mowotlarx t1_jdxmm8k wrote
They also support a larger tax in millionaires but you won't see the Post bragging about that.
AceContinuum t1_jdyj0fv wrote
And as for the usual "millionaires will just move" "rejoinder," the wealthy want the prestigious NYC address. There's a reason why millionaires haven't flocked to Bayonne or Harrison, even though they'd certainly save a bundle on taxes.
Neoliberalism2024 t1_jdymmf8 wrote
The wealthy own multiple homes. They can have a NYC address and just live there less than 182 days and avoid NYS and NYC income taxes.
AceContinuum t1_jdynwb1 wrote
This idea is not new. There is an entire cottage industry of legal and accounting professionals dedicated to helping the wealthy prove that they haven't exceeded 182 days in NYS.
caspiam t1_jdyqyuv wrote
Ridicules the idea that higher taxes will chase away millionaires.
Agrees that it's commons for millionaires to be chased away for at least half a year from ny to avoid taxes.
Gold.
AceContinuum t1_jdysicy wrote
The wealthy folks who are already carefully tracking their days in NYS will continue doing that even if their taxes stay the same. And they will continue doing that even if NYC taxes fall dramatically. They will continue doing it unless NYC's taxes fall to Sioux Falls, SD levels, which is simply not realistic. So this group of people can be entirely discounted in any talk of income tax policy. They are not going to change their residency under any realistic income tax model.
The wealthy folks who are spending 183+ days per year in NYC now are going to keep doing that even if their taxes go up a few percent. This group of people wants to spend 183+ days per year in NYC and can afford to do so. These folks also aren't going to change their residency under any realistic income tax model.
The previous commenter suggested that there is a group of wealthy folks who will suddenly "discover" the 183-day rule if taxes go up a few percent. The idea that there is any sizable number of wealthy folks whose accountants and lawyers haven't told them about the 183-day rule years ago is ludicrous.
pigoath t1_jdz4wq9 wrote
This^
djdjddhdhdh t1_je10pr5 wrote
Well partially, your income tax is still paid on time you work in NY, not sure how it work on equity grants or bonuses though for non resident, knowing Ny tho, they’ll claw it back
Neoliberalism2024 t1_je138ae wrote
The very rich are generally business owners and their income is via capital gains. Capital gains state tax is based on your primary residence only.
djdjddhdhdh t1_je13ez7 wrote
Ye so guess it’s work same way with equity grants since those are capital gains I guess
Manwelio t1_je1js5t wrote
Millionaires don't want to smell Bayonne.
Armoogeddon t1_jecyd7j wrote
Dude they’re leaving in droves.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/23/nyregion/millionaires-new-york-taxes.html
Sure there’s still plenty, but the trend is negative and the net population loss is a problem too.
AceContinuum t1_jed0q9h wrote
There's no net loss of millionaires, though. From the article:
>The 1,453 departures in 2021 did not create a millionaire shortage. New York State still had more than 80,000 millionaire taxpayers in 2021, up from about 70,000 in 2020.
So New York actually gained a net of 10,000 millionaires from 2020 to 2021.
SleepyHobo t1_jdy87ey wrote
The millionaires will just move their residency to another state. Same thing happened with France except they moved to a different country. All that money affords them hyper-mobility.
mowotlarx t1_jdy8xdr wrote
France is #6 in the list of countries with the most millionaires.
But, sure, they're a third world country now because all the millionaires are gone because they're asked to pay their fair share.
SleepyHobo t1_jdybwen wrote
Before you start spouting hyperboles and crap you have no idea of what you're talking about. Try educating yourself.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solidarity_tax_on_wealth
Europe tried a wealth tax. It didn't work and that's why only 3 European countries still have one. They share the same problem we have. Millionaires can just move to another state (or country in Europe).
France lost billions of dollars in potential tax revenue and the average family impacted by the tax paid a paltry sum of around 2,000 euros.
mdervin t1_jdyqa1l wrote
>France lost billions of dollars in potential tax revenue and the average family impacted by the tax paid a paltry sum of around 2,000 euros.
