What??!!

"OH they aren't endangered anymore? Sweet"

cocks shotgun

'MURICA!

LET'S SHOOT A BALD EAGLE!

How fitting

Someone is about to find out the Boogeyman is real. And his name is Chuck Norris.

In addition to the state offense it's a violation of the federal Bald and Golden Eagle Protection Act which has separate penalties. Don't sleep on bird law.

As a conservationist, I just have to remind myself that the reason I don't see any good stories about hunters is that good hunters don't generate stories. I personally know some ethical hunters, but it feels like every year I hear more and more bad stories (or have negative encounters myself).

I hope the ethical folks in that hunter's poacher's circle ensure that justice is served.

I would not consider them a hunter but rather a poacher/ criminal.

Good point. I'm trying to be better about not lumping those kinds of people in with the rest of hunters, thanks for the alternate language to use.

Horrible. I hope they catch the guy and he goes to jail

How to get a felony 101

Fortunate son starts playing in the background

Saddle up, boys….

Only scum shoot bald eagles

My experience as a hunter has been the opposite. My circle strives for safety, ethical/clean kills, and we never shoot outside of season. Its important not to lump everyone with a rifle in the same category. Some of us just want to put food on the table.

Don’t worry, they travel in packs of 20 in Montana.

Yes it's awful. We have treasured seeing the couple raise fledglings on the lake and now one is gone. We aren't sure what will happen to the survivor of the pair.

Charlie?

Who shoots a bald eagle? People are fucking scum

They literally described people just like this, and admitted that ethical hunters don’t get press. They also said explicitly that they already are trying not to lump people together…

Farva.

People with little penis’ and weak egos.

Yeah, some of the hunters I know are also the most active and knowledgeable conservationists/naturalists. But I've also watched hunters shoot migrating shorebirds during goose season, been threatened by them while bird watching, and heard plenty of similar stories from others. Someone killed a Razorbill last winter, a species that we don't even normally get in VT and was a rare treat for the birding community :(

My ex's father was a hunter, and that was the best venison I've ever had. I'd never fault a hunter for filling their fridge, as long as they aren't filling it with eagle :P

A poacher is a hunter by definition. I understand the important distinction, but we should acknowledge that this isn’t a one or the other. A poacher is a person who hunts or catches game or fish illegally. All poachers are hunters, but not all hunters are poachers.

Nice bird law credentials!

What kind of bastard would shoot the symbol of American Freedom? It'd be ironic if it's someone who's very patriotic.

Yup I can see your point there. It’s just very important that we be as precise in our language as possible regarding hunting/ hunters especially when it comes to media and peoples perceptions of hunting and conservation. There’s definitely a trend where certain media sources use the word “hunter” in negatively or loosely when “poacher” is a more accurate description. I think we can all agree the person who shot the eagle is a dirtbag with little regard for anything let alone wildlife. Hopefully they get caught and charged.

I think shooting a bird isn’t enough to warrant jail time but like, a hefty fine yea.

I think someone who’s hyper patriotic would do this tbh. They see it, think man I’d be so patriotic if I had a bald eagle in my room. Clear (ly stupid) line of thought

Actually it is

What reason do you think that for?

Violates a federal protection act. It is a federal felony. As poaching should be.

$1,222 fine is too soft. Folks that arbitrarily shoot animals are scum of the earth.

Some hunters unfortunately love poaching for their own gain though. A pretty common one is a specific age of old deer hunters will illegaly shoot coyotes and other large predators in states that have them because they are "doe killers"

Ok but how does that justify jail time for it? I’m not asking what the law says, I’m asking how you yourself justify thinking that jail is an appropriate punishment.

If someone kills an endangered bird they deserve jail time.

Think about the amount of impact a single person can have to an entire population

Aren't these birds tagged and tracked? Also Why! It's protected by law and our Nations Bird so whats the point other then to piss people off.

I think fines and taking away their right to own a weapon would prevent any further poaching on their part…

Probably the same guy that emailed the conservation department and said bald eagles were killing all the ducks.

The last time I read about a bald eagle shooting investigation, it turned out to be a loon that stabbed the eagle.

It’s just an investigation at this point.

here’s the post

[deleted]

Guessing there’s not much in terms of forensics can be done to find the perpetrator on that one.

Sad really…

Maybe it was the ludlow dude who was on jeopardy

Vermont is Alabama but it snows more

Hey now! Even we don't shoot eagles down here! We stick to racism, bigotry and misogyny!

He’s very well versed in bird law

The bald eagle is magnificent. Penalty needs to be harsher imho.

Shouldn’t criminal punishment be based on reason and not “I think the bird is cool”? Like it’s a mockery of our justice system if people go to jail for killing this bird, but if you kill an extra deer is just a fine?

Interesting fact about the Bald and Golden Eagle Protection Act - they actually didn't give much of a fuck about golden eagles and wouldn't have gone out of their way to protect them except that immature golden eagles are difficult to distinguish from bald eagles and so they got special protection just because they could be mistaken for a bald eagle. Dropping some bird law knowledge on y'all.

Well, this specific bird is a national symbol, so it's way more relevant – socially and culturally – to the society than a deer.

Imagine being a bald eagle, the symbol of the USA, and then getting shot by a random guy with questionable ethics. Tragic.

