Also because I know some people will ask, all personal information has been removed because of Reddit's privacy policy and an abundance of caution, not out of respect for these people and their practices.

If it's happening that often and it's not marked on their web sites as an introductory rate, I would send a bait-and-switch complaint to the PA Attorney General. It's entirely possible this is increasingly common, and once they get a mass of complaints about this happening, they may pressure these landlords. In the short term though, walking away is the right move in my opinion.

They are offering that rate though. I’m not sure you have to advertise when rates will change.

Sorry it's happened with different landlords and realtors, not just this one company. I phrased that poorly

Yeah that’s real scummy. Fuck these landlords

I don't think it needs to be a bait-and-switch to warrant a complaint, it just needs to feel or seem like one to the ordinary consumer. Basically if we as a community don't act against that practice, it will become standard practice that any advertised rate is only valid for a small number of days.

Look at it this way. If they already have a large queue of willing consumers at their current prices, why would they need to advertise one price and act like they're doing a prospect a good favor by granting that advertised price? They already have a queue of willing consumers, right? Close enough to bait and switch.

When you look at some of the big rental operations they have a calendar of rates that varies depending on when in the month the term starts, what month it starts, how far away that date is and how long the term is.

They will advertise the rate for the start of the next month though usually because that is what most people are looking for.

I mean, if you are taking them at their word maybe. If it's happening this often it's probably not that they're actually raising their rates on March 5 but it's just a high pressure sales tactic and next week they'll be advertising the same "introductory" rate and now it's ending March 12.

Scam

That would make sense (especially for student places at the beginning of a semester), if and only if it's advertised upfront. Being advertised upfront as introductory or sale price or special is the key point, to me. Obviously all I have to go on is a screen capture of an email reply, but I don't get that vibe from this. As OP states, this is a coordinated strategy, not just one landlord.

Either way, nobody will find me being a landlord apologist in this economy. If they submit a complaint and it's unwarranted, no big deal, live continues. If they submit a complaint and it ends up doing consumers a solid service, excellent work my dude.

Common tactic for big property management outfits that are competing for tenants.

high pressure sales tactics = GTFO of there.

It's a terrible, predatory system, but that's what it means when units are "market rent", the prices fluctuate on a weekly, sometimes daily, basis and if you dont lock in a unit, you will miss out on that "sale" price.

It shouldn't be that way, as housing shouldn't be allowed to be treated as a fluctuating luxury item, but it currently is.

If you are worried about coming across this again, keep an eye out for "market rent" listings, just know that many many properties are doing this and that at some point you may have to bite the bullet just to get a good unit at a decent price.

This was my thought exactly. I have been looking at multiple units all over the city and hadn't had a chance to get back to this specific landlord in about a day following a question I'd sent to them, so this email felt like a way to try and light a fire under me.

Yeah it sounds like a hard sell. Trying to get people off the fence.

The real switch is probably that rates won’t actually go up at all.

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I don’t even consider apartments that require you to reach out to them for a quote

I mean it could have very well been the property manager doing the right thing and honoring what she said. She has a job with timelines though. Throwing you a bone and you throw it right back. They offered a tour so you didnt have to make a decision before you replied. The real estate game here moves pretty fast. Or maybe not, but consider both perspectives.

I have a place for rent in July, no pressure. DM me if interested.

Currently moving out of the west end and saw other apartments on my building listed with a “move in fee” of $75 what the fuck is that?? Also got a move out email about having to basically scrub the apartment top to bottom with cleaners before we leave. There can’t be a single spot of dust or dirt- meanwhile they never came to fix a leaky sink, poor floor boards and literal holes in our basement walls. But what’s with the move in fee? Shouldn’t that go towards professional cleanser or even the bullshit $1400 in rent we pay to live next to nothing with no off street parking? Landlords in PGH suck.

I toured a place about a month ago, when we were getting into the application fee they casually slid in that “due to market changes” the rent fee was $150 higher than the price they had advertised that same week.

I've had something sort of similar happen. I'm looking only for houses and townhouses, my chronic migraines can't take an apartment building with internal entrances that gets flooded with the smell of burning candles, incense and cleaning products.

So I set the search on zillow to townhouses only. Found one listed in that category in Bloomfield. Said townhouse in the description too. I go to tour it, and the guy's like "oh yeah it's the first floor only". As if I was suddenly going to be ok with something completely different than what was advertised. Renting anywhere sucks but it's not like London where people will be queuing down the block for every shoebox that opens up because there's just so little available, I'm not so desperate I'm just going to sign on the spot for someone who just lied to me. The absolute gall of some of these management companies and landlords

This is just a sales tactic, I don't think this rises to the level of bait-and-switch.

If you reply a week from now and say you are interested at the rate they originally quoted you, they will take it in a heartbeat.

Same shit car salesmen do. It's not fraud, but its close.

It's almost like we don't penalize these predatory practices, so soon after they're concocted they become commonplace in the market because the dogma of capitalism to "generate as much profit as possible" throws human beings to the wayside and is designed to let captive markets (those people don't have a choice to participate in or not participate in) become extraction centers. Shame that it is working as designed.

