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But is this causation or correlation? I'm way suspecting the latter.

Seriously, these stats often pop up but I feel like there’s a lot of conflation between “sleeping too much is unhealthy” and “unhealthy people sleep too much.”

Maybe even on the other end too, i.e., people that are ill have trouble getting to sleep/staying asleep.

Breaking research: people that are sick sleep more and skew study results with arbitrary line of 8 hours. Flip side, some illnesses make it difficult to sleep, skewing results below 6 hours. How do I get paid for my research on the topic?

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Particularly with "too much sleep," it's usually a symptom of another health issue (like sleep apnea, depression, etc.), rather than the cause of health problems. There's very little evidence that excess sleep is detrimental in people who are healthy.

Too little sleep is causation. Too much sleep is correlation. My guess.

The causes of sleeping problems also cause issues with your immune system and focusing on fixing your sleeping problem will help even if it's correlation due to a shared cause.

Yeah but it's still good to know because if you're ill more than others and your sleep isn't average then you can either:

> Sleeping too much is unhealthy

Reduce sleep. Or

> Unhealthy people sleep too much

Investigate the underlying issue and then fix it, reducing sleep.

Which lays out a straightforward solution, if you investigate first then you'll cover both, so do that.

It's pretty actionable even if it's correlation.

So 6-9 is the magic number.

It could also make you sick less... just because it is meaningful for a statistical amount of people doesn't mean it is meaningful for you.

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I'm in camp causation.. but I think the illness is affecting your sleep patterns and not the sleep patterns mkaing you sick.

Headline written by an idiot, I suspect.

You sleep more when you're sick, news at 11

Too much sleep is likely also causation, but in the other direction.

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People who are sick tend to sleep more while sick….

This isn't about your sleeping patterns while sick. It's about your normal sleeping patterns and how frequently you get sick.

Pretty much. I've long term anxiety and depression which messes with your immune system. So yes, I can sleep for 17-20hours a day and I also catch every illness going. I get ill because of the immune wrecking mental health issues, not because I sleep a lot. Given depression and anxietys prevalence in the population, I'd imagine it played a role in these figures.

It doesn't seem like they've accounted for kids.

Those will make you sick, a lot, and will make you sleep very little.

Guinness record is 11 days so idk. To each their own?

I’m lucky to get six hours of sleep. I never get sick. Even when I had Covid I didn’t have symptoms. Other than loss of taste and smell.

This is just wrong, you can't get "too much" sleep. Once you've had enough sleep you wake up.

This is reverse causation. Those people that are ill or have sleep issues like sleep apnoea need more sleep. If those people had normal amounts of sleep they would have even worse health outcomes.

This is reverse causation. Those people that are ill or have sleep issues like sleep apnoea need more sleep. If those people had normal amounts of sleep they would have even worse health outcomes.

Damn, as much as I try to sleep I just feel like my body is getting used to it. I’m perpetually tired but functional. I hate it though.

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Yeah but (for example) depression is also sickness. Depressed people sleep more, and also get ill more often because of weakened immune system they tend to have. But I have never heard any evidence that it is too much sleep that causes this. Or can it be a chicken-egg problem

I think the point is if you're consistently sleeping too much or too little it's likely (or always) caused by other factors that need to be dealt with. Work, health, etc.

Studies like this often suggest that simply forcing oneself to sleep more or less will just make things better all by itself. Without knowing the cause, this could even make things worse.

Edit: For example, some health conditions (like allergies) constantly exhaust the body and result in needing extended rest to recover. Not allowing yourself that rest, without dealing with the condition itself, will just make it worse.

“While this study can't prove sleep duration is causing these infections, the team says it underlines how important sleep is to keep us healthy.” No, that’s not how causation works. This article didn’t prove causation, only correlation. The actual problem could be something completely different with the sleep issues as a symptom. Why does it seem like the bar is continually dropping in peer review?

>How do I get paid for my research on the topic?

Better sleep on it and let us know.

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What is it with Redditors on this sub constantly refusing to believe that maintaining basic biological functions is crucial to your health just so they can drop the bUt wHaT If iTs aCtUallY jUst a CorrElAtIoN?? and get to feel clever without having any education or understanding in scientific research?

Sleep is very important to health. Your body needs it, it literally can't survive without it for more than a few days. Sleep repairs cellular damage, regenerates your cells and regulates your hormone and neurotransmitter levels, and consolidates your memories. Not getting enough sleep wreak havoc on your whole body in myriad of ways. This isn't even a contested topic anymore, it's not up for a debate, it's a fact. Just because sick people tend to get less sleep doesn't mean it's only a correlation and not getting enough sleep doesn't also ruin your health on its own.

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Agreed, not sure if it was controlled for preexisting conditions.

Sometimes when you're sick you get terrible rest.

Sometimes when you're sick all you wanna do is rest.

Or maybe people who get very little sleep are just also more likely to encounter infections — they might have small children in daycare, or do shift work in healthcare settings, etc etc

Which is essentially what I'm saying, but that by trying and failing to correct your sleep, you'll know it's a deeper issue and can look at that.

But now, people with atypical sleep and immune issues that ignore one (or both) might be stirred into some reflection and subsequent action. The knowledge helps even if it's correlation, is all I mean.