isn't this blatantly illegal? fight for your rights, fired tesla workers!

That would imply that the general populace understands that we as individuals hold all the power. But they've been conditioned to believe that as an individual we can't change anything.

Totally illegal, but unfortunately the NLRB who are charged with enforcing those laws have been deliberately crippled in terms of the penalties they can impose. Or more accurately, they are not allowed to impose any penalties, the most they can do is restore a worker to their prior position with back pay (minus any money that worker made in the meantime).

In conclusion, repeal Taft -Hartley

That’s Musk for you.

Elon can afford breaking the law by firing these workers as it will cost him less in the long run then letting them unionize

"When the penalty for a crime is a fee, the law is for poor people"

Pretty sure Elon/Tesla haven't even been fulfilling their obligations to the State of NY for the Tesla facility in question. They're supposed to hire X number of workers by Y year for this facility and they're nowhere near meeting the numbers.

Thr podcast "Capitalisnt" had an episode interview (came out today, i think) of an author who wrtor a book on democracy and capitalism that is likely relevant here.

Though, given Musks a) questionable actions in the last as a company owner and b)appearance with Murdoch at the super bowl and also c) behavior in regards to Twitter, it is unlikely he cares about egalitarian govt or a fair, regulated market

He’s probably trying to get sued so they can appeal all the way to scotus and get whatever result they want. Slavery is in the future.

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I’m quite certain I don’t need to read a book to make that assumption. Dude is a capitalist autocrat - he is Capitler

Yeah. Let's just sit here and praise the billionaire Elon. Fuck the workers and their workers rights.

Nothing new here, corporate slave owners at their natural habitat

Tesla isn't dumb. I'm sure their HR consulted their lawyers and evaluated the risk.

But I'm positive that benefits of the chilling effect sacking a few pro-union employees had were far greater than whatever pittance they would pay to the NLRB and those employees were to Tesla.

Think of how expensive a union drive would be to a company that's already plummeting in value. I don't think the NLRB can just step in and shut down a company either.

Financial consequences of blatantly breaking the law * (1 - chance that they can make it a big enough pain in the ass to sue them that no suits go anywhere) < cost of workers unionizing

I wonder what class that shows up in in a business major

Elon Musk is a pig

Well, no, but its always good to have additional sources and get support for assertions

"It was about this time that Boss Hogg came up with an idea to deal with all them uppity workers..."

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Thanks for the podcast recommendation

Yes. Well, yes but sometimes no.

They're not allowed to organize a union drive in a manner that disrupts a regular work flow and they're not permitted to do it at work.

But an employer can't fire someone the second they start talking about unions. Evidence here shows they didn't do it on the clock.

This is misinformation. When will this sub stop accepting false reports just because you hate Elon?

https://www.tesla.com/blog/in-response-false-allegations

There is a false allegation that Tesla terminated employees in response to a new union campaign. These are the facts behind the event:

Tesla conducts performance review cycles every six months. Employees receive a performance rating from 1 to 5 in each cycle that helps them calibrate their work with the expectations of their job. In the worst case, if an employee fails to meet their performance expectations they will be let go. This review process takes place globally, including in North America, Europe, China, etc. It is not localized to Buffalo. The most recent performance review cycle was from July 2022 through December 2022. On December 13th, 2022, managers across the company received a communication regarding the review schedule. This included information noting that exits for low performers would start the week of February 12, 2023.

Elon fights for the every man...

To work in his Dad's emerald mine.

Tesla said... "Fuckin do something then, eh?"

I'll trust him more when he stops union busting, selling cars that are being recalled because they don't self drive as sold as, and not buying a Twitterverse then fully opening the door on hate speech while banning people for telling others to wear a mask.

"But my Elon~"

Not showing up to your job and getting fired? Don’t know, I’d assume you could but never thought about it. Doubt it’s illegal though

Elon is a POS

Not entirely sure a blog post from Tesla is exactly an unbiased source as to the true state of affairs.

Like it’s going to cost him anything. He has faced zero consequences for everything else he’s done. Securities fraud? No biggie. Calling a person a pedo and hiring a private investigator to dig up dirt on them, just another Monday.

His car have been recalled.

Can you spell DeLorean? Maybe one will be used in Back to the Future 6

Gotta love that the American government is owned by corporations. Between that and Citizens United, what is the point of government? We are just taken advantage of slowly becoming slaves.

Did you really source the Tesla website for allegations against them? Really?

