I should tell you that a functionling legal system is so fundamentally important to the survival of our country that you should be willing to make the sacrifice to do your part.

I should tell you that if everyone with something better to do got themselves out of Jury Duty that it would make the entire system untenable and fill juries with the least capable people.

But we both know there are so many asterisks and caveats next to those statements that they're meaningless.

The legal system is clearly broken and the jury system is a failure, don't waste your time and effort trying to help it limp along.
There are a hundred surefire ways to get out of jury duty with no negative consequences, you should take advantage of them.

Now imagine how fair it is to those being held under its sword.

It’s one thing for me to do my part. It is another to ask me to do my part, but not be able to afford groceries for the month.

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It's not a fair trial for the jury; it's a fair trial for the accused. You're obligated as a member of society to participate, and (supposedly) every class / race / orientation / ideology is required to participate.

That's how things work. Everything else in your post honestly is just complaining. We don't do jury duty for the benefit of the jury, we do it to keep a civil society.

It’s long overdue that the concept of a fair day’s pay for a fair day’s work comes (back) to our state courts.

Federal jurors get $50 a day (until completing 45 days of jury service, then it goes to $60) — still a pittance, but they are (slowly) moving in the right direction.

Judges will chide people for trying to get out of jury duty, but it’s only the financially rational thing to do.

And things are tight for so many workers, it's pretty unreasonable to expect people to shrug off the loss of income.

But a little financial consideration would change the attitude of many potential jurors, and you'd see more people content to serve. A lot of folks would be like: "Well, it’s not what I could make otherwise, but it’s something.”

>you should be willing to make the sacrifice to do your part.

Even if that sacrifice means becoming homeless because you can no longer pay your bills? I'm one bad month away from that right now.

We have a legislature that allows itself large pay raises but we cannot seem to get them to do actual work. Such as raising jury pay to something meaningful.

>It is another to ask me to do my part, but not be able to afford groceries for the month.

Absolute cogent point. Too bad it goes over the head of the self-aggrandizing, do-nothing PA Legislature.

>We don't do jury duty for the benefit of the jury, we do it to keep a civil society.

Now do this in the context of the PA legislature which gets a 2nd recent large pay increase this upcoming year.

Yeah. I can’t afford to make $10/day for days at a time. Just gonna tell ‘em I don’t trust the police.

Even sadder that you have to report that on your tax's.

Where’s the lie, you can’t trust fucking pigs.

So… it’s not okay to complain about the possibility of not getting one week worth of wages?? Bruh…

I have never been summoned personally. But my ex at one point, he was able to write in/call in to the clerk of the court. An advise them that doing so would put him in financial hardship. I did see this is possibly an acceptable excuse in PA as well.

Good luck to you with this. The whole payment of jury duty needs reworked...

If the courts don’t wish to compensate jurors fairly, then there should at least be a requirement for businesses to pay their employees when they are called for service. It’s not like it would happen very often.

How is the accused supposed to get a fair trial when lots of people financially cannot take the time off? That takes away a lot of working folks, which skews the fairness.

I always say I am prejudicial against police and that I will inform other jurors of their right to jury nullification. Never called back.

Hey they are super busy passing mail in ballot laws and trying to prove their mail in ballot laws were unconstitutional.

You really think a jury full of people worried about paying their bills because they are missing work to be on the jury doesn’t hurt the accused?

You can’t have a sound and rational jury while forcing those serving on the jury to go days without their normal wages. They will do everything they can to reach a conclusion ASAP.

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Use the per diems the legislature get to set the pay

Your comment for some reason made me pronounce “prejudicial” in my head as “pre-judicial”. Then when I realized the mispronunciation I suddenly had a better meaning of the word prejudice. Pre-judge.

Obviously I already knew what it meant, I just never thought of it that way.

Thanks for coming to my TED talk.

You make it sound like everyone with a financial hardship is getting excused from duty. That’s far from the case.

What gave you this crackpot idea?

You are absolutely right! It has been this way for years.... I was fortunate enough to have an employer that paid the difference, But not everyone Is that fortunate. That's a very big hit in a monthly income

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Think I got 50.00 a day + mileage

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You can get out of jury duty for hardship reasons. All you seem to be doing is making up excuses for not fulfilling your civic duty.

Since they’re forcing people to serve jury duty, they should pay by the hour of at least your working wage or higher. Not to mention any travel expenses to get there.

Agreed, but when the jury deliberates don’t you think some people might agree to a verdict so they don’t have to report back for more days if they really need money?

and trials can go WAY longer, all shit luck on which trial you end up with.

​

It badly needs fixed, but I don't think anyone in power actually gives a shit. Numerous bills have attempted to fix it, but for some unknown reason, they never get passed

ACAB

It's class warfare on the working class population.

i throw it out every time. like right into the garbage. its so easy. like i grab it. and then i put it in the can. i once got a letter that was like "we know you received jury duty, and you'll be punished blah blah blah". threw that out too. i aint got time for this bullshit. find some Karen that doesn't mind destroying lives.

Pennsylvania is one of the largest and highest paid state legislatures in the country. And I'll tell you, those folks really do a bang-up job. Worth every penny, including their generous per diem rates. These guys, they really deserve it.

or you could just tell the truth in court and say serving would be a financial hardship for me

Juries should just be a paying job imo.

Actual wages might be a lot but they should at least pay local minimum wage, not kids pocket money.

I understand what you're getting at, and I think I agree with you based on that last statements about asterisks, etc.

> I should tell you that a functionling legal system is so fundamentally important to the survival of our country that you should be willing to make the sacrifice to do your part.

Unfortunately, there's a big disparity in privilege in this country. Personally, my workplace will pay me in full if I'm on a jury, so it's no skin off my back. Plus, I make enough that not being paid for a week would be inconvenient, but wouldn't really change my life significantly (Although a week's pay for me would be a significant "donation" to the legal system). But that's not an obligation for most workplaces, and most people aren't in my situation financially.

Even paying jurors minimum wage 8 hours/day * 7.25 would be a significant raise. But still wouldn't be sufficient for a lot of people to appear. Which of course, speaks to the big asterisk around why people don't want to appear.

> I should tell you that if everyone with something better to do got themselves out of Jury Duty that it would make the entire system untenable and fill juries with the least capable people.

Having served on a jury, I can tell you first hand, this is already going on. We were hearing a child sex trafficking case, and one of the (male) jurors tried to argue that the victim (15 at the time) might have wanted to be a prostitute.

Neither would be a lie. But they’re more likely to boot you if you display a specific bias.

Have a panic attack and cry a lot while you're there. I got batch dismissed so I can't guarentee that it works but I said fuck it anxiety on full display no masking it see if they want me.

If all the accused can get is the dumbest motherfuckers around and retirees with nothing better to do, that isn't really a fair trial for the accused.

The average household income in Pa is $63000 which translates to $32.29 an hour. That's what jurors should be paid, and the cost of the jury should be fined to the losing party to decrease the burden on the tax payers.

Where there's a will there's a way. "Fuck the police" "Jury nullification" "I think more crimes should have the death penalty" "You know why saudi arabia has less stealing? They still cut hands off"

I’m not making excuses for myself. Did you think you were responding to the OP?

And if one can get out of jury duty for financial hardship then we really don’t have trial by a jury of your peers, we have trial by a jury of the wealthy.

Told them exactly how I feel about the police last time I was summoned, like 8 years ago. Haven't gotten jury duty since.

www.rollbacktheraises.com

I'm lucky that my job gives PTO for jury duty, has to be absolutly awful for anyone losing a significant amount of their income from a long trial.

Luckily I get paid by my law firm to sit for a jury. But unfortunately, I get eliminated because I work in a law firm. Go figure.

I have only gotten one notice when I lived in Philadelphia, never got one since I’ve been in Montgomery county. I would gladly do it as my employer pays full salary while on jury duty. I think up to 3 weeks - not sure if longer. I do wonder who makes up juries when I don’t often hear people I know ever serving. I also wonder why I’ve only been asked 1 time in almost 20 years!

