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cantproveidid t1_jaaoa1n wrote

That should be easy. Identify all stockholders, the board and executive officers. Divide the amount of waste by that number, deliver the wasted to each of the above's homes.

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meowzedong1984 t1_jaapbqg wrote

Let’s be honest their short sighted greed driven mindset would just drive them to dump it down the nearest storm drain

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JohnSpartans t1_jachfo7 wrote

They are def those neighbors who's downspouts just pour right into their neighbors yards with no regard for mitigation.

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KevinTheSeaPickle t1_jae5hef wrote

Easy solution, just break a basement window and pipe that shit right back where it came from.

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iksbob t1_jaeatal wrote

Spread it over their lawn. The solution to pollution is dilution, right?

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WirelessBCupSupport t1_jad4pch wrote

FEDEX driver in my neighborhood ALWAYS fails to deliver to correct address. Might consider USPS with COD...

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somereallyfungi t1_jaclxsf wrote

The board and c-suite, sure. But going after stock holders is a pretty futile idea as blame is so distributed. Norfolk Southern is an almost incomprehensible large company, in terms of ownership. The single largest shareholder is the mutual fund Vantage (in turn owned by some 30 million private investors) and they only hold about 8% of Norfolk.

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HandsyBread t1_jacpvtf wrote

It’s more likely then not that most people who have any money invested into an index fund, 401k, retirement savings account owns some of the company.

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somereallyfungi t1_jacrm30 wrote

There is a silver lining to this distribution, though. Norfolk could be driven to bankruptcy without a significant hit to most portfolios. Unfortunately, this doesn't actually solve the problem at hand. But, the punishment could be so severe as to actually be a deterrent for cost cutting.

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HandsyBread t1_jactqpm wrote

This accident will not bankrupt Norfolk, let’s assume they had to purchase in full every single house (which won’t happen) you would be looking at $250M-1B at most, and then let’s say the total clean up cost was $1-2B. And let’s add another $500M-1B for other misc legal fees, damages, political bribes, etc. the total damage your looking at is $2-3B maybe $4B if they are able to squeeze them for every possible thing and the courts slap on additional fines. Heck even if they needed to give $1M per person to cover life long health costs, and other personal damages that would tack on other $4-5B at most.

That would just mean that they would take a loss of profits for 1-2 years. This won’t bankrupt the company or get close to bankrupting the company. And that outcome is likely to never happen, we would never see a company held responsible to this degree, but even if we did they would still be fine in the long run.

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Squire_II t1_jadbf54 wrote

> That would just mean that they would take a loss of profits for 1-2 years.

5 billion isn't even a year of profit. They're spending more than that on stock buybacks and shareholder dividends this year.

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10thDoctorHairGel t1_jabj6xy wrote

There’s higher standards applied to where the stuff is shipped than to how it got there.

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somereallyfungi t1_jacl7wy wrote

My concern is how it's getting there and the communities on the route. My understanding is that it's being trucked. Truck crashes are not unheard of, probably more frequent than train derailments.

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cryptoanarchy t1_jad17ux wrote

A crash of the soil would be much different that the chemicals themselves. A much lower level problem. Getting all the soil is not too hard, getting liquid chemicals that just go straight down in the ground is much harder.

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dangerdangerfrog t1_jadse7r wrote

Hate to inform you, but there's a lot worse stuff being shipped on our roads every day than this. But that's what DOT regulations are for

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Cold-Reflectionz t1_jaag6sg wrote

I hope its the front doorstep of 1200 Peachtree St NE, Atlanta, GA, with the rest of the garbage.

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BabySnark317537 t1_jaax2n6 wrote

So the agency that is trying to help should be the one to suffer? What about the politicians who have been bought by the railroads? What about the greedy railroad company? What about the people who voted for deregulation? Oh wait...

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SanchoMandoval t1_jab4uku wrote

A Visa office building?

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smashkraft t1_jabhu1b wrote

:shrug:

This is Norfolk Southern, it's not really all that far away, but definitely the wrong spot

650 W Peachtree St NE, Atlanta, GA 30308

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bakerfredricka t1_jae3z39 wrote

Sure, sounds like a good address to send all of this toxic shit to!

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smashkraft t1_jabhh5x wrote

aww man, I have to drive by there when I come home from work

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[deleted] t1_jab6vzd wrote

[removed]

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kslusherplantman t1_jabdnoe wrote

The article literally says it’s going to two sites, one in Indiana and one in Ohio. Previously they were sending it to Michigan and Texas, but both states complained. So now Ohio and Indiana.

Not sure where you pulled out Florida?!?

