If its not mandatory its really just a waste of time

Asked and expected but not mandatory? Kinda feels like the bully that hits you with your own fist and asks you why you’re hitting yourself.

Just make it mandatory if that’s what you want

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This is asinine. Kids are in the worst mental health position and academic performance position in measurable memory. Stop with this performance bullshit.

This will be an interesting peer pressure experiment if nothing else.

Yeah, most kids have zero interest in wearing masks again.

With the current variants, simply “masking” isn’t enough. A cloth mask was sufficient for the Wuhan strain but Omicron and its descendants are so much more contagious that it’s more or less useless.

Go all the way and provide N95 equivalents for free or knock it off.

Bullshit! Leave the kids alone.

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That may have more to do with repeated illness and absences, both their own and their teachers', than wearing a piece of fabric over their mouth.

No more masks. Ever.

Nope

Good point.

I actually dig this. The saying is "Enjoy their first week back because they're staying home sick the second one."

Would love to not have my kid deal with Uncle Frank's cold he can't shake for three weeks.

Anecdotally, when my school (not BPL, but Boston adjacent) dropped the mandate during the last school year I was fascinated by the fact that well over three-quarters of our students elected to remain masked - even as nearly all of the teachers and staff dropped theirs.

Since the last week of August, I'd say between 10-15% of my students have been masked daily and there was a sharp uptick in masking the two weeks leading up to Christmas break - surely helped by the influenza present in our population that resulted in the hospitalization of one of our students.

My district almost surely won't introduce a mandate next week...but we did send students off to break with masks and home test kits and I wouldn't be shocked to see somewhere around a third of our students masked up come Tuesday.

I, too, thought that kids would rip those things off as soon as they were able. Leaving aside any arguments on the effective of masking - whether it comes from parents, peer pressure, or something else - I've been surprised about how many of my students have remained with mask over the last year.

Anecdotes do not make data and I'm sure this experience differs by school (like I said, not Boston for me) and age (I work mainly with fifth through seventh graders) but I've been surprised at the lack of eagerness my students have shown to discard them.

Chill the fuck out. Masks work, and kids have been really seek lately. We know people get sick during the holidays anyway for a handful of reasons that come together, and we know kids are going to be out coming back. This'll work for those who wear masks.

Can you blame them? The covid hysteria has been immense and they have basically been led to believe that getting covid is a serious thing, which, of course, it is not at their age.

Then put your kid in an N95 and leave the rest of the kids alone.

Same at my Boston adjacent school. November-December a nasty stomach bug and the flu was going around and I saw a lot of the older students coming to school with their masks, even overheard a gaggle of middle school girls saying they were gonna keep masking up since they didn't want to be sick on winter break.

No. Wearing a mask is absolutely not the reason they're having mental health issues. The kids find them annoying, but unlike "adults" like you, can suck it up for their own health and the health of those around them.

Trying to force masking back in schools just hides the real issue of the severe under staffing in bps and trouble with retention.

No they don't.

?????

It’s not so much about whether the kids get, it’s who(and how many people) they bring it home to, and whether they give it to the staff etc

They’re just saying please wear a mask, but if you’re going to be a dick don’t protest or send death threats. You can opt out of uniforms and the MCAS too

The students are brainwashed and uninformed, that’s why. Any serious and objective person looking at the data knows that Covid poses effectively zero risk to them.

But that’s why there’s vaccines, right? Do the vaccines work or no?

Do a little objective reading.

Right?! Children have been put through an insane level of stress over this virus despite the fact that the data shows that even OG, vaccine-less, covid posed a tiny risk of serious illness to them. This is to say nothing of the Omicron/vaccine world.

It drives me up a wall that people who claim to be intelligent/objective won't look at the data staring them right in their face, just because it's saying something good.

The risk that current variants pose to vaccinated adults is EXTREMELY small. This point is outdated by like a year.

Risk of death? Sure, you’re right. But there’s a bit more to the equation than that.

And the risk of serious illness, when you contextualize it with illness risks our society has always tolerated.