Or raise the minimum wage either.

Not sure why you're getting downvoted. If a person on this board is ever accused of a crime, he or she will have the right to a trial by a jury of their peers. That's what we are all taking part in as part of our democracy.

If you can't afford to go for jury duty, note that when you fill out your form.

You can be excused from serving due to financial hardship if your work doesn't pay you for that time and you can't afford to take the hit (most people can't). You are correct that it isn't a fair representation because of this.

Please, take mine! I've lived in PA for nearly 20 years, I've been summoned four or five times at this point. I've always attended but this time I've asked my doctor for a medical exemption. I'm a housewife btw

You get your full pay from work.

Thanks, that's right, will edit.

Nevermind, you need a better job.

“We can’t keep taking advantage of the working poor if we don’t keep them poor” -elected officials

This is the way.

Minimum wage is kids pocket money…

Not even enough to cover lunch for the day

I throw those letters out without opening them. Not doing jury duty, especially for $10/day. You want me to do my “civic duty” match my daily pay or pound sand.

I was lucky my employer paid my wages during jury duty about 6 years ago and let me keep the money from the state. It really sucks for those that don't get paid. I thought I would get out of it by mentioning jury nullification but they had me sit in the basement of the Harrisburg Courthouse for a week.

I did the same thing. They made me sit in the courthouse basement (waiting area for jury duty) for a week. Sorry, I won't be offering a guilty verdict for drug offenses.

The one time I was summoned I told them I couldn’t afford to miss work and they excused me. This is the way to go.

I'm sure that the court and prosecutors don't mind keeping out the kind of people who may be financially impacted by the loss of work.

PA is the largest "full time" (technically speaking, as they don't actually do that much work) legislature, and I think it might even be the second largest overall?

New Hampshire is the largest state house in the country.

Indeed on both counts. I didn't feel like typing out a bunch of caveats so I intentionally used vague language.

My wife was in between jobs for a few months, and tried to volunteer for jury duty, to give her something to do. Nope, they don't accept volunteers. I guess they don't want "professional" jurors, or people who seek to get on juries for possibly suspicious reasons.

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Nothing Libertarians like more than a large and well funded government!

I pay my kids their pocket money at a wage higher than minimum wage.....

You people say this over and over.

As a person who went from being a nobody to being “essential” to being called greedy for unionizing, all you “just get a better job” types are absolutely just bootlicking the rich without any real policy ideas.

Fuck off.

$10 for a day is absolutely absurd. No wonder 95% of people find a way to weasel out of it

Yep ditto. “All cops are racist and I cannot in good conscious ever vote to convict based on evidence presented by a racist as that evidence is necessarily tainted.” I had to say it twice as they tried to select me again later in the day but that was that.

>But my ex at one point, he was able to write in/call in to the clerk of the court. An advise them that doing so would put him in financial hardship.

I was never summoned for Jury Duty back when I lived in PA, but since moving to Florida I've served three times in the span of about ten years. Since I'm self-employed, I'm not entitled to any compensation beyond the nominal $10 or whatever Florida gives you. And, if I'm not able to work, my business is completely dead in the water and I'm not only losing money, I'm losing customers.

As the primary wage earner for my household, that's a huge hit to my livelihood — but no one seemed to care. I wrote letters, spoke to Clerk of Courts, and even tried to appeal to the good nature of the judge(s) after I showed up. But each time I was met with indifference, at best, or even outright annoyance. One judge in particular actually made things worse for me, after I explained my situation by scheduling me as a standby juror for week.

Things might be different back in PA, but, here at least, my "excuses" never got me out of anything.

And knowing that the state is the one that brings charges, why would I vote to convict based on their evidence when they think so little of my time and expertise that it’s worth barely more than a dollar an hour? County solicitors and judges are extremely well paid despite PA’s courts being a lawless, arbitrary, and capricious institution.

I went the one year they summoned me after that I just threw the jury duty requests out and acted like I never saw em. Nothing Came of it.

Lmao I do the same shit dude.