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Arrg-ima-pirate t1_jac88y6 wrote

Because they’re genuinely sending it to FL to be dumped in our deep injection wells. I understand that’s contrary to the article. And source: trust me bro. Doesn’t do well on here. But you’ll see.

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Skellum t1_jabifk1 wrote

Atlanta and GA have directly contributed to the US becoming a better nation than it was. Process the earth on site with facilities set up to clean it up.

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17times2 t1_jadzc51 wrote

> Atlanta and GA have directly contributed to the US becoming a better nation than it was.

So no company based in Atlanta needs to be held responsible for what they do? That must be nice.

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ILikeTalkn2Myself OP t1_jaaf3z7 wrote

>Officials with the Environmental Protection Agency previously said they have approved the shipment of contaminated waste to two EPA-certified sites in Ohio: Heritage Thermal Services in East Liverpool and Vickery Environmental in Vickery. Region 5 Administrator Debra Shore said Monday two more sites – one in Ohio and one in Indiana – will also receive waste from the derailment scene.
>
>The move came after officials in Texas and Michigan complained they didn’t get any warning that waste from the toxic crash site would be shipped to their states for disposal. The EPA ordered the train’s operator, Norfolk Southern, to stop the shipments Friday so that it could review the company’s disposal plans.

LOL... seriously. So, their genius plan was to spread the toxic waste across the United States. Wonderful.

Edit - let's keep track of where Norfolk Southern sends the toxic waste from their Ohio train wreck site. So far it has been public reported that at least 3 sites in OH, 1 in IN, 1 in TX and 1 in MI have been sent waste (knowingly and unknowingly):

  • Ohio
    • East Liverpool, OH
    • Vickery, OH
    • Unclosed location in OH
  • Indiana
    • Unclosed location in IN
  • Texas
    • Harris, TX
  • Michigan
    • Belleville, MI
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BabySnark317537 t1_jaaxb8h wrote

What do you think happens to hazardous waste? It is placed into regulated approved landfills. These places are happy to take people's money to put hazardous waste there. Maybe you should try talking to the people who allowed a hazardous waste landfill in their county?

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docmedic t1_jaaysam wrote

It’s probably all going according to waste disposal protocols, but the fact that the EPA had to stop and review the plans… like, is that not part of the protocol, and they just did it because it’s optics?

Can the EPA quit it with the optics? We don’t need the head to nervously pretend to sip water or for the agency to pretend to order people around.

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BabySnark317537 t1_jab14uh wrote

The state and the railroads have always been allowed to do what they want and the EPA as an agency barely has any teeth. Because of the public outcry the EPA has been allowed to tell the railroad no. And turns out Texas and Michagan didn't feel like taking the usual waste. Which means the EPA *gets * to review the plans before they are enacted. They weren't allowed before. This is real progress which is just as sad as the deregulation that led to this horrible situation.

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RunningNumbers t1_jacknps wrote

You know much of the authority of the Federal EPA has been spun off to state EPA agencies over the past few decades.

Lots of this is the responsibility of state agencies rather than federal.

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Gundamamam t1_jacfelx wrote

Like Michigan's governor getting upset that the waste was being sent to a toxic waste processing facility in michigan. Like, thats what its for. Is the governor going to try and block any other out of state businesses from using that waste disposal company or only the Norfolk Southern spill because its in the news?

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doommaster t1_jac8jg7 wrote

the fact that the EPA told people "it was safe to return to their homes" was sooo crazy to me as an outside observer... damn America is fucked.

The fact alone, that these companies are allowed to transport reactive chemicals, that interact with another in really harmful ways, all on the same train, is crazy to me.
That's like telling people to use acid and chlorine cleaner right after the other...

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AnUnderratedComment t1_jab26up wrote

Dude you don’t seem to understand how this works.

The way the initial response was handled was wrong, and so wrong it’ll likely be deemed criminal. We all agree on that.

But the contaminated soil disposal seems to be working appropriately.

There are sites across the country that receive hazardous waste. That’s their entire business. Cleaning dirty dirt. Most sites will only accept dirt that had certain contaminants, because that’s what they specialize in processing. Often, that means contaminated dirt is moved across state lines for treatment. It is absolutely not normal for states to be alerted when this happens. It’s literally just regular old interstate commerce. Are states alerted every time a tanker truck with hazardous cargo enters their borders? Of course not.

This is already a big deal. Let’s not blow it up by mixing in conspiracy theories and misleading information. It takes away from the seriousness of the situation.

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Agitated-Elevator-59 t1_jad5z2d wrote

There's no such thing as "Harris, TX". It's going to Harris COUNTY, which is in Houston.

