Submitted by Roxaos t3_yf5h2p in headphones
Is this a common issue with focal headphones?
I want to love the Elex, already on my second pair, but I can’t for the life of me get over the fact that I have to be mindful of what volume whatever it is I’m listening to is at if it’s somewhat bass heavy.
Even watching YouTube videos where there’s wind buffeting being picked up on the mic causes this.
If there’s a headphone comparable to the Elex without this characteristic I’d love to know about it.
The Clear has it, if I go looking for it with test tones or listening to music louder than I would usually listen. I do have to go louder than I would ever listen sustained, but not crazy volumes either. So does the Utopia, although I have to go to a higher volume to get it there. All of Focal's open back headphones do this, it's inherent to the design. It seems to be very variable though between different headphones and even the cups, I get it on the right on the Clear first. Some seem better than others.
For me, it is never an issue at regular listening volumes on either the Clear or Utopia, even with a substantial EQ bass boost (+8.6dB on the Clear with Oratory1990's Harman target). So, for me, it's not a problem.
This is what Focal themselves say about it:
>As already mentionned several times on Head-Fi, the issue described is actually not a quality issue.
>Indeed, we have made a clear design choice on Elear (and by consequence Elex) and Utopia. Our headphones have been designed to favor the respect of the dynamic contained within the audio signal versus dynamic compression that would offer a higher SPL capability but less respect of the original audio signal. To cut a long story short, the choice was audio quality oriented rather than SPL oriented. This allows our products to work with full performances until the mechanical clipping is activated. This means that you jump directly from a very low distortion to a sound which could be heard as rattling / cracking noise. On very special tracks with only very low frequencies at very high level, you can thus hear some noises - as you will do on classic loudspeakers.
>If we change your pair of headphones, the new one will be designed similarly and it will also have a kind of cracking sound when you will be listening to music with high volume and a fair amount of bass. The only solution we can recommend you is therefore to listen to your headphones at a lower volume.
>The only solution we can recommend you is therefore to listen to your headphones at a lower volume.
Might have to give the Clears a shot. Both pairs of Elexes I’ve tried had this
I had the Elex with that same clipping problem: couldn’t play it past a specific volume particularly for songs with deep bass hits (Jacoo - Breathe, for instance). Sold the Elex and found a used Clear. Tested before I bought with particular tracks I knew were problematic for the Elex and there was NO clipping. Same volume levels and all.
Not only do they not clip, but the Clears are way more dynamic and open sounding than the Elex. I don’t know how anyone would say the Elex is 90% of the Clears. For me, the Clears are on a completely different level. Worth every penny.
It's a QC issue, which is why some clip at 80dB and others go to >95dB without issue. I got lucky with my old pair that never had the clipping until I stuck a Harman EQ on and cranked it way past normal listening levels on the traditional 2049 clipping test.
From what I've seen, it affects the 1st gen open backs the worst (Elear/Elex, Utopia), the Clear is a lot better, and I haven't seen any complaints with the Clear MG (presumably the 2022 Utopia as well, but it's still too new to say). My pair can be maxed out on my Apple dongle playing 2049 without any issues, so it's not an issue for me.
Just an aside, but this is how silly Focal's statement that "the clipping is intentional, turn the volume down" was. Their PR relied on QC never letting headphones go to customers with this issue, but 3 bottles too many during lunch and people get headphones that clip in YouTube. Now we have the "my pair has no issue, stop killing your hearing" bunch making the whole issue bigger than it is. It's 100% a QC issue if you are encountering it 1) at normal listening volumes, and 2) your listening volumes don't average ~>95dB like some very deaf people. Force a return of the headphones until you get an acceptable one, or get a newer model that doesn't have the issue as much, since it's quite unreasonable to pay their prices just to be unable to watch YouTube.
This is very informative, thanks for taking the time to write all this up.
Shame Focal had that as a response, but all well.
I think I'll try to get a newer pair of Clears.
The Clear is worse for this than the Utopia, both from my own experience (I have both) and reviews I've seen.
I can get it on both but have to go louder on the Utopia before I get it. Like you say it's variable, but it's not just my ones, for example both ASR and Oratory1990 specifically mention the clipping issue with regard to the Clear, but not the Utopia.
I get the impression that the Elex may be worse than the Clear though. There are also plenty of reports of driver failure particularly on older (pre-2020 revision) Utopias, and the Elex.
This paints a picture of QC getting better the more you spend, which I guess makes sense considering how much more their margin probably shoots up with a Utopia compared to an Elex. Thanks for sharing your experience, I remembered seeing posts about Utopia and Elear clipping, or maybe I was confusing them with the driver failure.
> driver failure particularly on older (pre-2020 revision) Utopias
The 2020 revision was purely to add the new accessories, as far as I know the headphone/drivers remained the same. Purely anecdotal, but I know someone who bought the 2020 revision Utopia and had a driver die within 3 months. It was replaced under warranty, before one side died again - it was the lampcord XLR cable the second time. I get why they had to specify the 2022 Utopia had "increased reliability" at that point, if they never took the chance to fix it with the 2020 SKU.
