Is this illegal?

Submitted by DiligentDocker t3_yyqxrm in vermont

So I've had covid twice this year. Had a few covid scares. I work in a medical field where the clients are typically pretty vulnerable. We have a no sick policy. We have strict covdi testing rules. My manager called me and told me he will be reducing my hours by like 40% and he will not be giving me a differnt client. He then goes on to tell me that it's due to my sick time and how often I've gotton covid. He told me if I take a shift I need to commit to it. I tried to call the board of labor to ask if it's legal for your company to do this? Yet the two lines i was referred to said it sounds fishy but it wasn't their jurisdiction. Does anyone know who I'd contact or if this is illegal.

I'm pretty upset because I love my job. But now I'm loosing most of my benefits by going part time. I'm concerned about money to the point where I'm considering getting a different job.

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charliedontplaydat t1_iwvzb4v wrote

OP, I highly recommend getting all of your interactions with this manager in WRITING. Text, email, Slack, w/e you gotta do. Document, document, document. You may very well end up with a solid case for lost wages in the near future.

Eta: check out r/workreform and search for similar posts. Best luck OP.

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DiligentDocker OP t1_iwvzgig wrote

Unfortunately this was all over a phone call.

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charliedontplaydat t1_iww0pww wrote

Email him explain him that you didn’t fully understand what he was saying on the call and ask for him to follow up more clearly for you. Trust me, people like this should be held accountable. You’re not the first and you won’t be the last unless it’s addressed.

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Pctechguy2003 t1_iww928e wrote

THIS!!!

The manager chose to use a phone call because its plausible deniability. Get this in writing! What ever you must do to get it in writing!

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Jerry_Williams69 t1_iwxk9m4 wrote

Only communicate via email going forward. If you are told something obnoxious verbally, send and email to "verify". Manager will know what you are doing and might back down in some cases too. Sadly it's a game now.

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advamputee t1_iwzj2tl wrote

Ah yes, the corporate follow-up email.

“Hey, I just wanted to follow up on our conversation on [date/time]. These were the key points we discussed: [list points].”

Feel free to add on things like “I just wanted clarification on your response to ___. I understand the resulting reduction in hours will put me below the minimum allowable for full time employment, which would result in a loss of full time status / benefits. Is this an accurate understanding?”

You’ll have a written record of what was said, with whom, and when.

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PaleontologistNo8153 t1_iwvzjyl wrote

I'd suggest contacting OSHA as well. Possibly could be viewed as retaliation for being sick? Not sure just throwing it out there as I know there is a limited window of time to complain to OSHA from an incident happening.

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Oeslian t1_iwwrrhv wrote

A 40% reduction in wages is a constructive dismissal. You just got fired and are eligible for Unemployment. Apply for that and look for a new job.

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kalitarios t1_iwxjyw7 wrote

This. Why would anyone want to work for a manager like this? Take your talents down the road where someone else appreciates you

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Local_Needleworker28 t1_iwyyekq wrote

agreed BUT UE benefits NEED proof that you have tried to avoid the situation- see my comment below- you will need proof for the state to back u & make them pay for ur UE!

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timberwolf0122 t1_iww3xn9 wrote

Get this in writing in an email from your manager.

Definitely look for another job, if you are in a medical field as far as I can tell they are hurting bad for staff so getting a new job shouldn’t be to hard. You don’t have to take it but it might be good to see what’s out there.

COVID twice is not excessive, this guy is an asshole and this is likely illegal. At a min consult OSHA and then alert HR.

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Azr431 t1_iwx1zvv wrote

If your manager wants to do it again only over the phone, Vermont is a one party consent state for recording so record it.

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thisoneisnotasbad t1_iwvvh2i wrote

Who is the board of Labor?

Call the department of labor and ask to speak to someone. They can most likely answer your question. If they refuse press them as they are the first line of defense for shit like this.

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DiligentDocker OP t1_iwvvo1i wrote

Yes the department of labor. I called their general questions line then the one they referred me to. And the one they referred to. Neither knew what would be legal.