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[deleted] t1_jaafesp wrote

[deleted]

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2_Sheds_Jackson t1_jaan4wr wrote

I find it hilarious that Texas is complaining about this. I understand why they are, but it is very funny none the less.

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[deleted] t1_jaasjwq wrote

[deleted]

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CaptainJackVernaise t1_jaax20u wrote

Without prior knowledge? The sites this is being sent to are fully licensed to handle the waste they're being shipped. They signed up to receive this stuff, and in order for it to be shipped, someone at the site needed to give them an affirmative. The TCEQ had to approve the application to be a hazardous waste disposal site. These are private companies being paid to perform a service. All waste shipments should be following all EPA RCRA and OSHA HAZWOPER requirements.

Any arguments from people that say this stuff is being sent surely don't want the government to step in and interfere with a capitalist enterprise, right?

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CharToll t1_jab4sg2 wrote

Norfolk Southern should be responsible for every penny spent on nationwide cleanup.

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RunningNumbers t1_jachdax wrote

But the environmental harm is not nationwide…

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ffrkAnonymous t1_jaciuhp wrote

Now it is

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RunningNumbers t1_jackdl3 wrote

I guess the word local now means nationwide. But then again, Reddit nihilists don’t care what the mean of words are.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2023/02/24/ohio-derailment-toxic-air-pollution/

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Myrkull t1_jaclgi3 wrote

It has affected multiple states, you're just being a Reddit pedant

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Showerthawts t1_jaehykj wrote

The town is right near the PA border. That's interstate at the very least with a plume that big and water working the way it does.

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Gtfocuzidfc t1_jadya9o wrote

“Ah don’t worry, we only irradiated one state we won’t be held accountable”

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BeltfedOne t1_jaaezew wrote

So don't move the waste to properly permitted and regulated disposal sites and just leave in East Pallestine? WTF?

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zeussays t1_jaajqk1 wrote

Yeah those states complaining makes no sense. Who should they have notified? What does that even mean? Pure politics.

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BeltfedOne t1_jaam1vi wrote

Especially when all Hazardous Waste shipments are tracked by the USEPA via their eManifest system. And all of the facilities are permitted on a federal, state, and local level. Pure noise and disinformation.

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CaptainJackVernaise t1_jaay0w0 wrote

They want the government to step in and interfere with a contract between two private entities.

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pkinetics t1_jaav38o wrote

they are complaining because they are just now realizing that hazardous waste disposal already exists in their back yard. They just ignored and forgot about it until it made the news.

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somereallyfungi t1_jact8wk wrote

I'd think notify first responders in every area they pass through. Seems like a small step that could go a long way if something goes wrong.

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zeussays t1_jacxwmv wrote

Why? This sort of material is shipped around the country daily.

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MajesticOuting t1_jaag5wr wrote

So what happens when one of these shipments derail? because apparently this happens all the time.

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neridqe00 t1_jaalw76 wrote

From 1990 to 2021 there were an average of 1,705 train derailments per year, according to data from the U.S. Bureau of Transportation Statistics and Federal Railroad Administration. Which is like 4 to 5 a day.

That counts as "happens all the time" in my book.

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DerekB52 t1_jaawp4x wrote

The only problem with this is, it counts something as severe as this ohio incident, the same as it counts an issue that ended up being very minor. A lot of those daily derailments are really non-issues.

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asstyrant t1_jabbmg0 wrote

I hear they store things at Mar-a-Lago.

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Aleashed t1_jaca6wx wrote

No need, we got really deep canyons

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Pimpwerx t1_jac1iqe wrote

Why the concern? The free market will sort this out, as it always has. The government shouldn't be meddling in the affairs of a free society...or something equally comical spewed by conservatives prior to every fucking disaster.

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zurn0 t1_jacange wrote

Do you still believe in the tooth fairy too? The free market won’t do shit, way too many people are not directly effected by this for anything to happen. Just like how Exxon and BP are doing just fine after having major oil spills in the past.

Edit: obviously I failed to read the last part of their sarcastic comment. Insert first half meme here.

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MurderDoneRight t1_jabwvtk wrote

Maybe they can put it in Garfield Heights, Ohio. They built a landfill in the 1970s where they dumped toxic waste, closed it up years later without cleaning it up, a developer bought it and put a mall on top of it, the ground started sinking as gases escaped from the soil, most of the businesses left, it was reworked as a business park and is still open to this day.

Did I mention the reason why they figured out the dump were toxic? Because a staggering amount of people were developing tumors. People still live there. Shit is still messed up 50 years on and everything is business as usual.