> and the Elex
Did you see the post on Head-Fi where someone repaired their broken Elex? The voice coil's wire had broken in the black goop they use to shield the soldered connection to the 3.5mm, so you could theoretically clean it off, desolder the old wire and solder on a new stronger connection to fix it. With broken Elex going for $200+, I'm quite surprised more people haven't cleaned up on the broken eBay ones and fixed them for an audio bargain. The same thing is probably happening with the OG Utopia drivers as well, since the Clear OG/MG had a new voice coil and seemed to fix most of it, and the 2022 Utopia also only replaces the voice coil for higher reliability.
This is what Focal said about it (in October 2018). You are right, it wasn't the 2020 revision specifically that they fixed it, but they claim to have identified and fixed an issue with voice coil fragility at some point after the initial release. But as you say, there do seem to be still a high number of failures.
>Regarding defective Utopia drivers, as already mentioned in the first pages of this thread, we experienced a voice coil fragility during early production batches. Not all headphones from these batches were affected. This problem which caused some drivers fragility has been identified, analyzed and fixed. We managed to take on defective headphones returns, but some units could be left on the market.
>As this issue is identified by our Team, we have informed our distribution network and they know how to proceed in case of defective drivers. Indeed, all defective headphones under warranty (according to local warranty policies) will be repaired free of charge by the Focal Team (the driver will be replaced). Which is why we strongly recommend you to contact your local dealer (specifying the serial number of your product and attaching the invoice) if you are experiencing any issue with your headphones to ensure After Sales Service. Please note that the serial number and the invoice are compulsory to track your headphones.
>The official warranty of Utopia, Clear and Elear headphones is 2 years by default. There are then specific cases in some countries for potential extension, please contact the local distributor to know the local warranty policy.
>In conclusion, we are aware of this situation and will do our best to fix all defective headphones. Be sure we have reinforced our quality controls.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/focal-utopia-general-discussion.811273/page-590#post-14515753
I did see that post about fixing the voice coil. I think if I did end up with a failure on one of mine out of warranty I'd try a local/DIY repair rather than Focal, because they reputedly charge an absolute fortune to fix them (like literally thousands of dollars to fix a Utopia driver). Which is outrageous... but they do sound good.
> I get the impression that the Elex may be worse than the Clear though. There are also plenty of reports of driver failure particularly on older (pre-2020 revision) Utopias, and the Elex.
They redesigned the voice coil for the Clear, which is why it doesn't have the same problems the Elear and early Utopia units had.
My OG Clears never clipped, but I don't think I listen too loudly (~70-75 db, which, actually, I'm pretty sure is still too loud).
But yes, it's a common complaint.
What are you driving them with? My old Elex's would bottom out when I was poweirng them off a THX 789, but zero issues when I moved up to a Schiit Mjolnir. Friend of mine has them now, and is running them off a Jotunheim 2 with no issues either.
My chain is:
PC -> Scarlett Solo -> Magni Heresy -> Cans
Hm, Magni should drive them fine. Is the amp in High Gain mode?
Might just be a defective set 😕
Out of curiosity, is this known to affect their whole lineup (including Utopias and whatever their TOTL closed cans are called) or just the lower end models?
I believe it's mainly the Elear, Elex, and Utopia. See here.
And the Clear! The thread you linked is about the Clear doing it. Amir also noted the issue in his Clear review as did Oratory1990 in his EQ for the Clear (pdf).
I think it's definitely something that effects the open backs rather than the closed backs, as Focal say in that statement. But it definitely affects the Clear as well, and in my experience, a bit more than the Utopia, I have to go a little louder on the Utopia to get it.
Had Elegia for over a year, only time I've heard clipping is when it's in the actual track.
Not the fault of the headphones
This is not the first I have read about this. When making my audio purchases did alot reading This would occasionally occur I see it more and more I'm glad I didn't buy focal headphones But many other brands all have there own problems But some problems have worse impact Thanks to the many writers of reddit We can read these problems before purchase Ahmen 🙌
The wind on a video clip can be clipping in the recording itself. Focals have this issue in general though and one shouldn't EQ the bass on them except maybe down. I got an Amiron (with EQ) instead of the Elex since I need good bass.
It’s not the video. Lowering the volume stops it completely.
How loud do you listen? I don't usually go over 80db, and I've never had any problems with my Elex. Not sure if unit variation is behind this or if it's just people listening to them louder than they were "designed."
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Hard to fault buyers for noticing obvious and unusual issues that impact every use of their product. Companies don’t often get free passes for products with built-in diminished performance, especially when they’re consistent about it.
I don’t want to bash Focal or anything like that, I just want to resolve this clipping problem.
The Elex is common for that unfortunately.
Shame, honestly this is the only complaint I have with it. But unfortunately a dealbreaker.
Gromu t1_iu1yfi3 wrote
Focal Clear, perhaps? I don't know what volume you listen at, but I've had my Clears for nearly two years now and I never have this issue.
I have three Focals and none of them have this issue, actually.