How is living in Vermont?

Submitted by RockLobsterCakes t3_zzjofc in vermont

My husband and I were discussing leaving Florida this evening, and we were throwing around the idea of Vermont. I did a small search on cost of living but I’d really love to hear from folks that are living there. Do you like your state? Do you hate it? What’re the pros and cons to you?

Edit: I messed up and hit post before actually posting my questions. Big dumb sometimes.

Second Edit: Thank you so much for all the input and information from everyone. The new year started out pretty terrible for my little family so moving is now off the books. I’ll keep everything in mind, if the chance to even visit your beautiful state becomes an option. Please, be safe and stay kind.

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Unusual-Form-77 t1_j2cy6xl wrote

The cost of living is surprisingly high, e.g. Burlington’s is about 10% higher than Orlando. We have a relatively severe housing shortage. The median home cost in Burlington is 30% higher than Orlando. Religiosity is a lot lower in VT, which might be a culture shock coming from Florida. Our shortest day is 8h50, vs. 10h20 in Orlando. Our roads are terrible. We have very few chain restaurants and lots of very good independent restaurants. Our public schools are very good because our property taxes are high. Everyone drives a Subaru. There is no fake maple syrup. It gets really cold. It gets really hot, and not everyone has air conditioning. We have black bears, but no alligators. We have the best cheddar cheese and beer in the observable universe. We have hills and mountains. Our lowest point is still above where sea level would be if all the ice melted. Everyone’s front porch slopes down. The stripes they paint on our roads only last a few months before being worn off by people who leave their studded snow tires on year-round. Strangers don’t make eye contact or greet each other. Road salt both saves and destroys our cars. People ride bicycles for transportation. We have reproductive liberty. It costs about 4x as much to have your lawn mowed, so most people do it themselves. We have skiing, but it’s so expensive and so crowded it’s not much fun anymore. We have a lot of mountain biking. We have community supported agriculture. Gun violence is up about 1000%. Until recently there wasn’t any meth, but now there’s meth. Drivers are impatient and not very good. Waitstaff are overworked. We have amazing cheddar cheese (that bears repeating).

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ttvalkyrie25 t1_j2dhco8 wrote

Of all the similar ‘what’s life like in VT’ posts, this has got to be the most real, honest, accurate answer I’ve seen. Brilliant.

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Vermontess t1_j2evaug wrote

For real can we pin it

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zonitronic t1_j2exk9u wrote

Seconded. Merits pinning solely on the fact that we have amazing cheddar cheese. Outstanding comment overall!

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somedudevt t1_j2dl1oq wrote

The gun violence thing is interesting, especially given how for 230 years we had 0 gun control, then as soon as our brilliant leaders enacted laws violence spiked.

It’s also interesting that if you look at the demographics of those committing the gun violence almost all of them are not from vermont. Our influx of migration is unfortunately bringing an influx of drugs and crime. Much of it is in populations who are underserved (esl, refugee, etc). In Burlington all but one murder this year was committed by a person born outside the state. While our population on a whole is ~95% white every murder in Burlington this year was committed by a POC and almost all the victims were also POC. It’s honestly sad, because it really shows how segregated our interactions are here.

We pretend to be such an open state, and yet we seem to have totally abandoned segments of our communities, which is what allows this crime to occur. As long as we allow young people to fall into life’s of crime due to poverty and educational factors, and as long as we fail to help those with addiction problems, we will see these crimes rise, and we will see the disparity in prison population makeup vs general population makeup.

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Unusual-Form-77 t1_j2dntu8 wrote

It's drugs, mental health, guns, and our weak legal system. Our (former?) commissioner of Public Safety, Mike Sherling said as much. He also said that offenders have told law enforcement that they come specifically to Vermont to do their drug trade because our legal system is less robust than our New England neighbors. With drugs, comes crime. We also have a lot of suicide.

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No-Ganache7168 t1_j2fg6at wrote

Of course they do. Then they turn out young people into addicts who turn to crime to feed their habits and end up in low-barrier shelters where there are few recourses to help them to get sober and no incentive to stop using or stealing. It’s a systemic failure

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Wade904 t1_j2eoxw8 wrote

Laws are the reason for gun violence 🤦‍♂️

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berlage1856 t1_j2e8e6u wrote

This is a great reply, except I have to add a bit of nuance to your comment that “it gets really hot, and not everyone has air conditioning.” Temperatures in the summer have certainly risen here in the past decade and will likely continue to rise, but there is no way someone from Florida is going to think summers are “really hot” here. Perhaps you only meant to say that there a few very warm days here every summer: I would agree with that. And one further thing: heat pumps are likely to take over here in the next ten years and with a heat pump comes air conditioning. that’s just the way they work.