Does that make sense to you? You really think that a Billionaire is going to uproot his and his family's life for a 2K tax increase? I mean you can't even get a used Toyota corolla for 2k.
[deleted] t1_je03ksy wrote
You misunderstand their point. Assuming everything they said is accurate, the fact that the average tax is 2K is because those who would have been taxed higher already moved and were thus excluded from the tax.
With that being said I'm skeptical the average tax was 2K, because even a handful of ultrawealthy who stay would really distort the average. My guess is that they meant "most families would paid the tax paid only 2K"
SleepyHobo t1_jdyror7 wrote
> average
psychothumbs t1_jdzvoed wrote
The wealth tax worked fine, it was just abolished when a right wing government came to power.
Type_suspect t1_je6bt64 wrote
France is a country so like you’d have to gain citizenship somewhere else… where in this example they just move states.
Rottimer t1_jdyto2i wrote
NY and NYC is one of the highest taxed places to live in the U.S.. Billionaires and Millionaires can choose to move right now if they wanted to and yet, NYC has the highest number of billionaires, not just in the country, but in the world. Something tells me we have some leeway to tax them more.
TheAJx t1_jdylary wrote
Despite ever increasing taxes on the wealthy in California (now up to 12% on the top tax brackets), California has seen an influx of millionaires moving in . . despite population loss in general.
Millionaire tax probably won't be a good policy, but ultimately what matters most in NY and NYC is cost of living (housing prices, utility prices, and transportation prices). That determines everything and is far more important than the tax structure.
Neoliberalism2024 t1_jdymicl wrote
They dont have new millionaires moving in. They HAD new millionaires being MADE, because silicon valley had a shit ton of IPOs before the bubble crashed, and lots of people become millionaires thru their options. A large portion of those newly minted milionaires left. And silicon valley isnt going to minting many millionaires the next few years.
AnacharsisIV t1_je55jrj wrote
Not to mention the fact that housing prices in California are insane (much like NY) that over the last decade or so plenty of middle class homeowners who were able to get in when houses were affordable became millionaires simply because their house shot up hundreds of thousands of dollars in value.
Farrell-Mars t1_jdyazwt wrote
Those rich people are too smart to pay more just to stay home in the city they love! It’s gonna be a ghost town, I tell ya!
SleepyHobo t1_jdyc0lt wrote
Tax people enough and they'll leave.
Farrell-Mars t1_jdyhnls wrote
Suddenly it will no longer be the most interesting city. I get it!
Pool_Shark t1_je0frpf wrote
Good. Don’t let the door hit them on the way out.
BakedBread65 t1_jdy7u3g wrote
Whataboutism
mowotlarx t1_jdy8ful wrote
Like when a right wing news outlet picks and chooses which poll results to write about from the exact same poll, because one results doesn't meld with their world views?
BakedBread65 t1_jdyazqs wrote
No, that’s just choosing to write about one topic and not another. Whataboutism is you posting about an unrelated topic in the comments.
mowotlarx t1_jdyews3 wrote
It's not unrelated because it's from the same Siena poll and other news outlets have reported both of these statistics together - but the Post chose to ignore that.
KidAstoria t1_jdxsakw wrote
Wrong.
mowotlarx t1_jdxvc19 wrote
Poll: New Yorkers back bail changes, millionaires tax
It's literally the same poll. U mad?
iv2892 t1_jdy3sop wrote
I mean is obvious that this is a policy that most New Yorkers and liberals in general support. I don’t get the point of people being a contrarian on this
RepresentativeAge444 t1_jdy7mgk wrote
Most Americans in general. But bootlicker/I’ll be a millionaire one day really!!! types are going to do what they do.
[deleted] t1_jdyq4ft wrote
[deleted]
Pinkydoodle2 t1_jdxwvsj wrote
Obvious bot
1600hazenstreet t1_jdxrjft wrote
Gaslighting much?
mowotlarx t1_jdxs8sw wrote
What do you think gaslighting means? This article is referencing a single poll. The same poll also indicated a majority of voters support a larger tax in millionaires. They're cherry picking the information they want.
tyen0 t1_jdxyumu wrote
I don't think you know what that means.
Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments