correct and doesnt introduce liability to AMD, and sounds better than "we dont know how many of our products are defective'.

1

DJSugarSnatch t1_j2z37tz wrote

Had the same issue with my last xt6700... way to keep it up AMD. At least they are consistent.

−10

Minortough t1_j30fuxg wrote

No you most definitely didn’t have this same problem lol.

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DJSugarSnatch t1_j30nh2a wrote

What? With a production issue, where my card would randomly overheat and crash my cpu? Huh... must just be me.

−15

Minortough t1_j30pk6n wrote

There could be many reasons for a gpu to overheat but the issue with the 7900 xtx has to do with the thermal chamber.

11

DJSugarSnatch t1_j30qp02 wrote

Yeah, I know. I appreciate your concerns about my former Amd purchase. Not many people even care.

−9

Ramental t1_j31b8qr wrote

It's not right the card is crashing the PC due to the overheating. The throttling should be as far as it goes.

I'd check the ventilation in your case. Maybe you have all coolers blowing out instead of some in and some out or something. Check the temp in idle and load for the CPU as well. It shouldn't be above 40 when you casually browse. Ideally - under 30. GPU might be hotter, depending on your CPU cooler, but still under 40.

It's possible to reapply the thermal paste on the GPU, but likely one needs to go for water cooling, especially if the case is not well designed for air circulation.

Finally, if you use overclock - disable it. The increase in heat is far larger than increase in performance.

4

RabidShadow t1_j2zgr70 wrote

AMD has always been the worst. im good thanks!

−29

Werkstadt t1_j311na0 wrote

>AMD has always been the worst.

Always? Know your history

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RabidShadow t1_j319rls wrote

truth hurts..

−5

Werkstadt t1_j32q9y5 wrote

Intel struggled evolving into 64-bit processors while AMD was just cruising with their awesome stable ones.

2

Tyriu t1_j3cldc7 wrote

Yeah, praise the Lord of Greens, burner of PCIE connector, Fire Hazard master, the all mighty, Nvidia.

1