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Climate_Face t1_j2f5e7z wrote

There definitely is fake maple syrup and those establishments which use it should be shunned. Otherwise, pretty spot on, especially the bit about beer and cheese, and the biking. Vermont is shifting to a biking paradise, which is awesome (for those who like it, like me).

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dcv0p wrote

I do love the cheese but. Everything thing else sounds real similar to northern Florida. I’d be glad for the lack of religious influence in everything. I love all critters, so I know I’ll miss my gators but bears are down here too- they are much more friend-shaped anyway. I greatly enjoyed reading your comment and thank you for all the information/food for thought!

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kabfighter2 t1_j2c0344 wrote

Prepare to watch your karma evaporate, friend.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c2iuh wrote

No biggie to me. I’m not a superstar. Just curious!

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ttvalkyrie25 t1_j2dgzup wrote

I can’t wrap my head around why people downvoted this comment :( stay curious, my friend.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dkg74 wrote

No matter the karma points, I shall always be a curious creature. Stay kind!

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Nutmegdog1959 t1_j2d0qx8 wrote

You might be interested to know we have a Republican Governor, Phil Scott, although he is rather dull. He is so boring his Secret Service code name is Phil Scott.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dd5y3 wrote

It…sounds better than Desantis, which we like to call “Deathsantis.” I think I could go for boring…

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fjwjr t1_j2ccax8 wrote

https://preview.redd.it/bfjowqsqg79a1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=34a17983e0676829b3b16907f9661ad3a255a134

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2ccyf1 wrote

After reading about mud season, I can hear my car groaning. Down here, if there has been a lot of rain and any of the rivers have risen- you never go driving down to them because the sand roads will tear your car wheels off if you don’t have the proper kind of vehicle to travel down them.

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Technical_Aerie9649 t1_j2d0sxm wrote

There are no routes to avoid the VT mud and there is no proper vehicle for it.

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Merino_w00l t1_j2ewnoe wrote

That’s not necessarily true. If you live and work in Burlington/s Burlington/Winooski/Essex etc, many many roads are paved and mud is not an issue.

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Technical_Aerie9649 t1_j2ex051 wrote

Absolutely, if you live in some parts of Chittenden Co. you can avoid dirt roads, but practically everywhere else is not afforded the same luxury. When I lived in Essex on the Westford border I was often plowing through a significant amount of mud and getting stuck left and right. It’s been an issue everywhere I’ve lived except for Grand Isle.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dci15 wrote

Oh! That’s gnarly. I’ll keep that in mind. Thank you!

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Technical_Aerie9649 t1_j2diy4j wrote

I don’t mean it in an exaggerated sense either, not trying to scare you off. The road to my house was closed to all traffic outside of homeowners for 4 weeks this past spring. My 4WD truck with mud tires struggled hard to get through every morning and night. Sometimes there is no other way to get places in VT, especially outside of Chittenden Co. Dirt roads cannot be avoided in most parts of the state

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dkdpn wrote

No worries! Some parts of northern Florida are like that too! After heavy storms, hurricanes, and the like- you just ain’t safe going down the sandy/muddy roads. It’s good to know about what to expect so one can plan as accordingly as possible. Anytime a hurricane is barreling towards us, you make sure you’ve got batteries, water, non-perishables, and if it’s a real baddie- you leave. It’s Mother Nature and I’m just living in her world.

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bleahdeebleah t1_j2dq0yb wrote

Vermont does actually have paved roads. But there are a lot of dirt roads and long driveways.

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Twombls t1_j2c4hfm wrote

Search the subreddit. There are 999999999 other posts.

But the short answer is vt is seeing a mass housing shortage similar to Florida and its impossible to find a place to live.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c528j wrote

Okay, thank you for the input. I’ll look at the other posts as well.

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Ill-Nerve-3154 t1_j2ft963 wrote

Whoa whoa whoa, you mean a double wide trailer on half an acre for $300,000 is a bad deal?

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stoweman t1_j2dhmxd wrote

Bottom line, Vermont is not convenient for stores, medical, travel, food delivery, high speed internet, and most of all good coffee. You’ll need multiple sets of tires and an awd vehicle.

Outdoor life is great.

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microtoastt t1_j2dk57b wrote

This depends on where you live. I’m near Putney and it’s only 2 hours to Logan Airport, which I drive to or from every three weeks. I also have fiber channel going right up my dirt road, giving me a gigabyte up and down. Also curious as to the coffee comments, as there are local roasters doing both the more trendy single origin as well as Italian style blends. Rockingham Roasters is made by hand in a small coffee shop and it’s pretty decent.

