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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2zjvfh wrote

Except those animals aren't saved.

It's not like meat farms are sending animals to shelters when demand falls.

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Beavshak t1_j2zmd0j wrote

It makes a backwards sense for a large mass of people over a long period of time. Less animals will be bred to meet demand. So they’re not killed.. they’ll just for the most part never live.

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cgspam t1_j33ax08 wrote

Land use is an important component. Natural forest and grassland gets razed and turned into farms when demand for meat increases. It kills wildlife and biodiversity. Reducing meat consumption s good for land use, and beef in particular produces a lot of methane gas which is bad for climate change.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2znr30 wrote

Either way, that's 1 less cow that's alive.

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JPAnalyst t1_j2zpnao wrote

So now a 1 cow not being bred for suffering and being killed is the same as 1 cow being bred for suffering and being killed. Good lord, how do you get through life with such a lack of common sense.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2zqenr wrote

I never said that. I'm saying either way you aren't saving a cow.

That's the key word. No cow is being "saved". Which is what this chart is saying.

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PfizerGuyzer t1_j32mhhk wrote

A cow is being saved from a life of torture, and is getting no life in return.

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JPAnalyst t1_j2zr6uy wrote

You said this

> Either way, that's 1 less cow that's alive.

In response to this

> Less animals will be bred to meet demand. So they’re not killed.. they’ll just for the most part never live.

That’s beyond stupid. I’m sorry, but I feel like you’re being dumb on purpose. You’re arguing in bad faith and I’m not wasting any more time.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2zrcq3 wrote

And you're resorting to insults instead of making a point.

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purple_yosher t1_j2zu9ex wrote

idk I thought they made a solid point.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2zukjn wrote

They're arguing a completely different point than I am while insulting me.

That's not how discussions work.

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trentgibbo t1_j2zymwb wrote

Why do vegans always just revert to insulting people. Like that ever changed someone's mind.

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JPAnalyst t1_j30asht wrote

Im not a vegan, and I’m not interested in changing your eating habits. I just call out bullshit when I see it. If you’re believing that decreased demand doesn’t decrease supply you’re also willfully dumb. You’re both proof that people will believe whatever the fk they want regardless of what they were taught. Just eat meat, without being liars.

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trentgibbo t1_j30hxvr wrote

Firstly. Calling out bullshit and being an asshole about it are different things.

Secondly, you want to talk economics? OK let's do it.

Price of meat is actually artificially high due to high demand and lower supply. This prices people out of the market (particularly premium cuts). You can easily see this in the price of beef over the last 10y.

What do you think will happen when demand softens by 1/7th?

Price will soften which will increase demand again and you'll have a net zero change.

It's basic economics and you're being willfully dumb.

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Rorik1356 t1_j2zsk9i wrote

I mean, their statement is true? You may not like how they frame it, but that doesn't make it false.

Are you possibly a PETA supporter? Because your viewpoint seems to be aligned with theirs.

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JPAnalyst t1_j30bkyi wrote

I’m not a PETA supporter and their statement is not true unless your being a pedant for the sake of arguing in vary bad faith. The spirit of the post, and we all know this, is by reducing your meat consumption by a day a week “for the rest of to it life” less animals will be killed.

Mr arguing for arguments sake is only arguing for a point in time, which isn’t “the rest of your life” and isn’t the spirit of the post. Reducing the demand for meat, reduces the production and harvesting of meat. It doesn’t kill the same mount of animals. Why is this such a hard concept for you all to understand?

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Rat-Majesty t1_j3016i8 wrote

If your existence was to be trapped and tortured for the entirety of your life until you’re needlessly slaughtered for the pleasure of another species… not being born would be salvation.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j301bq4 wrote

Not the point.

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Rat-Majesty t1_j301kze wrote

Definitely the point.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j3022wp wrote

No it's not. The chart says cutting back on meat will save animals.

No. It will either lead to death or non-existence of animals. Neither of which is saving them.

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MochiMochiMochi t1_j309er1 wrote

You're kinda missing the point, which is marginal change transforming demand, which would reduce the number of animals bred and slaughtered.

You're thinking of a snapshot in time of X number of animals and thinking that's the point.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j309z6u wrote

Yes a reduction in population, you're not saving any animal.

If everyone stopped eating chicken, they're just going to slaughter the existing chickens as a waste of money, get nothing out of them, and then stop breeding chickens.

No chickens are saved, they either die pointlessly, or never exist.

It's not like someone is sending them to a chicken sanctuary everytime you skip a KFC bucket.

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pookiedookie232 t1_j31f6r1 wrote

But you can't "not be born"

You would have to already exist in order for someth8ng to not happen to you

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torchma t1_j3206d0 wrote

That's not how the subjunctive mood works.

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pookiedookie232 t1_j32gjif wrote

It's how reality works, though

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torchma t1_j32h1fm wrote

Thankfully we humans have the ability to think in the subjunctive mood. Helps with planning for the future and learning from past mistakes. Are you human?

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pookiedookie232 t1_j32hztn wrote

Just because you can think something up doesn't mean it makes sense in reality. Sometimes those thoughts end up being useful, of course, but in this case that's not the case.

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torchma t1_j32i8g9 wrote

You're obtuse as fuck. And a waste of my time.

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JPAnalyst t1_j2zlwo8 wrote

Say you don’t know how supply and demand works without saying you don’t know how supply and demand works

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2znjck wrote

If everyone went vegan tomorrow, billions of animals would be killed off for no reason.

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Rorik1356 t1_j2zrnkc wrote

I have often wondered... if everyone went vegan, would anyone keep livestock alive? In the case of cattle, there ancestor is extinct... so would these animals just go extinct?

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2ztceo wrote

Maybe not extinct, but billions would be needlessly killed. That I can guarentee

Without a market for them there's no monetary investment for farmers to keep them alive. The leather and animal feed industries don't require that level of volume.

There'd be a HUGE culling.

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[deleted] t1_j3044nn wrote

The point of veganism is to try to reduce that harm, so if everyone adopted that ideology, they would be huge hypocrites to kill them.

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JPAnalyst t1_j2zp9bb wrote

That’s obtuse as hell. The current supply yes, but you and I both know that future supply would decrease. I don’t understand why you feel the need to push against commonly known supply and demand theory. The mental gymnastics you people are going through. Just fcking eat meat if you like it, but don’t try to fool other people.

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The_Paradoxigm t1_j2zqnr9 wrote

If you're going to argue with me. Keep it to one thread. As I said in my other reply. It's not about supply and demand. This chart says eating less meat will save animals.

It will not.

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Rorik1356 t1_j2zr53n wrote

Geez, the unreasonable anger is strong with this one.

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JPAnalyst t1_j2zrc34 wrote

If you have a high tolerance for utter ignorance good for you. You’re a better person than me.

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imacatnamedsteve t1_j31ap9i wrote

“Utter” ….. tee hee …… sorry I thought your word choice was fun considering the topic, don’t hate me too much 😬

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