I got called for jury duty in McKean County and the judge explained how if we were picked, we would get 9.00 a day, and those that didnt get picked (i was one that didnt) got 34.00. Make it make sense

Sarcasm i hope

You don't see how being a full-time chooser of guilty vs not guilty would be an issue? This is the dumbest take I've seen this week. Thank you.

oh yeah its absolutely absurd. when my dad lived in nj, he got paid like 150 for the two days vs me getting 25 bucks. i will note that you can use not being able to make rent or serving being a financial burden on you as an excuse to get exempted from jury duty. i saw someone do it when i was summoned earlier this month.

What if that is the truth?

Yeah, I thought it was hilarious. The last time I looked up or knew any of these figures was a few years ago, and I'd remembered California being right up there with PA for both compensation and size of the legislature. I did not remember NH. It tracks though, as they claim to be a "Citizen" legislature. The fun part there though is that their pay is so woefully inadequate that it discourages anyone who isn't turbo wealthy from being a state rep/senator, just as the Mises libertarians intend.

it's above the state minimum wage!

which is still unbelievably pathetic

Who ever thinks that trials are fair is a moron.

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So reading this, it reminds me of a friend in Australia. She told me jury duty can pay up to 150(96usd) a day! Civic duty or not, not paying your jury people should be a crime cause no job pays for anyone being out on jury duty, so we all get boned!

That's because you're living in a state that actively tries to make things worse for literally everyone living there. Most other states you can get out of duty with financial hardship.

Or wear a shirt that says “GOOGLE JURY NULLIFICATION”

That’ll definitely do the trick

Looks like it's time to teach everyone the Litany Against Jury Duty:

"Due to the unreliability of witnesses and the moral abhorrence of sending an innocent person to prison, if selected I will exercise my right to jury nullification and vote to acquit without regard to either the law or the facts of the case."

I'm not against participating in a free and fair society but they've ignored what we need to do so for so long that if I caught two weeks of jury duty I'd literally lose my house. To me that means it's time to subvert the system.

Still better than the Japanese system where “Due Process” isn’t a thing

No, actual wage is the only acceptable solution. I built my life assuming I'd be able to pay for it with the money I make at my job. My life will fall apart if you force me not to work my job. Therefore, the only way to make me whole if you use the threat of violence to stop me collecting a paycheck is to fully replace that paycheck.

Only if the trial lasts an hour or less.

Too bad it is required and a duty as an American citizen. You'll get either get excused or suffer the consequences of blowing it off. You're not special

Highest paid legislator, lowest paid minimum wage, housing, financial aid. Crooks and thieves! Oh dont go you'll have to pay major fines and fees if not through into jail. Then they want our votes. Hahahaha

I don't see how I could be a fair juror if I'm just trying to gtfo. I imagine, just like in 12 angry men, most people would say whatever just to get it over with.

FYI - every jury I've been on, if it went over a certain time - I think 1pm - they had lunch delivered. Not a good lunch, but sandwiches and stuff.

Yep, they actually don't want people there that are upset with missing work... because they fear those people won't really do a proper deliberation and will just vote whatever they need to vote in order get it all over with so they can go home and get back to work.

They should pay your full pay at your job and then the $10 per day on top of that and then a per diem for parking and food.

That's why I always respond stating it would hit me financially as my reason for being unable to serve. I think they summoned me 4 times so far in my life but I've never had to go thanks to that reason.

The issue is then only the rich serve on trials. Businesses should just be required to pay it out and have to budget for a certain number of years or it can be a tax. IDC which, it just needs to be built in to the total cost of the employee.

Why are you so eager to brag about what the government is capable of?

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How many times have you used that line? I’ve never been called, but I’ll definitely be using something like that if so.

> “civic duty”

Nothing makes me want to ditch Jury Duty more than the fact it's called a 'duty'.

If I didn't agree to do it, it ain't my fucking duty.

You actually want me to do you a favor, for free, while acting like I'm your servant in the process.
Pound sand indeed.

Because we all have to do it. You're not special and you're not in the position to be making demands. I don't see it as bragging about what the government is capable of. I see it as bringing you back to reality and humbling you.