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whateverkitty-1256 t1_j2f1vf8 wrote

I think that's why the upper valley is a great area. It really has a decent answer for many of those questions. EC Fiber for internet, Dartmouth Hitchcock for healthcare, 2 hrs to logan a little over 1 to Manchester airprt, great coffee all around.

definitely need multiple sets of tires and awd though and too spread out for food delivery.

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Team_Flight_Club t1_j2fu70u wrote

I love how it’s quicker to get to Boston and new haven than it is to Burlington. Also, Duchess Coffee in bratt is very good too.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dl08d wrote

It’s nice to know that the fiber optics is an option. You’ve got to fight tooth and nail in some parts of the city I live in to get them to even want to lay it down.

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microtoastt t1_j2dmcta wrote

100% depends on your location though. Much of the state is fairly underserved

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dkvk1 wrote

I’ll keep that in my memory banks. Tires and not my little Honda fit. The outdoors sounds amazing from the posts on here. Thank you!

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hunny_bun_24 t1_j2f1c79 wrote

I have a Honda fit and live in what’s considered northern Vermont. You’ll be ok.

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WillingnessKey7359 t1_j2ehq2r wrote

My husband and I have not driven awd or 4wd ever and we have been fine. However, there are some driveways/ dirt roads out in rural areas that would require awd at least during mud season or winter. Snow tires and knowing the roads you’ll be driving with the conditions is a must.

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[deleted] t1_j2c0h84 wrote

So I live in nh but am in all the new england subreddits to see what's going on in the area.

These questions are pretty much daily now. I just enjoy the comments but it's interesting watching people migrate in real time.

That's all.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c2v64 wrote

I’ll peek at the other New England subs. I’ve lived in Florida my whole life, I want out.

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Prohamen t1_j2dng7h wrote

tbh i moved here about a year ago and it sucks

cost of living is high, road are pretty bad in some areas (no fault to state gov, there is just a lot of roads to be fixed on their budget), housing is expensive

thinking about moving away to somewhere cheaper

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Ciderinsider86 t1_j2c1680 wrote

Are you a nurse, because then you might get non-snarky answers

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c2l8s wrote

Medical assistant with some years of experience, going to go for my certification

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kabfighter2 t1_j2c5ah1 wrote

Unless you've got $50,000+ of equity in a home you already own to put down 20% on a house (they are all going for $250,000+ now) you are going to have a very hard finding a place to live. Medical assistants are paid pretty poorly here (as are most healthcare professionals)...I'm an RN and I would legitimately not be able to buy a house from square one (zero existing equity) even on year ten pay.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c66ff wrote

We do own our home here but this helps me greatly. I really appreciate you for the honesty.

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Jerry_Williams69 t1_j2c66m5 wrote

There are some pretty awesome sign-in bonuses at UVMMC and you might qualify for a $7500 credit from the state.

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somedudevt t1_j2dlqjq wrote

Fix where you are from. We can’t be the utopia destination for all the liberals from the south. We need you all to take back power. If you all come here, then all your states become more red. If you need to leave go somewhere purple where your vote could swing a national election. Wisconsin, New Hampshire are both not Florida and have outsized political importance. Nevada and Arizona also fit that bill.

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hunny_bun_24 t1_j2f2aov wrote

What? You cant ask individuals to not move to Vermont based on politics lol

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Dadfart802 t1_j2c8atl wrote

We’re full

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c980w wrote

I respect your response.

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Dadfart802 t1_j2caqly wrote

I’m lazy but they’res just no housing and we’re not building any new houses because we’re hostile to immigrants and opiate use has chewed up most of the blue collar workers

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2ccic5 wrote

We’ve got similar problems here as well… Meth is destroying our smaller towns. Thank you for your honesty. I understand where you’re coming from. Side note, your screen name is fantastic.

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microtoastt t1_j2d9nig wrote

No we aren’t

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Dadfart802 t1_j2du7r4 wrote

Sure if you want to live in Springfield, Brattleboro or some scuzzy part of southern vermont, but who wants that

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microtoastt t1_j2dziu5 wrote

Oh good point there are no other towns south of Randolph other than Springfield or Brattleboro my bad

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microtoastt t1_j2dzwio wrote

Oh good point there are no towns south of Randolph other than Springfield or Brattleboro my bad

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Dadfart802 t1_j2eawbc wrote

Cool strawman because that’s not what I said, but when you can’t refute it. You could have said, “what about Manchester or Dorset?” and that would have been way easier.