Dont you just love that pos?

totally agreed. he's also hanging around rupert murdoch

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I’m not saying that but I am saying he’s a flaming bag ‘o poo stuck to our shoe

Tesla’s response: In Response to False Allegations

It’s not like legit reviews and firing pro-union individuals are mutually exclusive. The ones that would benefit the most from unionizing would be the ones in danger of failing their PIP’s/scoring poorly in successive reviews.

I do note the guy said he was told he was “exceeding expectations” but that may have been a lie from either party involved.

Go Union! Unionize Tesla and twitter and everyone one of musk’s business.

Unions will never work if AI can replace jobs. The better move will be to work for the competition.

BSAD/MGMT 3xx

Fuck Elon Musk

Always relevant

Isn’t that illegal

Main thing to do is to disincentivize this kind if behavior by stop supporting the company and brand. Stop buying Teslas don't go work there if you have other options

What’s concerning is no one is thinking about where this leads. A dystopia where the rich rule with an iron fist and their word is law.

It's no surprise that the worst employees would be the ones to want to unionize.

Not becoming already are.

Yay America

That is the point of government, to extract wealth from the masses in relative safety using a claimed monopoly on acceptable violence.

They should have kept that drive as silent as a Tesla.

I’ll see myself out.

Pretty sure I played that Simpsons game on Gameboy back in the 90s

This deserves jail time. Fines are just fees for wealthy companies.

Where is that blog post from? …

It’s from Tesla. MY. GOD.

That’s not a trustworthy source at all, especially considering they’re the accused in this scenario. Let the people who have degrees in this stuff investigate it, yes?

Some old German guys warned of this like 250 years ago I think they even wrote some books about it. I think they said the rest of working class people should band together and seize the means of production? Or something like that? Maybe it was seize the means of induction? They old and dead now so Idk maybe I’ll look it up later.

Illegal… shut them down

The government serves those that pay for it's service.

That's it.

You join government through an election, the election is one of the costs to do business with government.

Folks pool their money and get fractional interest in pokiticians, but they spread it across all of them so they will lean one way or another.

No money? No power.

Billionaire’s continue to take advantage of their workers. It’s disgusting.

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It was only one of them according to the response.

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How Tesla and Elon can get away with it? It’s illegal.

His mouth-breather lapdog fanboys read this and just think hustle harder and I too will be rich like silver spoon daddy

You know, if aliens invade tomorrow I’m just gonna side with them. Can’t be any worse than the people currently running this planet.

I’ve already decided Polestar or Mercedes is where I’m going for EVs so screw you Elon

Geez, if this is what the LLM in your brain generates in response to the title, you should take a break from the internet. Disconcerting.

Happy birthday

It's in NAFTA 2.0 that trump passed.

Literally in a treaty.

Leads? We're already there.

What's the zealots response to this ? How are they defending high priest musk ?

Unfortunately the press and anyone can scream anything.

Before you fall into this rabbit hole, check Teslas response.

Expand please

When daddy sees its field slaves calling for a mutiny, that’s when it’s time for severe punishment.

Ah, sweet capitalism /s

Hustle that hustle life, bro

The unionized Tesla workers in Germany should strike for retaliation

ACLU?

I play and make games all day, don’t “hustle”, have never owned Tesla shares, and was sad to hear about Elon buying Twitter. I don’t think I’m part of whatever demographic you are so vehemently against.

That should cost Elon the company... Oh and a severe spanking,

And just the other day Taibbi and Rogan defending Musk against the cancel culture with there is no legitimate argument that Musk is a conservative. Fuckers are bought and paid.

... but what do we do with all these pitchforks?

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Targets may have shifted, but the global annual review process claim would fall apart really quickly if not true. If there was an annual review process going on, the public announcement of a union effort between performance reviews and actions following those reviews is more then a little suspicious.

Is you knew you were on a performance improvement plan (corporate for "you are about to be fired, we just need documentation"), and knew how much the internet hates Elon, this headline wouldn't be too hard to generate.

If Tesla has the receipts, fuck these guys. If Tesla doesn't and this was actually retaliatory, fuck Tesla. There will almost certainly be lawsuits to figure this out.

Jesus, you're boring.

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Oh I'm sad alright

Elon Musk plays hardball why are people surprised this is all part of the billionaires playbook.Concern for the worker stops at the point that it begins to approach equitable payment. They operate on 'more for me less for thee' Its long past time that the workers were given a share in the prosperity they create as a matter of principle.

How convenient

Elon is such a cool guy, isn't he? At first he forces Twitter employees to work under inhumane conditions, now he shoots at unions again. He may have some cool ideas, but he's just as bad of an asshole as bezos and other billionaires.

Let's hope that he'll fall on his face with that bs.

Punishable by a fine means legal for a price.

> What’s concerning is no one is thinking about where this leads.

Wrong, wrong, wrong.

Conservatives have not only thought about where this leads - they're the ones leading the charge.

> A dystopia where the rich rule with an iron fist and their word is law.

Yes - and they're fucking salivating.

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Yes, if they are fired for trying to unionize it's illegal. Problem will be that Tesla is likely collecting a bunch of info on every worker, like internet activity and clock in/out times, etc etc. The official firing will be for violation of some written policy.

that’s wild… cannot impose penalties..? who else is going to penalize the company for breaking the law…

It’s not illegal, it’s not their company. Don’t like where you work leave. If the company is a bad place to work it will fail if not it will thrive and all the noise will be found out to be false.

I'm a progressive, but this is a much worse situation than just the Republicans.

The democrats held both houses of congress for 2 years, during an unprecedented era of unionization, and they didn't do shit to help then....

People were unionizing at some of the largest corporations on earth (Amazon, Starbucks, etc.) And our "liberal" party just sat there.

Where was Biden, Harris, Pelosi, etc. When they were unionizing the Amazon factory in NYC?

Why didn't they pass ANY legislation to help them? They didn't even make a fucking speech!

Then, the Biden administration spit in the faces of those railworkers, and wouldn't even give then a measly 7 days of sick leave.

We have 2 conservative, anti-worker parties in our 2-party system.

I wish it was just one party, but working class Americans literally have to overcome both parties in our political systems and i don't even know how to go about that.

Corporations have us check-mated.

It us illegal to fire someone for trying to form a union. That’s why companies will instead INVENT other reasons to fire them regardless of whether or not its true

If you take the company's word for it, no company ever does any wrong.

Tesla already has a poor track record for how they treat employees, do I'm inclined to distrust their defense.

You do know that anti-union companies identifying likely union organizers prior to drive announcements is practically step 1 of the anti-union playbook right.

Who needs aliens?

Let's just round up all the politicians and oligarchs ourselves?

We outnumber them 10,000-to-1

Lock the doors to every bank on Wallstreet, and burn it down with them inside

Meanwhile, Americans can't afford eggs and bread.

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Lol, oh, Tesla say all the unionizers are just low performers?

....and why would they lie? Why would they try to get you to hate the poor workers just trying to secure better working conditions for themselves?

Jesus, when the richest man in the world called you up for duty in his class war, you suited up REAL quick.

How about instead of having solidarity with the richest, most powerful, and morally corrupt man on the planet, why not have solidarity with the rest of the working stiffs?

You don't know a single fucking thing about Elon, you have absolutely nothing in common with him. But those Tesla workers are the same 9-to-5ers that your parents and grandparents were.

Freak coincidence, got really unlucky

It's so weird the number of people who would side with the richest man in the world, over a bunch of 9-to-5 mechanics and machinists

What the fuck is wrong with people?

Like, Elon Musk hangs out with Saudi Royals and Media Oligarchs line Rupert Murdoch.

It's just so fucking insane to me how anyone would side with him over the laborers in his factories, doing the same jobs that their parents or grandparents did.

Republicans are a man running at you with a knife saying "I'm going to stab you." Democrats are a man saying "I'm your friend" before stabbing you in the back.

Oh yea, I think some places ran with that idea. I can't remember the details, but I think things went south pretty quickly. I think a few people died here and there.

I love when people express their opinions on something, then when people disagree they assume that the other person is "bought and paid for".

Nevermind that these people are on a first name basis and have personal relationships. This would be like me telling you my friend is left-leaning (based on knowing them), and you telling me they are far-right and I'm "bought and paid for" because you read a blog. That's just a stupid argument to make. You have no idea what you are talking about.

I actually skipped over that podcast, but now I need to listen to it because people keep bitching about it. But that's just par for the course, I guess

Edit: I listened to the podcast. At 2:00:00 they discuss exactly this and make the same point I am making.

No, they’re someone saying “I’m your friend” and hesitating to give you the knife.

Biden recently passed legislature increasing funding for the NRLB, the organisation dedicated to prosecuting illegal union-busting. That is not much yet, but it’s important help, definitely not stabbing in the back.

This is exactly how US politics looks from outside the US. You have a right wing party acting in the interests of the rich and a more right wing party acting in the interests of the rich and being a bit more militant about it. The far right party are always screaming at the right-wing party for being left-wing extremists.

Plus the whole "woke" thing which serves as little more than a distraction from the fact that the entire political system is biased towards the new lords and masters.

Oh yea where? sounds crazy.

There was this wonderful phrase in 1984 that went something like "The proles could overthrow the government as easily as a horse shaking off fleas, yet they don't."

You accuse me of having “no idea what I am talking about.” And your the one that didn’t even listen to the podcast I mentioned? Union busting is a conservative last time. Wtf fuck are you even talking about? There is no other way to interpret it.

It's "monopoly of violence". "Acceptable" doesn't come into it.

It's literally the thing that defines government.

He gave funding to the nrlb, and didn’t give them the power to impose penalties? What good is money if they can’t impose fines?

We made this cage we are now trapped in. We put these people in power, we allowed them to constantly go against our best interest. Make no mistake, we have no one to blame but outselves

Wouldn’t they be able to sue for wrong ful termination. There would have to be a paper trail of all those people be low performers for this to be legit. And I highly doubt that every person who want a union was a low performer.

Elon doesn’t strike me as a person who thinks his actions through. Seems more of a shoot from the hip kinda person.

Worse, the people who will be most affected negatively cheer it on and vote for people who support it

Inhumane conditions? Let’s be honest. Inhumane conditions is working in a coal mine, not working at twitter

Good thing I'll be a billionaire any day now.

Not illegal at all in most states. If you're willing to be part of a union, I'm going to assume you suck at your job. You can be fired for sucking at your job at any time.

Implying that the podcast (that doesn't even have Musk in it) is the lynchpin of "understanding Elon Musk" makes you look really disingenuous.

I'm sure we could comb through your political opinions and find conservative opinions. Does that make you a conservative? Or does that just make you an individual with nuanced opinions? How many conservative opinions is a "liberal" allowed to have before they get their membership revoked? Fewer than you? The same as you? That would be convenient.

Edit: oh, would you look at that. I listened to the podcast and at 2:00:00 they start discussing the topic of labelling people as one thing or the other based on one data point. In fact, they basically repeat my argument.

Edit2: typical. Asked a question they don't like their own answer to, so they just leave.

How many conservative opinions is a "liberal" allowed to have before they get their membership revoked by you?

Didn't Obama try to expand Union power by passing card check Nationwide?

Why don't you delineate between who in the government is doing what you're saying and who is trying the opposite?

I can't recall where but I do recall at least a few mustaches. Searching through notable mustaches might turn something up.

Elon got that Emerald mine mentality. He treats workers like slaves as far as he can get away with.

I'm sure you have a tighty little perfect explanation for why musk was hanging out with Rupert Murdoch at the super bowl too?

Totally innocent! totally out of context! it's all of YOU who are mistaken!!!

I said "Tesla" and not Elon intentionally. If he's got enough bandwidth to be the CEO of several companies, he's not really involved in any of them. Plus his current shiny thing is getting more people on Twitter to see his posts.

The beatings will continue until moral improves.

Actually, I did recently comment on that reddit post. I'll find what I said, just for special little you.

Edit:

>My first thought was that he is isolated from liberal figureheads because they don't want to be seen with him since he is hot in the media right now, and then he is also extremely wealthy so that is going to mean he ends up in a certain area with a certain VIP status. The only people he could interact with are probably these types. I don't think him and Murdoch go golfing or have late night chats. But who knows.

Most of those online supporters are bots and the ruling class and their sycophants. I don’t think the majority does but they aren’t as vocal online.

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I think you just made it into a few lists

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You think there's some sort of large shared skybox between all the billionaires? Like you don't understand that these are individual suites with an entrance and security that you would need to be invited to?

It honestly reads like you think that musk just strolled in there because it was the path of least resistance.

It’s at this point that the old saw about “temporarily-embarrassed millionaires” usually comes out, in that these people don’t want to be subject to the same regulation when they get rich.