Yeah it especially frustrates me because I'd consider myself the perfect renter; great credit score, stable job, no evictions or even a late payment with past landlords to vouch for me, I don't smoke or vape, no pets to tear up the carpet, no roommate or partner to get into fights with and bother neighbors, 0 criminal history, nothing. Like if you own a property and just want a warm body who's not going to damage the place or annoy the neighbors with noise and pays rent on the 1st without fail, that's me

That's not to brag about where I'm at, it's to say that despite all that my process trying to find a good place to rent has still been miserable, so what about people trying to get back on their feet? People with an unsteady job or minor criminal charges or bad credit they're trying to change? I have the time and resources to actually fight landlords on stuff like not returning security deposits and have the time before my lease expires to really vet my living situation and it's still a soul crushing experience. I cannot imagine how miserable renting is then for people who have a month or less to find a new place or just have no experience or a someone to turn to to try and fight erroneous reasons landlords try to withhold security deposits and all that.

She clearly gives you a few days to think about it and offers a tour before you make your decision. Real estate moves fast and sometimes you have to make a decision on the spot or lose out on the opportunity.

Good on you for walking.

Yes 💯💯. We recently realized what the attorney general is for and had to contact them when our home warranty co was messing around. Action was taken literally that week. The attorney general is a great resource that I think is underutilized because a lot of people don’t know the purpose.

You probably dodged a bullet, I bet they jack the rate way up when the lease comes up for renewal.

Pgh landlord/rental companies are absolute trash. I rented here for over ten years at many different locations, and my experience was piss poor with all of them.

Yeah when I moved out of my last place I took an abundance of photos, cleaned the whole unit myself, then hired a professional cleaner to make another pass to get everything spotless.

My mother thought I was paranoid, and the cleaning lady was like “there’s hardly anything left for me to clean!” But lo and behold, the management company emailed me saying they’re withholding the deposit because they found mold. Sent them the pictures (of the exact spot they were talking about, there was no mold) and the receipt from the cleaners and I got my deposit + never heard another peep from them.

PGH landlords/management companies are really out here trying to get one over on everybody - probably because of the abundance of college students who don’t know their rights as tenants, and that they deserve better.

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Such bullshit. Just list the price and I’ll decide if I want to pay it. Why is that so difficult.

Anything that’s not in the lease isn’t enforceable. I’ve had companies do that before where upon move out suddenly they “require” X Y and Z to be done to get the deposit back. Welp, you didn’t put that in my lease so tough shit. Printed out the relevant paragraphs of the law and left it on the counter with the keys. Got the deposit back.

“Market changes” AKA the “fuck you, that’s why” fee

I went “yeah no thanks” and just left. I understand prices fluctuate. But $150 in a few days is just bullshit lol

What area are you looking at for rentals? I may be able to help! I’m sorry that these buildings and other realtors can be so horrible to work with at times

Props to you for sticking to your guns and replying as such.

All over the place on Zillow. I've been casting a wide net because I originally moved into my current place in E Lib site unseen, and want to make sure I heavily explore all my options this time around, so I've been contacting individual owners, people subletting, massive property management companies and pretty much everything in between.

Yeah, Zillow was annoying when I was trying to find my current place. Like you, I wanted a house, but I would find so many listings that would be in the "house/townhouse" filter yet only rent 1 room or just an apartment in that house!

I ended up in the Northside because finding an apartment in the East End that I want was just ridiculous, especially for the prices they were asking. That area is great and I miss it dearly, but there are other decent neighborhoods in the city and Pittsburgh isn't that big to where I can't visit from elsewhere!

I appreciate it! There have been good experiences as well; my current management company, Forbes, has been good to me

I work from home so the exact location isn't as important as having general proximity to grocery stores and such. I've been mostly looking at or east of Lawrenceville and at or west of Regent square, that general area, and at single family homes and townhouses. I've been looking at some apartments but if I can find just a house that's much more preferred.

Once toured a nice apartment in Oakland that already had applications, and we basically had to offer more rent than the previous applicants were offering to get it. Even the realtor thought the whole situation was ridiculous

Wait til you get into house buying. People are waiving inspections just to buy houses

Walnut Capital?

Right, I'd send one complaint for each.

Awesome! There are a lot of good people out there in all fields, but the bad ones ruin it for everyone. The training to get involved in real estate is honestly horrible, no one is as prepared as they should be to be an agent or to be a property manager.

If you want to text or call me and talk over some options for buying or renting I’d love to connect with you! I could share with you our lenders information and go over that for a pre-approval too. My phone number is (724) 462-5694

I can't edit this into the main post but I did want to say I'm flattered by the support; I've been getting DMs and Messages offering places to stay or to help me find a place. I'm not hurting for a place at the moment and my lease isn't up for months, I just like to be very prepared for this sort of thing so I tend to start searching well before my lease expires so I have plenty of time and options. But thank you to everyone who's offered rooms and all that. Pittsburgh has been incredibly welcoming since I moved here and that continues to be the case with all the great people here!

I believe this to be accurate as well. If there are vacant units they generate nothing, if there are openings they’ll take the rate, sometimes people have sales quotas and get a little scummy.