Yeah and we are trusting random people with their own prejudices, who have no knowledge of the law to decide if people go to prison or not.

... that's the whole point of a jury. A jury of your peers, who get to decide if you're guilty. It's in the constitution. I wouldn't want someone whose gets paid to prosecute people deciding if I'm guilty or not. Do you listen to yourself?

Not being able to get out of Jury duty Is more absurd

No we aren't. But america has its duty to us as much as we have a duty to it, and it's not holding its side of the bargain. If God doesn't meet me halfway, God ain't getting my sacrifices and work no more.

Okay, so blow off an unexcused jury duty summons and watch the government meet you the full way with a warrant for your arrest or a fine.

Yes and it is awesome that it's a duty. Juries are generally a good system that can provide more accountability.

No one's arguing that it's not a requirement/duty. No one's arguing that they're special. What they are arguing is that at the compensation that Pennsylvania gives for jury duty, you're not going to have the income that you would've planned on which can cause unnecessary financial distress.

However you never addressed any of that because you were so obsessed with "humbling" someone for that extra feeling of superiority that you seem to love so much.

I'm already spiraling dude! Let's just find out where rock bottom really is.

You're acting like I care if you get yourself in trouble for blowing off jury duty. What I do find comical is people like you and the guy I was replying to thinking they are in a position to make demands of pay because their time is so much more valuable than the rest of us. Nobody likes jury duty. Only entitled clowns make demands of being paid $35 or $50 an hour to show up. I bet you're also the type to tell the cop he can't arrest you as you're getting yanked by your neck through your freshly broken car window.

I don't feel superior hence why I'm not the one demanding to be paid an "actual wage" which was beyond the minimum wage that was suggested. So $25 to $50 an hour to do the duty the rest of us have to for free or $10. That kind of mentality inherently means they feel they're superior and their time and duty is worth more than everyone else's. Try to keep up with basic logic.

You're acting like you don't understand the point is that I think the rules should change and everyone should be able to survive on their income whether they are on jury duty or working at their job. The governments not increasing minimum wage to a livable wage? My value is less than livable? I don't owe them some civic duty that would put me in the streets. And the people on trial are owed a jury of their peers, per the laws. Are they getting that? Clearly not. The government is not fulfilling their duty by their own metrics. How hard is that for you to comprehend?

>I think we should all be compensated for our time spent performing jury duty

>You need to be brought back to reality and humbled and I, some jerkoff from the internet, am just the guy to do it

Jesus Christ dude get a hobby or start a drug habit or something

Again. No one's arguing that ONLY they should get paid a living wage. That's ridiculous. Everyone here is talking about how the policy needs to change so that everyone receives the wages that they would've planned for within a certain limit. This person is merely talking about their own experience and needs within a conversation about a system that they believe needs to change.

This would also make trials cost a lot more which might have the secondary benefit of cutting down on all the unnecessary convictions for non-violent offenders.

I get the basic premise that was being made. One could also argue a duty is a duty and you shouldnt be paid anything for it. It's one of the few things apart from paying taxes you must do to have the privilege of being an American. And since I'm not a self-loathing American, I actually believe it is a privilege to be American.

Having said that, I also don't think asking for minimum wage is out of order like the other commenter suggested which is why I didn't reply to them. I replied to the guy that went even further and said he'd need even more than that. He'd need an "actual wage" to show up to do his duty which could mean different things to different people but let's just be conservative and say $25 to $50 an hour. That's absurdly entitled and unrealistic thinking and if you don't think so then I think you may be suffering from that same entitled mindset. Not to mention this guy is just talking out of his ass. You know he's going to go to jury duty if he gets summoned and can't get out of it. So why talk tough online?

Okay I follow you and agree that's one way to look at it. Here's my genuine question: What do you call people that perform their duty without complaining for nothing or next to nothing because they feel its their duty vs someone whining and making demands to do that same duty? To me it would seem like the latter is an entitled douche but I guess it's a matter of opinion.

I think that's fine as long as you have enough time to prepare for a dip in wages. But if you don't know how long it will take that will definitely have a different effect on your bills if you are preparing for a week or a month. I understand duty, and I've created my bills around being able to afford things on minimum wage already. But for others that make more, but not as much in savings, I can see not being prepared for something that lasts that long, like a phone that's not paid off because you knew you'd be able to cover it every month, a loan, etc. If all those bills could be...given a forbearance in light of your duty that would make it a lot more tolerable. Idk if that's a thing already or what.

You realize it's not the business problem? Make it too hard for a business to have an employee presence in your state, and they just won't. Even more so now with remote work so ingrained.

For example, PPG could virtually ghost the state fairly easy, keep the castle Grey skull address, and lean on their global resources fairly easy.

Of course it's doubtful any business would bail like that. But why should they pay when the government wants your time on top of the taxes they already pay the government?

Why is that an entitled douche? Sounds like someone who doesn't want to be put in financial distress regardless of "duty". Idk about you, but my duty to my family comes way before I even think about the duty towards the state.

You're constructing the ideal person as someone who just accepts their "duty" regardless of harm. Someone who just accepts their duty and doesn't say anything even when it's causing harm to them or other people just sounds like a coward.

Your duty should be to try and make your community better. Being on a jury is an obligation that's one way of fulfilling that duty. As it stands, we're restricting jury duty to those who have the financial means to miss work and lose that money. This is just another way that the US is a plutocracy. We should ensure that no one misses out on their wages so that everyone can participate regardless of income. I think that ensuring everyone can participate as a member of a jury would make it all just a bit better.

Rather than being some coward who accepts the status quo without "whining or complaining", why not aim for something a bit better?

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Ahh, a coward is someone who does what is expected of them and sacrifices for others or the collective or even more simply someone who upholds their end of the social contract. The smart person is the one who demands a benefit for doing something, anything for their fellow man or society. Sounds very trumpian from someone I have no doubt is likely a leftist and not a fan of capitalism. Either way, you have a selfish worldview I hope doesn't spread.

Lol a selfish worldview is one in which it's ensured that everyone is provided for? I'll take that bullet. If it's selfish to say no to a duty to the community because I want to pay my mortgage and keep my family fed then yeah I guess I'm selfish.

I'm literally arguing for a system where people can actually do their duty to their fellow man without worrying about their own well being. But you haven't actually addressed that. All you've argued for is the status quo which, as I've argued unopposed, is harmful to people with lower incomes and prevents them from fulfilling their duty.

Try addressing my points rather than just flipping out because I called you a coward for arguing in favor of an unjust system.

I'd say the system works. It's been working for 200 years. At most a person should get minimum wage for jury duty. Nobody is getting paid $30 an hour by the state to do a duty we have as a citizen. If you don't think this country is worth doing anything for free for, leave. Go to a better place. You won't.

I’ve heard it said “you don’t want to be judged by people not smart enough to get out of jury duty”

And yes, I went to jury duty

"don't improve the system! Just leave" Why would I leave? I want to make this country better rather than licking the boots of some dudes who died over 100 years ago. If you don't want people to be paid a living wage for jury duty that's fine, just advocate for a system where people can miss work and still have the resources they need.

The system might work fine (debatable), but why not make it better? America is the richest country in the world. Why shouldn't we be better? It sounds like all you want is some flaccid America that barely limps by. That's pathetic.

The thing I can't stand the most about Mises libertarians . . . Mises died penniless in a paupers grave. If he was the greatest economic mind in history, shouldn't he at least have died. . . Wealthy? If your obsession was art, at least you could make the case that Van Gogh, or really most famous artists aren't appreciated until their death. Mises couldn't even get a job as a bank president or whatever after being minister of finance of a major European country. How do you defend that kind of clear and obvious incompetence?

That same argument applies to most things, and the answer is the same: because we live in a society and everyone has to do their part.