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thisoneisnotasbad t1_iww4adu wrote

Press them. It is their job to answer your question. Ask to speak to a manger. The call center people won’t know.

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YPG-Got-Raqqa t1_iwwpy68 wrote

Missing a large amount of work is considered a cause to let someone go or reduce their hours. It is distinct from medical leave protections.

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Intelligent-Cress-82 t1_iwybjjq wrote

I've been reading all these comments from people who obviously aren't lawyers. They are self-certain and wrong. Yes, it is illegal to fire someone or reduce their hours based on health or medical issues (even chosen issues like pregnancy). And no, employment at will does not allow employers to do that, just as they could not fire someone because of the color of their skin.

Consult a real lawyer, not reddit people shooting off their mouths. From a lawyer who was general counsel of a company with many employees.

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headgasketidiot t1_iwz8egm wrote

I once sued an employer. You need a lawyer. Don't listen to random people on Reddit or read random blog posts. The inevitable specifics of your situation make any advice other than "get a lawyer" meaningless.

Start taking lots of contemporaneous notes because the process will take long enough that you'll start to forget details. The Vermont bar association will refer you to a lawyer that has agreed to do free or very cheap initial consultations.

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Local_Needleworker28 t1_iwyxhb8 wrote

i managed medical practices for years.. email your manager & copy anyone that is their superior in cc or bcc if that makes you more comfortable. recap the phone conversation and then express how upset you are about the change in your hours due to an uncontrollable situation. Express that you put yourself into a situation that makes you susceptible to getting covid by working there and how unfair you feel it is that this is how you are repaid for that personal sacrifice. Definitely point out the “if u take a shift stick to it”, is putting vulnerable patients at risk and you don’t think that’s responsible if an employee has symptoms or possibly was exposed to covid! (be professional, not angry). end it with an alternative plan that works for all parties. Whether that’s a change in sick time due to covid, better practices that protect employees from being susceptible, etc. (an example doing a week of Mupirocin nose swabs upon entering/leaving the facility to protect all employees from infection). If they go through with this change, you atleast have documentation for the state, if u need to fight them on UE benefits. Without knowing their handbook policies, its hard to say whether or not its legal- BUT the state will protect employees who actively try to stop being pushed out or wrongly dismissed. All this being said, if i were you i would be looking for a new job, because it sounds like they are trying to push you to quit so they don’t have to pay unemployment which is illegal! Document EVERYTHING, including past conversations, with as much detail as possible- including dates. If nothing else it gives you protection for getting unemployment if needed. Good luck, sorry to hear you have a bad manager.

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Snoo_1143 t1_iwz58dn wrote

Most of what you have said here is great advice. Just wanted to point out that swabbing with mupirocin has not been shown to prevent covid infection, but it can cause false negatives on covid tests.

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mookormyth t1_iwzoxty wrote

How bout department of health? You can not expose people to Covid just cause your boss say you must work. Especially working in the medical field

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neilinthecutt t1_iwymunn wrote

Certainly sounds fishy. What state are you located in? I understand that it doesn't mean much, but I'd still like to know just so I can understand some of the laws better on my own accord, so I may return with some information for you.

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czo79 t1_iwx2z5u wrote

Name and shame them if nothing else works!

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rootdet t1_iww9rzs wrote

We are an at-will state. They can reduce your hours, fire you, make you work more hours, etc. You're free to quit and find something new.

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CathyVT t1_iwwcwck wrote

But you can also file for unemployment for a reduction in hours. Workplaces have to pay more into unemployment if they have an employee that files for it, so if you tell him you will file for unemployment for the reduced hours, he might back off.

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YPG-Got-Raqqa t1_iwwprxt wrote

Workplaces only have to pay more if they let you go without cause. Not being present is a cause.

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rootdet t1_iwwdvl8 wrote

If your still exceeding like $400/week you will get nothing still from unemployment.

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thisoneisnotasbad t1_iwyxs70 wrote

The only thing that made me think a call to the Department of Labor may be needed is the state sick time law and if there are any statute around that in term of firing. Other than that, you are correct, I can fire my employees because I didn’t like the hat they wore.

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