And minimizing the community spread to prevent the rise of new variants, increased infections of elderly, risk of long covid. It’s not a big ask for kids to wear masks for two weeks after school break. Just look at the MA wastewater data, infection rates are way up after the the last week, and it’s only a small effort to keep it in check. I hate masks also, and rarely wear one, nor do my kids, but it seems reasonable that they do for a bit.

The Tufts doc on the news poo-pooing them doesn't help.

Genuine question - do you also favor returning mask mandates to transit/stores/bars/gyms/offices? It makes exceptionally little sense to me to have masks in schools & not these places.

Edit: also - we're so far past lowering community spread having an impact on new variants, lmao. Did previous mask mandates stop new variants from spawning? The data shows they hardly even impacted community spread, much less enough to meaningfully reduce new variants. Your points are weak af & not supported by data.

No, just places where we pack 2000 kids together for 6 hours a day

Omicron is now running buck wild in a nation of 1.4 billion people. Masking kids in BPS to prevent new variants is a bizarre point of view. And that's before we recognize that all the world (outside of a few nations in East Asia) has completely moved on. And if you're on favor of masks, then why are you targeting kids? It's adults 65+ that are falling sick and ending up in hospitals. Mask them instead.

So not the T, where we pack hundreds of people in a space smaller than a classroom? Insane contradictions here.

Nobody rides the t anymore

Hm, I never saw a masked kid at school for about a year now.

You’re saying masks don’t work, sorry, I’m done

Not in BPS, but I'll give my kids n95s and my daughter might wear one and my son certainly won't. Just like the week before Christmas when half the staff was out. Funnily enough it was my daughter who got a cold.

Children weren't required to wear masks because of the the risk of serious illness to them. It was the risk of illness to others who they may spread covid to (teachers, parents, grandparents, etc.) along with the overall increase in infections from having 50 million unmasked students.

Also, the risk of serious illness isn't the only reason to wear a mask. Given the choice of being sick for a few days (covid, influenza, etc.) or not being sick for a few days, I'd much rather not be sick.

You sound like someone armed with a set of teacher's union talking points from two years ago. Frankly it doesn't matter what people like you want in terms of masks, masks mandates aren't coming back.

OP: One of the students recently got hospitalized for influenza

You: They're brainwashed for wearing a mask because covid isn't a risk to them

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Lol it’s useless in here

Kinda interesting all the comments w/ down votes are mostly opinions against masks on children. What’s up with that?!

Would have been better as:

Nobody rides the T anymore; it's too crowded.

> the MCAS too

can you now? They don't make you take it to graduate anymore?

> the real issue of the severe under staffing in bps and trouble with retention.

ding ding ding

they don't care if the kids get sick, they're worried about the teachers because they don't have the coverage. and honestly this was a problem before covid.

That’s a bingo. Been a problem for years. From my experience seeing my child’s school , it has been magnified by lack of retention.

> well over three-quarters of our students elected to remain masked

Because the kids don't care. You're seeing one of the incredibly rare cases of Mass Munchausen’s Syndrome by Proxy.

Everyone crying "think about the children" as an excuse to not wear PPE has the emotional capacity of a toddler and will use literally anything as a springboard to talk about their own feelings.

Meaningless and self defeating statement. Only a bureaucracy like modern education could produce.

What is your solution other than crying on the internet

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This subreddit skews young—a lot of non parents who don’t understand what it’s like to mask your young children who bring home every virus despite said mask while they’re trying to learn essential diction and social cues.

Glad I live in the burbs. My kid doesn’t need to be masked up just to drool all over it and bring home viruses anyway.

It's exhausting after thanksgiving my kids school just said it was "recommended" but not many wore them and half the class got sick. I find it so weird that peanuts are not allowed because it could kill a kid but the school is just fine with putting other kids health at risk and okay with them getting sick over and over again. After a break where kids are traveling and hanging out with lots of people it makes total sense to make masks mandatory for at least a little bit.

