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shiningdickhalloran t1_j2acczd wrote

This will be an interesting peer pressure experiment if nothing else.

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georgethethirteenth t1_j2ay89d wrote

Anecdotally, when my school (not BPL, but Boston adjacent) dropped the mandate during the last school year I was fascinated by the fact that well over three-quarters of our students elected to remain masked - even as nearly all of the teachers and staff dropped theirs.

Since the last week of August, I'd say between 10-15% of my students have been masked daily and there was a sharp uptick in masking the two weeks leading up to Christmas break - surely helped by the influenza present in our population that resulted in the hospitalization of one of our students.

My district almost surely won't introduce a mandate next week...but we did send students off to break with masks and home test kits and I wouldn't be shocked to see somewhere around a third of our students masked up come Tuesday.

I, too, thought that kids would rip those things off as soon as they were able. Leaving aside any arguments on the effective of masking - whether it comes from parents, peer pressure, or something else - I've been surprised about how many of my students have remained with mask over the last year.

Anecdotes do not make data and I'm sure this experience differs by school (like I said, not Boston for me) and age (I work mainly with fifth through seventh graders) but I've been surprised at the lack of eagerness my students have shown to discard them.

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Oh_Hae t1_j2azg1i wrote

Same at my Boston adjacent school. November-December a nasty stomach bug and the flu was going around and I saw a lot of the older students coming to school with their masks, even overheard a gaggle of middle school girls saying they were gonna keep masking up since they didn't want to be sick on winter break.

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wsdog t1_j2bjx01 wrote

Hm, I never saw a masked kid at school for about a year now.

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blackholesinthesky t1_j2bw2yx wrote

> well over three-quarters of our students elected to remain masked

Because the kids don't care. You're seeing one of the incredibly rare cases of Mass Munchausen’s Syndrome by Proxy.

Everyone crying "think about the children" as an excuse to not wear PPE has the emotional capacity of a toddler and will use literally anything as a springboard to talk about their own feelings.

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bb5199 t1_j2az8tb wrote

Can you blame them? The covid hysteria has been immense and they have basically been led to believe that getting covid is a serious thing, which, of course, it is not at their age.

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SmilingZebra t1_j2b8u87 wrote

It’s not so much about whether the kids get, it’s who(and how many people) they bring it home to, and whether they give it to the staff etc

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iBarber111 t1_j2bfa74 wrote

The risk that current variants pose to vaccinated adults is EXTREMELY small. This point is outdated by like a year.

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SmilingZebra t1_j2bg0xk wrote

Risk of death? Sure, you’re right. But there’s a bit more to the equation than that.

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iBarber111 t1_j2bgc8q wrote

And the risk of serious illness, when you contextualize it with illness risks our society has always tolerated.

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SmilingZebra t1_j2bho0a wrote

And minimizing the community spread to prevent the rise of new variants, increased infections of elderly, risk of long covid. It’s not a big ask for kids to wear masks for two weeks after school break. Just look at the MA wastewater data, infection rates are way up after the the last week, and it’s only a small effort to keep it in check. I hate masks also, and rarely wear one, nor do my kids, but it seems reasonable that they do for a bit.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2ckd4m wrote

Two weeks of cloth mask wearing in a school environment where kids are constantly taking their masks on and off will achieve close to nothing.

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shiningdickhalloran t1_j2bj1wm wrote

Omicron is now running buck wild in a nation of 1.4 billion people. Masking kids in BPS to prevent new variants is a bizarre point of view. And that's before we recognize that all the world (outside of a few nations in East Asia) has completely moved on. And if you're on favor of masks, then why are you targeting kids? It's adults 65+ that are falling sick and ending up in hospitals. Mask them instead.

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bb5199 t1_j2bmb2l wrote

You sound like someone armed with a set of teacher's union talking points from two years ago. Frankly it doesn't matter what people like you want in terms of masks, masks mandates aren't coming back.

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iBarber111 t1_j2bimyw wrote

Genuine question - do you also favor returning mask mandates to transit/stores/bars/gyms/offices? It makes exceptionally little sense to me to have masks in schools & not these places.

Edit: also - we're so far past lowering community spread having an impact on new variants, lmao. Did previous mask mandates stop new variants from spawning? The data shows they hardly even impacted community spread, much less enough to meaningfully reduce new variants. Your points are weak af & not supported by data.

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SmilingZebra t1_j2bjywe wrote

You’re saying masks don’t work, sorry, I’m done

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2ckhua wrote

It's not wrong though. Cloth masks don't work, nor do masks that people wear incorrectly or take off to eat or drink.

The only way a mask mandate works is with strict adherence to N95's, which is impossible, even more so in a school environment.