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microtoastt t1_j2ecy6m wrote

Yes but why bother

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Dadfart802 t1_j2egjpd wrote

In your case cuz it’s easier to be a dick and twist my words apparently

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microtoastt t1_j2em2gn wrote

Am I going to waste time with dedicated Reddit troll who calls himself “dad fart”? No, I’m not. I’m going to block and move on with my day. Happy new year buddy

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scollaysquare t1_j2c2o88 wrote

I got sick of the ice - ice on the roof, ice on the sidewalks, ice on the roads - and moved back to Massachusetts.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c33n6 wrote

My stepdad is from Mass, and lives in Florida with my mother- he wants to go back so bad.

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soilgrownsativas t1_j2c6hao wrote

It’s a hard state to just up and move to if you’ve lived in Florida your whole life. There are things you take for granted living there. The reason there are snow birds is everything is harder. Moving around for one. Driving is harder snow tires are a must, walking is harder also. Darkness from November to May is brutal. Other things like my mother in laws joints don’t hurt in Florida but up here they do. I have no reason for that it’s just true. It’s also quite and beautiful but do a little research you’ll have bills you didn’t expect and your car will need some upgrades but if you are up to challenge by all means it will be worth it..

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[deleted] t1_j2dqjy7 wrote

People hear “darkness” and they think shorter days, but much of VT is as cloudy as Seattle, just like upstate NY. That’s what really gets people, IMO. It’s not as bad as Alaska or Scotland, but it’s pretty awful.

The days themselves are actually not that much shorter than northern Florida, and we get longer summer days in return. It all balances out.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dsex9 wrote

Thank you!! The sun gets pretty loud here, darkness sounds relieving.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c8nfb wrote

Thank you! This helps me greatly.

I’ve heard of putting chains on the tires for snow, but I like doing things the right way.

The snow birds are one of the reasons we’re having housing shortages down here in FL.

I don’t speak with my mother and my late MIL won’t have to worry about arthritis 👀. So maybe it’ll be better, until I get the arthritis?

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StillPlantain9910 t1_j2c97j9 wrote

It sucks. Stay in Florida.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2ca3lg wrote

Thanks for the input. Any particular reason why or just in-general? Side note, I love your screen name.

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StillPlantain9910 t1_j2ccnys wrote

I’m only half kidding. Do you like grey and cold and knowing nary a soul?

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2cd7lr wrote

Yes. It sounds better than bright, hot, and crowded.

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microtoastt t1_j2d9zog wrote

This vermont Reddit seems to collect only the most jaded of Vermonters so keep that in mind with these responses. The winters aren’t that dark and grey- no more so than nearly all of Europe. It can get cold but sustained temps below zero are becoming more of a rare event than an expectation. The I89 corridor between Montpelier and Winooski has seen a lot of growth, which results in tighter housing supply and higher prices, but there are plenty of other areas in the state.

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VermontArmyBrat t1_j2dhmwz wrote

This comment. I’m fairly certain the percent of negative people here far outweighs real life. And don’t forget the grass is always greener saying, in that many of the negative comments about living in VT seem to come from people that never lived anywhere else.

I was born in VT. When I was young my father joined the Army. We then lived in KY (two separate times about 3 years each), MD, Germany (two separate times, different cities 5 years total). When I graduated HS in MD and my father was being sent to KY a third time I was like nope. I’m done. I stayed in MD, worked various jobs lived in several cities. Then got a transfer to NY and lived there for a couple years. I returned to VT about 25 years ago. And I love it.

Expensive? Yes, property taxes are lower in other states. Crime? Yes we have that, but less than nearly every other state. Quality of life? Yes, it’s better here. Especially if you actually get and do things. Housing hard to find? Yes, but a simple Google search tells us that’s not unique to VT. Would I rather never again have to shovel snow or change tires? Yes, but not if requires living somewhere that’s hot and humid half the year.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dldtl wrote

You’re a beautiful soul. Thank you for sharing your story! I’m taking in all the comments here, because even the grouchy posts can gleam small tidbits of the kind of folks you’ll find. I’m lowkey waiting for the “we don’t want floridaman here.” We don’t want him either. Hah.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2dd0i4 wrote

The Florida Reddit can get jaded about these questions too. I appreciate your food for thought! Thank you, thank you.

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Jerry_Williams69 t1_j2c74c1 wrote

I love it here. You get all 4 seasons, although this winter is wimpy. You also get at least one bonus season: mud season. This is the one thing I don't like about Vermont. It is a period between the first thaw and late spring when everything is muddy. Can't hike, can't mountain bike, skiing is pretty much done, and the dirt roads are treacherous.

That being said, there are endless things to do here. Just about every outdoor activity you can think of (even surfing, sort of). Very few chain restaurants or stores, but most of the local options will will make it hard for you to go back to chains. Vermont is a great hub for adventures too. Adirondacks are about an hour west and the White Mountains are about an hour and a half East. From Burlington, you are about 90 minutes from Montreal, about 3 hours from Albany, and about 4 hours from Boston.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c95tl wrote

Thank you so much! Which areas are more known for the wilds/wildlife? Do you have favorite haunts? It’s something we love about Florida, but with anything green being turned into a high-end apartment building, that nobody can afford- we’re running out of it. Or it feels like that.

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Jerry_Williams69 t1_j2cd3vd wrote

My favorite mountain to climb is Camel's Hump. It is awesome year around with a 360° clear view from the top. Most of the state is rural. Outdoorsy possibilities are endless.

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2cdf2k wrote

You are phenomenal. Thank you again!

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microtoastt t1_j2da7x6 wrote

The southern part of the state is more rural, which means more wildlife but also fewer restaurants. Ignore the curmudgeons, it’s a unique and special state.

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bretp79 t1_j2dlbms wrote

Moved in 2020 moved back in 2022 was in broward now I’m in Tampa We couldn’t get how ppl love it . It’s got it’s positives But the darkness was just to much plus we were in Rutland county and it was depressing But if you’re into quite life skiing etc it’s paradise Someone one here once described it as a fickle fickle mistress…. I couldn’t agree more

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2doz9i wrote

Did you find a lack of mosquitoes up in VT or are they just bigger/meaner? Gotta ask top priority questions of my fellow Floridians.

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bretp79 t1_j2eb68d wrote

There’s none in broward/miami. Tampa their definitely is ! Just small misquotes. The bugs outside during the summer in Vermont were ridiculous like being outside is uncomfortable especially the black flies . For me Florida >Vermont not even close but that’s me ! If it’s perfect for you you’ll love the solitude and quite But if you like ethnic food and culture better stay in Florida

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hunny_bun_24 t1_j2f22hs wrote

I moved here from California and Vermont sucks imo. It lacks any type of amenities that most other states would have. The only saving grace that is here and the only thing that local hold onto is that the outdoors is literally on your doorstep. There’s a ton of trails n stuff so that’s good if you’re into it but…honestly you can obviously experience great outdoor activities in florida as well just gotta drive a bit. Food is terrible, people out here do not know how to season food and the selection is the worst I’ve ever seen. White people making Mexican food is never a great idea lol. I don’t hate this state but I plan on moving back home in the next 15 months. If you are older and have health issues you should move to a place in Vermont that has actual health services. Internet has been fine for me since I have xfinity. Grocery stores lack any product diversity. Coffee shops are solid imo.

Please visit for like a week before moving up and stay in the town you plan to live in.

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seanwalter123 t1_j2ew2ly wrote

Not from vt but frequent all of New England, also frequent Florida. Florida is full of things to do, if you’re a home body you may like it here but if you like anything exciting besides the outdoors you’ll be very disappointed. Employment is also a real issue, depending on your occupation you probably won’t make the same amount of money. Biggest thing I’ve noticed is the lack of new infrastructure, New England in general is becoming dilapidated while Florida is the total opposite. NH as of right now seems like the only state in New England with an actual growing economy that is translating into more private sector investment.

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KotzubueSailingClub t1_j2c4xbc wrote

Why is everyone lamenting the question instead of responding with an answer?

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RockLobsterCakes OP t1_j2c5vxe wrote

Folks do it in the Florida subreddit too. It’s okay. I’m learning, even from these small interactions.

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motomary t1_j2eb7iy wrote

It’s cold here. Really cold. For like 6 months of the year.

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weareami t1_j2f8mfm wrote

Vermont is inconvenient, expensive, and one of the most beautiful states in the USA

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RMTWHODAT t1_j2esv93 wrote

Cost of living in northern New England states is high. Paying for heat for at least 6 months is a huge expense. Electricity isn't cheap either.

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Fantastic_Painter_15 t1_j2fduba wrote

I fucking love it. No matter how many places I travel to or how far away I go, this damn state always calls me back. I can’t stay away. It’s like a drug

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kingblow1 t1_j2fsqp2 wrote

Its cold, our economy is rough, housing is hard to find, and stuff is always breaking. That said, born and raised here and love it. We have every season, real maple syrup, tremendous hunting and fishing, and most people actually give a damn about one another.

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