As a landlord i get it, I wouldn't want to waste my time

Avoid Arbors mgmt they suck they suck they suck

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Good call - also, anytime a landlord or rental company in pgh has tried to tell me that there’s low housing availability and there’s NO WAY I’ll find somewhere to live if I don’t accept their offer right away, it’s total bs. You can even send them screenshots of whatever you end up finding to help round out their “market research”

1400?! to live in the West End?

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And the irony is that most of the units here are still polished turds. Can't wait to get out of here.

Take them to court, they'll be forced to pay tripple your security deposit.

Good for you! Fuck them

Did that change? It was double when I took a landlord to court years ago.

You know … you could hold them to their word and “commit” without giving a deposit. Nothing in their response mentions $$$.

Landlords are scum

I haven’t seen it happen in over a decade, so it’s very possible the laws have changed

Use Zillow and choose 750 ft.² and you can also use spotcrime.com to find safe neighborhoods.

FWIW: PA real estate law requires that landlords/realtors note how long an offer is valid. For similar reasons every real estate company in America adds a disclaimer about prices being subject to change.

So, this is really more a dunning-kruegar situation on your part than a scam. And you should probably apologize to “Traci” for that really rude and foolish reply.

You’re 100% right

That one is on top of the other fuck you fees that are already there.

In what world does the law care about how something "feels" to you? All you'd be doing by filing frivolous complaints is waste a few dollars worth of taxpayer money to make yourself feel better for five minutes. If you want to ban this practice then get involved politically.

Any time any one is pressuring someone to make a financial decision on the spot or within days, it's some, if not all, a scam.

I'm sure they'll have units open next week.

They're just trying to create a false sense of urgency.

Good on ya.

Check out Herbert Halsband Properties they have been really great with me

Stop sticking up for slumlords and the capitalist “laws” that support the exploitation of the working class.

Like the big high rises they’re throwing up in the north shore. But zero initiative to update bridges.

I don't get the normative system of how/why landlords/property owners think they get to set their prices?!? It should be bid/ask. That's how 'Market' rate works (at least theoretically in stonk world). We as renters need to stop slapping their high ask and bid lower rates.

The best is when you tour, and then get the copy of the lease and they make you pay $120 a month for their wifi whether you want it or not, a $60 community garbage fee, and then a $250 a month "ancillary" fee. When I moved to Pittsburgh 4 out of the 5 apartments I drove an hour and a half to see did this and wasted my time. An apartment advertised at $1,200 was in reality $1,700 with all their required fees. Absolutely ridiculous.

I got lucky and found a house with a landlord that has just a couple houses and is very down to earth.

Also fuck the landlords who host multiple open houses and don't tell you it's an open house until you arrive, just to farm hundreds of $50 application fees. I showed up in person and was offering a $5k deposit and was very well qualified just to be ghosted after the application fee and see the home still hosting open houses for weeks.

Bridges are the city's responsibility, private developers are throwing up the matchstick high rises with overpriced rents.

Not sure how being a jerk to a working class person is fighting for the working class and supporting blah blah blah.

Also, lol: “gucci_gucci…” the great class warrior!

Landlords are the opposite of the working class. And why yes, you have discovered my the intended satire of my username- that label chasers are babies. Excellent work Ignorant Veil!

We can only handle so much traffic congestion from construction in this city at once. Capitalist projects need to be a last priority. Pittsburgh is blue for a reason. Go to Texas

All new residential construction in the city had to block a percentage of apartments off for the affordable housing program, which provides reduced rent based on income. It's a convoluted program and how "affordable" it is is debatable, but it allows Democrats to claim they are doing something about the current housing crisis.

The city also rakes in the permit fees and other associated costs that come with new construction.

I am not by any means advocating for these buildings, just explaining what goes on behind the scenes a little bit.

I didn’t ask. And you’re not informing me. I’m anti landlord, so all of these points enforce my stance

Awesome

Agreed

It's the basic bargaining technique. Never list a price first, because the other party can always mis-value the transaction too high.

It feels absolutely scummy and shitty, because it is.

I've lived in 7 states, and had 15 landlords. Let me fix that for you.

>Landlord/rental companies are absolute trash. I rented here for over ten years at many different locations, and my experience was piss poor with all of them

I was so lucky with my first landlord. I live in a small 6 unit building. 2 bed 2 bath in each unit. It’s in the South Hills and our landlord is the sweetest old lady who is accommodating and literally one of the nicest ppl. It’s hard finding a compassionate individual or corporate building owner. Actually this world in general lacks compassion which is another story.

Sadly landlord doesn’t care he’ll find someone else to make a snap decision so they don’t have to look further

I don't see the problem here. They have an apartment they need to get rented. They tried to pressure you by very likely lying to you, just as district attorneys lie to possible criminals. Whether the statement is true or not, you choose not to succumb to high pressure tactics. That is the end of the story. If everyone behaved as you did that method might change but the salesman is never going to be on your side, as I am sure you know. You are using the reverse practice on him by letting him know that you are not going for it. You, of course, are telling the truth.

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Do you understand that a leasing agent works for a landlord?

This whole conversation is ridiculous. Good day.

It is a good day to have a good day.