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SmilingZebra t1_j2biu53 wrote

No, just places where we pack 2000 kids together for 6 hours a day

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iBarber111 t1_j2bj39t wrote

So not the T, where we pack hundreds of people in a space smaller than a classroom? Insane contradictions here.

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JacksRagingBile_Duct t1_j2beeth wrote

The students are brainwashed and uninformed, that’s why. Any serious and objective person looking at the data knows that Covid poses effectively zero risk to them.

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Jesusish t1_j2bmcpx wrote

OP: One of the students recently got hospitalized for influenza

You: They're brainwashed for wearing a mask because covid isn't a risk to them

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iBarber111 t1_j2bf5ii wrote

Right?! Children have been put through an insane level of stress over this virus despite the fact that the data shows that even OG, vaccine-less, covid posed a tiny risk of serious illness to them. This is to say nothing of the Omicron/vaccine world.

It drives me up a wall that people who claim to be intelligent/objective won't look at the data staring them right in their face, just because it's saying something good.

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Jesusish t1_j2blwbz wrote

Children weren't required to wear masks because of the the risk of serious illness to them. It was the risk of illness to others who they may spread covid to (teachers, parents, grandparents, etc.) along with the overall increase in infections from having 50 million unmasked students.

Also, the risk of serious illness isn't the only reason to wear a mask. Given the choice of being sick for a few days (covid, influenza, etc.) or not being sick for a few days, I'd much rather not be sick.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2ckrcd wrote

>Also, the risk of serious illness isn't the only reason to wear a mask. Given the choice of being sick for a few days (covid, influenza, etc.) or not being sick for a few days, I'd much rather not be sick.

People caught covid while wearing masks...

Presenting masks as a 100% effective way to prevent getting sick is completely nuts.

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Jesusish t1_j2cq57r wrote

And not wearing a mask doesn't mean that you'll 100% get sick. That's why it wasn't presenting either as such. I'm saying that trying not to get sick (regardless of severity) is also a reason people wear masks. As opposed to the OP's comment that only takes into account the risk of a serious illness.

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Dontleave t1_j2a9z8o wrote

Asked and expected but not mandatory? Kinda feels like the bully that hits you with your own fist and asks you why you’re hitting yourself.

Just make it mandatory if that’s what you want

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CoriCel3sti t1_j2c846o wrote

It's exhausting after thanksgiving my kids school just said it was "recommended" but not many wore them and half the class got sick. I find it so weird that peanuts are not allowed because it could kill a kid but the school is just fine with putting other kids health at risk and okay with them getting sick over and over again. After a break where kids are traveling and hanging out with lots of people it makes total sense to make masks mandatory for at least a little bit.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2cgpzm wrote

No, it doesn't because these kids just go to any other indoor space without masks

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jojenns t1_j2a2jem wrote

If its not mandatory its really just a waste of time

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EquivalentAd4708 t1_j2bsawd wrote

Kinda interesting all the comments w/ down votes are mostly opinions against masks on children. What’s up with that?!

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jro10 t1_j2c7hww wrote

This subreddit skews young—a lot of non parents who don’t understand what it’s like to mask your young children who bring home every virus despite said mask while they’re trying to learn essential diction and social cues.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2cl2fg wrote

Yes, for some reason people think kids actually like wearing masks. Most don't.

My 3 year old who "likes" wearing a mask simultaneously drools all over them so how effective can it really be? The day his daycare dropped the mask requirement he became much happier to not have to fumble with it. My 8 year old found them annoying but tolerated it because no one gave him a choice. The day his school lifted the mandate he stopped wearing one and refuses to wear one again unless we're in a situation where he literally has no choice.

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rygo796 t1_j2d8id0 wrote

I believe the US was one of the only Western countries to recommend a mask for children under 5. If my memory is correct, it might have been as high as 12 for most of the EU.

If you look at who's actually being hospitalized/dying of COVID, masking in school doesn't make sense.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2d8k79 wrote

Canada generally followed the US recommendations, but yes it was ridiculous.

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jro10 t1_j2dgezi wrote

My son had to wear a mask from 2 to 4—half his life. We were on board when covid was killing people left and right but now we have a vaccine and tools to fight it.

Not to mention, young kids aren’t supposed to wear N95s and we know cloth masks are ineffective so what are we doing?? It’s nonsensical.

Follow the science. The science says cloth masks don’t work so let the young kids be maskless and if older kids make the choice to wear N95 they are well protected regardless of it others are masked. Let these kids have free will and choose for themselves.

Children deserve to have normalcy and see smiling faces. They’ve sacrificed a lot and it’s time to give them their childhoods back. Anyone who doesn’t understand that can fuck off.

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BsFan t1_j2fkawo wrote

TIL I am your 8 year old son.

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pdegner3 t1_j2duz1x wrote

I find that the super pro mask crowd always pushes hard when they are usually the least inconvenienced by wearing the masks or only have to wear them a few minutes at a time.

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MdSp57336 t1_j2cbmnf wrote

Can we not just send kids home when they’re sick and stop harassing parents about absences? Seems more practical.

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ReverseBanzai t1_j2b2dgr wrote

Trying to force masking back in schools just hides the real issue of the severe under staffing in bps and trouble with retention.

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princesskittyglitter t1_j2buh5a wrote

> the real issue of the severe under staffing in bps and trouble with retention.

ding ding ding

they don't care if the kids get sick, they're worried about the teachers because they don't have the coverage. and honestly this was a problem before covid.

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ReverseBanzai t1_j2buoso wrote

That’s a bingo. Been a problem for years. From my experience seeing my child’s school , it has been magnified by lack of retention.

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rels83 t1_j2bbfn2 wrote

They’re just saying please wear a mask, but if you’re going to be a dick don’t protest or send death threats. You can opt out of uniforms and the MCAS too

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RogueInteger t1_j2avbvt wrote

I actually dig this. The saying is "Enjoy their first week back because they're staying home sick the second one."

Would love to not have my kid deal with Uncle Frank's cold he can't shake for three weeks.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2cl819 wrote

You realize a mask doesn't guarantee he won't get sick right?

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RogueInteger t1_j2d6jgj wrote

Yeah, but reduces his chances of getting a respiratory illness, and if others wear it, further reduces that probability.

Masks are effective ways to reduce the spread of aerial diseases.

I learned this because I lived through a pandemic.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2d6mvo wrote

Yes, they worked SO WELL during covid that people just stopped getting covid.

/s

We had several waves of covid during the mask mandate era and it doesn't really appear to be any different from the waves we're seeing post mask mandate era.

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RogueInteger t1_j2d76ab wrote

Only siths deal in absolutes.

I'm talking about probability. You're talking about binary outcomes.

Masks are effective in reducing infection. Even before covid you might have noticed their use in sanitary or sterile environments.

There's nothing wrong in wanting to reduce risk.

This is an optional undertaking for students. Stop making this into something it's not.

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meebj t1_j2dpm12 wrote

“only siths deal in absolutes” made me laugh. thank you for that!

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grillko t1_j2ddec3 wrote

When it’s raining do you use an umbrella? Or because a couple drops are going to get on your shoes regardless do you also not cover your head?

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2ddheb wrote

It depends on how I feel and how long I have to be outside.

But more importantly, we do not force people to use umbrellas. If you want to get soaked, it's on you.

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Bad_At_Sports t1_j2dllqg wrote

Except when you choose not to use an umbrella, you’re not also putting other people at risk of getting soaked.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2dne5f wrote

A cloth mask, mandated only inside of school buildings, which is a place where kids will be taking off their shitty cloth masks to eat lunch every day will not protect anyone else either.

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Bad_At_Sports t1_j2do7b6 wrote

Okay, so there are two thoughts here that you have to be willing to separate.

The first is that masks aren’t effective at reducing transmission. This is wrong. They absolutely are effective at reducing transmission, and the science backs this up. Even cloth masks, which are less effective than n95s, still have some effect on reducing the number of droplets you spew out into the world when your wearing a mask.

The second thought is that the BPS application of a mask mandate like this is basically ineffective because of all the ways it’s easily ignored - which includes taking them off for lunch AND people who choose not to wear them. And that’s a valid criticism.

But to do nothing and expect people to just deal with getting sick is exactly what leads to massive spikes in hospitalizations, which is the real danger here. It’s not about kids getting sick. It’s about how quickly kids can spread those germs to everyone else without realizing it.

Just get off your high horse and think about other people for once.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2doyqi wrote

You can't separate the two because in real life they are in constant conflict with each other.

Because people take masks off constantly to eat/drink/talk to their buddy 2 feet away, the entire premise behind the mandate collapses into reality, where we've seen case rates are basically the same with or without a mandate.

There's a reason we've never wasted time trying to impose mask mandates pre-covid.

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jro10 t1_j2ekq3a wrote

Cloth masks offer little to no extra protection. If you’re wearing an N95 you’re well protected regardless of whether or not the other party is masked.

Mandates were only meant to be used temporarily when covid was at its worst. These kids have been severely impacted by covid for 2+ years. Enough with the nonsense—let’s use common sense and free will.

You want to send your kid in a mask? Go ahead. Don’t force others to do the same because you’re still paranoid.

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shiningdickhalloran t1_j2fpenr wrote

Are you frequently in the position of standing outside holding an umbrella for 8+ hours every day?

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bb5199 t1_j2azenw wrote

Then put your kid in an N95 and leave the rest of the kids alone.

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RogueInteger t1_j2cej87 wrote

This is weirdly hostile.