You might want to get that drool checked out! Never saw that on my kids when they masked…

Can we not just send kids home when they’re sick and stop harassing parents about absences? Seems more practical.

From a cold?

At most to stop a bad cold.

This is weirdly hostile.

Yeah, I'll send my kid in a mask. I hope others do to. And if they don't, IDGAF.

How does that work at lunch lol?

No, it doesn't because these kids just go to any other indoor space without masks

They worked so well that people still got covid when we had mask mandates.

Two weeks of cloth mask wearing in a school environment where kids are constantly taking their masks on and off will achieve close to nothing.

It's not wrong though. Cloth masks don't work, nor do masks that people wear incorrectly or take off to eat or drink.

The only way a mask mandate works is with strict adherence to N95's, which is impossible, even more so in a school environment.

>Also, the risk of serious illness isn't the only reason to wear a mask. Given the choice of being sick for a few days (covid, influenza, etc.) or not being sick for a few days, I'd much rather not be sick.

People caught covid while wearing masks...

Presenting masks as a 100% effective way to prevent getting sick is completely nuts.

Yes, for some reason people think kids actually like wearing masks. Most don't.

My 3 year old who "likes" wearing a mask simultaneously drools all over them so how effective can it really be? The day his daycare dropped the mask requirement he became much happier to not have to fumble with it. My 8 year old found them annoying but tolerated it because no one gave him a choice. The day his school lifted the mandate he stopped wearing one and refuses to wear one again unless we're in a situation where he literally has no choice.

You realize a mask doesn't guarantee he won't get sick right?

I find it odd that Boston parents seem to have no problem subjecting their kids to mask wearing but the thought of getting vaccinated is just a step too far.

And not wearing a mask doesn't mean that you'll 100% get sick. That's why it wasn't presenting either as such. I'm saying that trying not to get sick (regardless of severity) is also a reason people wear masks. As opposed to the OP's comment that only takes into account the risk of a serious illness.

Dumb as hell. Zero data supporting this stance.

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Give it a fucking rest with the masks already

We had a gigantic Omicron spike this time last year while masks were enforced everywhere. Perhaps that doc simply remembers that masks couldn't stop anything then. And whatever variant is around now is allegedly even more contagious.

A lot of these experts are completely out of touch with how feasible their recommendations are in real world applications.

At least this doc understands that.

If people don’t want to mask, I wish they’d at least cover their disgusting mouths when coughing then disinfect hands after and teach their children to do the same. Seems like everyone is sick right now and there is almost zero interest in trying to prevent spread.

Yeah, but reduces his chances of getting a respiratory illness, and if others wear it, further reduces that probability.

Masks are effective ways to reduce the spread of aerial diseases.

I learned this because I lived through a pandemic.

Yes, they worked SO WELL during covid that people just stopped getting covid.

/s

We had several waves of covid during the mask mandate era and it doesn't really appear to be any different from the waves we're seeing post mask mandate era.

Only siths deal in absolutes.

I'm talking about probability. You're talking about binary outcomes.

Masks are effective in reducing infection. Even before covid you might have noticed their use in sanitary or sterile environments.

There's nothing wrong in wanting to reduce risk.

This is an optional undertaking for students. Stop making this into something it's not.

I believe the US was one of the only Western countries to recommend a mask for children under 5. If my memory is correct, it might have been as high as 12 for most of the EU.

If you look at who's actually being hospitalized/dying of COVID, masking in school doesn't make sense.

Canada generally followed the US recommendations, but yes it was ridiculous.

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When it’s raining do you use an umbrella? Or because a couple drops are going to get on your shoes regardless do you also not cover your head?

It depends on how I feel and how long I have to be outside.

But more importantly, we do not force people to use umbrellas. If you want to get soaked, it's on you.

My son had to wear a mask from 2 to 4—half his life. We were on board when covid was killing people left and right but now we have a vaccine and tools to fight it.

Not to mention, young kids aren’t supposed to wear N95s and we know cloth masks are ineffective so what are we doing?? It’s nonsensical.

Follow the science. The science says cloth masks don’t work so let the young kids be maskless and if older kids make the choice to wear N95 they are well protected regardless of it others are masked. Let these kids have free will and choose for themselves.

Children deserve to have normalcy and see smiling faces. They’ve sacrificed a lot and it’s time to give them their childhoods back. Anyone who doesn’t understand that can fuck off.

Get the drool checked out? Every 2-4 year old drooled on their mask. They’re toddlers.

Except when you choose not to use an umbrella, you’re not also putting other people at risk of getting soaked.

A cloth mask, mandated only inside of school buildings, which is a place where kids will be taking off their shitty cloth masks to eat lunch every day will not protect anyone else either.

Okay, so there are two thoughts here that you have to be willing to separate.

The first is that masks aren’t effective at reducing transmission. This is wrong. They absolutely are effective at reducing transmission, and the science backs this up. Even cloth masks, which are less effective than n95s, still have some effect on reducing the number of droplets you spew out into the world when your wearing a mask.

The second thought is that the BPS application of a mask mandate like this is basically ineffective because of all the ways it’s easily ignored - which includes taking them off for lunch AND people who choose not to wear them. And that’s a valid criticism.

But to do nothing and expect people to just deal with getting sick is exactly what leads to massive spikes in hospitalizations, which is the real danger here. It’s not about kids getting sick. It’s about how quickly kids can spread those germs to everyone else without realizing it.

Just get off your high horse and think about other people for once.

You can't separate the two because in real life they are in constant conflict with each other.

Because people take masks off constantly to eat/drink/talk to their buddy 2 feet away, the entire premise behind the mandate collapses into reality, where we've seen case rates are basically the same with or without a mandate.

There's a reason we've never wasted time trying to impose mask mandates pre-covid.

“only siths deal in absolutes” made me laugh. thank you for that!

But, it does nothing to support the professionals in the school system and causes more confusion. Maybe, she could relate her thoughts in private to them. To say it on the news for the general public, causes misunderstandings, if not more.

You can opt out in elementary school, still have to pass 10th grade.

I find that the super pro mask crowd always pushes hard when they are usually the least inconvenienced by wearing the masks or only have to wear them a few minutes at a time.

If nothing else masks seem effective at slowing the spread of Influenza. Just to pivot from the toxic covid conversations, that isn’t the only virus going around.

Only things that work 100% of the time can be said to work. That's why cars and computers are never said to work.

lmao

There's a difference between 100% of the time and half the time.

Cloth masks offer little to no extra protection. If you’re wearing an N95 you’re well protected regardless of whether or not the other party is masked.

Mandates were only meant to be used temporarily when covid was at its worst. These kids have been severely impacted by covid for 2+ years. Enough with the nonsense—let’s use common sense and free will.

You want to send your kid in a mask? Go ahead. Don’t force others to do the same because you’re still paranoid.

Where are you getting 50% regarding masks?

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7106e1.htm

"cloth masks did not produce a statistically significant difference"

It's been so long since someone posted in response a study or official link to something as a way obfuscate a discussion. Even longer since I've seen someone shoot themselves in not one foot but both.

>"cloth masks did not produce a statistically significant difference"

Kids aren't wearing cloth masks. Those masks aren't handed out. Cloth masks are made of cloth. The masks being handed out are surgical masks, and many wear better variants. Kids are wearing surgical and respirator masks, which have an increased chance at blocking the spread of COVID - which is all these things ever aim for. The flu vaccine, for instance, is never 100% effective. It doesn't even need to be. Same with masks.

If you can find a school handing out cloth masks, or asking kids to wear cloth masks, you let them know about that study. Otherwise, the disposable masks people are wearing aren't cloth lmao

This is not true lol

TIL I am your 8 year old son.

Are you frequently in the position of standing outside holding an umbrella for 8+ hours every day?

I am thinking of other people, which is why I'm posting this for anyone who needs protection. Cheers! https://www.projectn95.org/collections/all-products/