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ActivityEquivalent69 t1_jacnkeb wrote

Honestly.... if it's already a fucked area....my morals say don't make it worse but my other morals say don't make it happen for any more people. So....yeah I like this idea as much as I can.

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xGenocidest t1_jaan30m wrote

Hm.. what are the odds they ship the contaminated stuff in another train, and it derails again?

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chookatee2019 t1_jad8ofe wrote

Probably going to an even-more-red state that allows them to just dump it wherever they want. Free market fixes itself! /s

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TrainOfThought6 t1_jacuwfn wrote

I mean, what the hell did these people expect when they allowed EPA waste disposal sites in their county? Are they usually notified about every single rail car going there?

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Herbandtea t1_jaboht0 wrote

How about Mar a Lago, I mean, all this would not have happened without the Agent Orange's deregulation...

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Geoarbitrage t1_jaaqgm8 wrote

Apparently it’s going to Vickery and East Liverpool…two other Ohio towns which I’m sure are thrilled to be getting it!

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Mynunubears t1_jacc7tk wrote

Should be Norfolk doing the cleanup, supervised by the EPA and any other entity that regulates these environmental disasters. And, Norfolk should have to be responsible for the processing and eliminating the contaminated waste.

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kjbaran t1_jached2 wrote

As the temps rise, woodland folk retreat to the streams with their beer and children only to find dead crawfish and oily water.

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docsquidly t1_jacjea0 wrote

Is that a quote from a book?

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kjbaran t1_jackgx6 wrote

Unfortunately not, my brain just puts words together poetically sometimes.

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Flycaster33 t1_jackgnw wrote

And just wait for the first rains/snow to pull all the contaminants down and percolate into the ground water.....not going to be good.....

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Repubs_suck t1_jacvb0x wrote

Geez, want it cleaned up or not? Haz waste worse than this is traveling by truck every day. Got to be hauled away somehow.

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macross1984 t1_jabvssw wrote

NIMBY.

Also, send some to Trump and other politicians who allowed railroad companies to not be punished for cutting corner in matntenance.

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richincleve t1_jac7xrm wrote

Funny. East Liverpool is like almost literally down the street from East Palestine.

Just a way for NS to save a few bucks on transportation costs.

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TakeTheWheelTV t1_jacqkos wrote

Norfolk Southern’s train wreck site. Not Ohio’s

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Soliae t1_jad98jo wrote

Ohio voted for the Republicans that re-regulated and refused Federal aid. It's Ohio's and any other Red voters.

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CondimentBogart t1_jac54z8 wrote

This planet is a closed system. There is no easy answer.

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webster8347 t1_jabq2tb wrote

The Mafia normally takes care of that and dumps it into the ocean.

0

Arrow_Artemis t1_jabr163 wrote

It's about time. Be concerned where it's going, where it has been going, what will they do with it when they get there, how long does it stay there, Does it stay there, how long will it be there, how much more will accumulate in one year's time, 5 years time, 10 years time? Why do we create this product in the first place, why can't we find alternative ways, why do we continue to risk ourselves and the environment by constantly poisoning it , ourselves and wonder why new diseases and Cancers etc exist? Why don't we realize that it's everybody's backyard, no matter where we put it? It might be 30 miles from your house but in a few years it'll be 10 mi from your kid's house and one mile from your grandkids future house. We got to get proactive and stop waiting for disasters to happen before we ask yourselves vital questions instead of worrying about the next PS5 Black Friday sale, or how many likes for tick tock challenge, or free crap because you think you're an influencer. Or like some others who sit around and watch The boob tube all damn day, morning News evening news, drama and crime shows, emotionally involved in pretend characters but completely oblivious of what's going out on next door. Just mentally and emotionally exhausting. To be raised to recycle and save the whales and decades later corporate companies finally gave in just to market GREEN and it just got worse. We know the solutions, it takes work and lots of change. And I'm not sure if that's in the American vocabulary anymore. It can be, but even the best of us distract ourselves on a daily because we feel alone in the fight. Power in numbers my friends.🕊️

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M142Man t1_jadcj43 wrote

For a start it isn't going deeper into the soil and into the creeks nearby.

You can't scream "DO SOMETHING!" then complain when something is actually getting done.

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Redtex t1_jaayqt0 wrote

What the gov should is force them to get a 1000 year lease somewhere remote and "safe" in state, have them dump it there and have them take care of it under strict supervision with spot checks and fines for any future harm to anyone or the environment for that time. Maybe they'll be more care in the future if they have a long term penalty possibility for cutting corners.

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