Yeah, I'll send my kid in a mask. I hope others do to. And if they don't, IDGAF.

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Pancakes000z t1_j2d3pdw wrote

If people don’t want to mask, I wish they’d at least cover their disgusting mouths when coughing then disinfect hands after and teach their children to do the same. Seems like everyone is sick right now and there is almost zero interest in trying to prevent spread.

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mitchsix t1_j2d08zd wrote

Give it a fucking rest with the masks already

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shakespeareriot t1_j2dzkdi wrote

If nothing else masks seem effective at slowing the spread of Influenza. Just to pivot from the toxic covid conversations, that isn’t the only virus going around.

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jro10 t1_j2c7qv8 wrote

Glad I live in the burbs. My kid doesn’t need to be masked up just to drool all over it and bring home viruses anyway.

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ElegantSheepherder t1_j2camy1 wrote

You might want to get that drool checked out! Never saw that on my kids when they masked…

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jro10 t1_j2dgl2i wrote

Get the drool checked out? Every 2-4 year old drooled on their mask. They’re toddlers.

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KingFucboi t1_j2byllq wrote

Meaningless and self defeating statement. Only a bureaucracy like modern education could produce.

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syntheticassault t1_j2bl8nc wrote

Not in BPS, but I'll give my kids n95s and my daughter might wear one and my son certainly won't. Just like the week before Christmas when half the staff was out. Funnily enough it was my daughter who got a cold.

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chickadeedadee2185 t1_j2biepg wrote

The Tufts doc on the news poo-pooing them doesn't help.

−5

shiningdickhalloran t1_j2d37a8 wrote

We had a gigantic Omicron spike this time last year while masks were enforced everywhere. Perhaps that doc simply remembers that masks couldn't stop anything then. And whatever variant is around now is allegedly even more contagious.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2d3gbc wrote

A lot of these experts are completely out of touch with how feasible their recommendations are in real world applications.

At least this doc understands that.

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chickadeedadee2185 t1_j2drezh wrote

But, it does nothing to support the professionals in the school system and causes more confusion. Maybe, she could relate her thoughts in private to them. To say it on the news for the general public, causes misunderstandings, if not more.

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bb5199 t1_j2aqoor wrote

No more masks. Ever.

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mtm137nd t1_j2abv4q wrote

This is asinine. Kids are in the worst mental health position and academic performance position in measurable memory. Stop with this performance bullshit.

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LackingUtility t1_j2alozy wrote

That may have more to do with repeated illness and absences, both their own and their teachers', than wearing a piece of fabric over their mouth.

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pillbinge t1_j2aykt7 wrote

Chill the fuck out. Masks work, and kids have been really seek lately. We know people get sick during the holidays anyway for a handful of reasons that come together, and we know kids are going to be out coming back. This'll work for those who wear masks.

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2cgugr wrote

They worked so well that people still got covid when we had mask mandates.

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pillbinge t1_j2eipft wrote

Only things that work 100% of the time can be said to work. That's why cars and computers are never said to work.

lmao

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2ejyfz wrote

There's a difference between 100% of the time and half the time.

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pillbinge t1_j2enbo8 wrote

Where are you getting 50% regarding masks?

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Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2er4fe wrote

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7106e1.htm

"cloth masks did not produce a statistically significant difference"

0

pillbinge t1_j2ewz14 wrote

It's been so long since someone posted in response a study or official link to something as a way obfuscate a discussion. Even longer since I've seen someone shoot themselves in not one foot but both.

>"cloth masks did not produce a statistically significant difference"

Kids aren't wearing cloth masks. Those masks aren't handed out. Cloth masks are made of cloth. The masks being handed out are surgical masks, and many wear better variants. Kids are wearing surgical and respirator masks, which have an increased chance at blocking the spread of COVID - which is all these things ever aim for. The flu vaccine, for instance, is never 100% effective. It doesn't even need to be. Same with masks.

If you can find a school handing out cloth masks, or asking kids to wear cloth masks, you let them know about that study. Otherwise, the disposable masks people are wearing aren't cloth lmao

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Oh_Hae t1_j2azp54 wrote

No. Wearing a mask is absolutely not the reason they're having mental health issues. The kids find them annoying, but unlike "adults" like you, can suck it up for their own health and the health of those around them.

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[deleted] t1_j2c5621 wrote

[deleted]

−5

Wtf_is_this1234 t1_j2clc9s wrote

I find it odd that Boston parents seem to have no problem subjecting their kids to mask wearing but the thought of getting vaccinated is just a step too far.

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NoMoLerking t1_j2adj52 wrote

With the current variants, simply “masking” isn’t enough. A cloth mask was sufficient for the Wuhan strain but Omicron and its descendants are so much more contagious that it’s more or less useless.

Go all the way and provide N95 equivalents for free or knock it off.

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