There is literally no time shooting a coyote is illegal in VT. There is a defined trapping season but not a defined hunting season. Facts matter.

> In Vermont, coyotes can be hunted at any time during the year

https://vtfishandwildlife.com/learn-more/vermont-critters/mammals/coyote#:~:text=In%20Vermont%2C%20coyotes%20can%20be,and%20runs%20through%20December%2031.

Wow, how did I miss that story. Extra hilarious considering waterfowl are the only kind of bird with increasing populations, while every other group (shorbs, songbirds, waders, grassland, etc) are declining.

It wasn't a public story. I know someone that works there. Her department had a good laugh that day because the guy was also ranting about windmills.

Ok so send him to jail because nationalism? Jfc that’s even worse…

Nationalism? LMAO. I didn't even say that. He's going to jail because he broke the social contract he accepted when decided to live in a society with laws. He enjoys the benefits of the society and, in return, follows the ethical code of it, whatever it is.

What I'm explaining is why they decided to put a law protecting this specific bird (and correctly): because it's a cultural symbol of the country and is much more relevant to the society than any other random deer.

1. The social contract is bullshit and an outdated theory of social cohesion.

2. The reason we value the bald eagle above deer is quite literally just nationalism. That social relevance is just nationalism. The deer is literally no less important as the eagle.

How is it bullshit? The social contract isn't even an ideology to be right or wrong; it's literally a way to organize a society. It's literally the philosophical basis of the US constitution. With a simple Google search you can find lots of articles on the influence of this model of society in the America's own. Or you'll just stick with fallacies again, denying it IS how the American society works without explaining?

About the deer: it's obviously less important – at least in the American view. The life of an animal is decided by its social relevance. If, to you, every single animal life is the same, you should be in jail for killing tons of bacteries at this moment.

The social contract is bullshit because society is forced on you. You don’t agree to participate, you don’t get a choice. It’s not some consensual arrangement between you and the rest of society. You don’t get a choice in whether you participate or not, and so the notion of a social contract is just propaganda to make people think that they agreed to whatever societal woes they face. The theory was literally invented in the age of colonialism, its not exactly a theory to champion.

And the deer is only less important if you think American social values are inherently worthwhile, and to assume American social values are inherently valuable I’d by definition nationalism. To think you should go to prison because of the symbolic value of killing a particular bird is obviously nationalist bullshit.

The only actual reason that that poaching is bad is because it makes the ecosystem unstable. Killing a bird is equally impactful as killing a deer in that sense.

If both of these acts are materially the same, then any rational government would implement that same punishment, and I don’t think prison is really suitable.

Prison entirely ruins your life. It’s far too serious a punishment for this crime. Getting your life ruined cause you shit a bird? I think yanking away their right to own guns, so that they cannot repeat this act, and a fine to help pay for conservation efforts, would be an actually suitable punishment.

The social relevance of the bird should be entirely irrelevant to our justice system. But that metric killing a celebrity would be worse than killing a normal civilian.

You obviously agreed to participate. Do you have any documents? I think you voluntarily agreed to sign them, didn't you? Why don't you do like Kaczynski and go to the woods, running away of this shitty society if you don't agree with it? That's because society feeds you and gives you the comfort you want and, in return, you are forced to follow their rules. Contratualism itself isn't even about signing something, it's about how the society evolved to what it is today, with humans don't living in their natural state at nature anymore due to a general consensus of creating a civilization with laws made to avoid its collapse.

As I said before: this specific bird is more relevant to the society than a random deer, you liking it or not. A judicial system isn't made exclusively by reason. A judge always considers the context, the people involved and even the feelings behind a happening. If you've killed a old man just because you wanted to do so, you'll face heavy consequences. If you've killed a old man who raped your son in revenge, then this context and your feelings will be considered in the judgement and you'll still face consequences, but they're definitely going to be less intense than in the first case.

Otherwise, let's kill the President and then a random ordinary stranger and see what happens. They're just two corpses, aren't they? The consequences should be the same for these two murders, since they, objectively, are the exactly same thing in your logic: someone shot someone. As I stated before: the bird has its importance and that's why someone who kills this specific animal is going to be in jail in no time.

You can agree or disagree with that. You asked why someone who killed a bird would be in jail and I gave you the answer. You asked why a deer isn't as important as this specific bird and I gave you the answer. Now it's up to you agree or disagree with that.

You are literally arguing from nationalism and your inability to see that is distressing. Nobody should value the President over any other individual, they are literally of equal importance.

You’re beliefs are archaic.

This sucks so much. Seeing the bald eagles around Ludlow is awesome and it sucks that some idiots would fuck with them.

Nationalism? Are you stupid? That's how every fucking judicial system works in the world.

You want to give 30 years of prison to someone for killing a random beggar and, then, the same 30 years for killing the fucking President, who's way more important to the country socially and objectively. You want to give a guy 30 years of prison for killing a random kid and, then, the same 30 years of prison to a guy who killed a random kid while the kid was with a bazooka trying to explode his house. EVERY, I repeat, EVERY judicial system will take the context and social relevance of someone into account.

And is every living organism of the same importance? So go to jail, because you've killed probably three trillions of bacteries by now. Why wouldn't they be relevant? This is nationalism! Stop being nationalist! LMAO.