But, I just think people don’t know what benefits unions brought to their parents and grandparents. If they’re like me, they’ve lived through the era of corrupt unions, and think they’re just schemes to make a select few rich. They don’t see that, done on the up-and-up, a union can make a world of difference in pay and working conditions. I’ve come to see it through my partner, whose life became much better doing union work.

ah yes the both sides are the same argument. you dressed it up more convincingly than the usual suspects do tho so kudos for that.

edit: simplified my comment

Hey let’s not sully the good name of pigs by comparing them to a creature like elon

This article is misleading. The layoffs were planned before the 27 employees filed to unionized. Out of the 27 employees, only one got fired. The rest were not even trying to unionize, it was due to poor performance reviews.

Read more about it, because this misinforming articles are disgusting.

Then why are you so invested in responding?

Sounds like Twitter

Tesla will pay a small fine and continue taking lessons from the likes of Walmart and Amazon.

What sucks is that makes some good products here in the US but treats it’s workers like shit. In Musk’s eyes and the rest of the billionaires we are just surfs there to make them wealthier. I wanted a Tesla Power Wall for my solar system but I’m not going to give him my money. It’s the only power we have.

Nobody cares because a ton of people own tesla stock and care about their stock more than what’s good for the country

Yeah the current Board is the best we've had in many decades and is trying to get creative about working around the restrictions, but as you can see in that article they're still in the rulemaking stage, after which the new proposed penalties will have to survive court challenges - not easy under this SCOTUS.

Well for other laws there's sometimes actual enforcement, but yeah labor laws are not really enforced in America.

To be clear, my comment wasn't a pro Elon comment at all, I was just pointing out that you sounded like an unhinged chronically online redditor, and that it would probably be good for your mental health to move to a cabin in the woods for a few months. Enjoy the sun and fishing. I don't have a dog in this reddit-vs-the-rich fight one way or another.

As for my investment in replying, it's fun I guess? What else is there to do when you're not hustling all day?

Seems to mostly be "don't challenge your boss, if you want to be treated better just quit and hope you can find a better job"

You just don’t want to admit that corporations HATE unions and will do whatever it takes to prevent them from forming

And no one with any worker sense is anti-union.

I conduct environmental research for a living. I spend all day in the woods. I think I actually need more time indoors. Your assessment is grossly inaccurate and frankly a tired trope at this point.

Respect. And now you sound like a normal person again. Nevertheless, I imagine you didn't learn to talk about mouth-breathing lapdogs and hustling and silver spoon daddies from the squirrels.

Screw Tesla.

What the fuck? Minus any money they made in the meantime?! That literally disincentivizes working.

Not corporations. Rich selfish sociopaths... There are people who make these decisions who have names and addresses.

"I don't understand the limitations of the executive branch."

Because he literally can't. It requires legislation.

Yeah it is pretty nuts: https://www.epi.org/publication/shortchanged-weak-anti-retaliation-provisions-in-the-national-labor-relations-act-cost-workers-billions/

Though on the plus side the current Dem controlled Board is trying to find ways to stretch their authority to improve things: https://nortonrosefulbright.com/en-us/knowledge/publications/e03ca5f7/nlrb-revises-back-pay-formula

Of course he’s afraid of a union, he’d have to treat his workers with respect and dignity, something impossible for a person with only one eye and it’s looking at himself

“They Live” movie. The rich are aliens.

more proof of why it IS needed. fuck the apartheid benefitting nepo baby and all that simp him

Are you under the impression that people with exceptional means are in the same circumstances as the rest of us? Do you honestly believe that these hyperwealthy people are not segregated from the general public? That seems extremely naive.

And again, do you think Musk would enjoy being surrounded by liberal figureheads? Or do you think they might be pretty shitty to hang around with, to keep up appearances? Would you voluntarily go into the room of people who hate you and/or refuse to be seen with you?

Who is praising him? The person you responded to is pointing out what the issue is, not saying anyone is right for taking advantage of the issue lol. Are you a boy responding to the wrong comment? Maybe you just didn't actually read the comment you replied to or your reading comprehension is so poor you didn't understand what you were reading?

What people don't understand is that this is simply the neoliberal economic theory as adopted by both major political parties.

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Keeping up appearances

Yes, if the title were true. It appears that Tesla has identified low performing workers and warned them months ago late last year. They were finally fired right before the union was organized and only 1 of 27 were later identified to actually be part of the union. None of the union organizers were fired either. Tesla's lawyers just announced this and they would have serious repercussions if they lied about this and did not have proveable memo's.

If they were targeting union members they would have done a better job targeting them. It looks like they actually only removed low performing workers that were slated for removal through the warning process already.

We are falling for clickbait articles here because we love to hate Tesla/Musk.