I think I'd rather invest in a national healthcare plan then worry about paying for jury duty. We can't fix everything with other people's money....or can we...2030 with RunningOnPunkTime as our President spending 1000% of our annual GDP like NBD. Wait, why is our country debt ridden and stagnant? Dude this over promising, over spending and stifling taxation and regulations has turned America into just another socialist hellscape. Lock ROPT up for being incompetent and selling pipe dreams.

Alarm clock rings at 6am. I just had the worst nightmare. A reddit leftist ran the country promising everything to everyone and fucked it all up making no one happy.

I've always ignored the jury duty letters. They have zero proof that I ever received them.... must have got lost in the junk mail...

Same.... I've gotten several, tossed them.... if they want proof, maybe they should send them certified?

You give your kids $174 a day? Imagine coming from this kind of privilege.

You really can't help but strawman can you? Not gonna actually address a single point or really even make an argument. Have a good night bud

Hah! No! But I pay them more than $7.25 per hour when they do chores outside of their normal household responsibilities.

Id tell them you cant afford to do this for a week. You dont get paid and tell them all the financials. I bet they let you go

You would think that they would at the least let you collect UE for the time on jury duty.

My one take away from jury duty was if this is a collection of my peers, my god I never want to be accused of a crime.

I've used it in PA and it worked. It was a question on the form they made us all fill out and asked if you're less likely to trust the word of a police officer because they're a police officer. I said yes and got excluded. I regret saying that though. The case was interesting. A guy overdosed on heroin and they charged the dealer with murder.

The minimum wage in Pennsylvania is still at $7.25. Yeah, we suck.

I have never known anyone who got in trouble for just not going lol

I don’t trust my peers? Lol

And idk why I you think they would be incentivized to prosecute? Ideally there wouldn’t be any bias towards guilty or not or whatever.

Everyone involved except the jurors get paid full rate. Judge, prosecutors, lawyers, law enforcement, expert witnesses, clerical staff, bailiffs, etc. If it's truly a "duty", they too should work for 1940s pay rates.

Easiest way to be exempted beforehand is "Financial Hardship", which for many is the truth. $9 per day ($25 starting the 4th day) is appalling. 17 cents milage and no paid meals, though parking may be free.

Jury nullification is another way. If doing this directly, keep it discreet. Better to mention it on a questionnaire. Some try to use the "don't trust police", etc excuse, but that surprisingly doesn't always work.

Another way is being overly well dressed. Suit and tie along with high-end shoes, etc. For a civil trial is a toss-up, but for a criminal trial, can be pretty effective from what I've been told.

Ultimately it comes down to the population of a particular county and case load. In some, a large proportion of civil cases never get to court and many criminal defendants pleading out. Less cases, less chance of being called let alone serving. Also, more likely ignored jury duty notices won't be pursued and being excused will be easier.

I got summoned once for jury duty. I live 3 blocks from the courthouse and walked there. I made sure my travel pay for “driving” there was paid.

In hindsight, I should said I I took a bus but lost my ticket and made up an excuse for them to refund me paying for the bus because. Would have gotten paid more. Could have even said I road my bike that had an already flat tire but the flat occurred on the way in to get my flat fixed. I could go on with ways to fuck them out of their money.

Edit: anybody that gets upset with this doesn’t know how to fuck a system that is already fucking you.

Exactly what I would do

By the government, which both you and the business, are paying. The only party not really paying is the one receiving money.

https://www.ohsd.uscourts.gov/frequently-asked

Just picked a random Ohio one out of the blue. $50. Mileage. Hotel money if far enough away to justify. Iirc they also provide something resembling food.

If you want my time, why should anyone else pay me for it, but you? This isn't about doing a civic duty, strictly compensation for time missed from work.

I will concede there is some overly dramatic belly aching in these posts. If your business is going to fail due to a week of jury duty, odds are you have bigger problems.

Hell, I don't even have a dog in this fight. Between jobs, but last job a week unpaid wasn't going to break me, odds are no one would care about a week in jury duty anyways. Whatever the govmt gave is a nice gesture. But for others, it is. Specially when $10 hasn't even been gas money for like a decade.

People elect judges based on number of prosecutions. It's sad but true. It's something judges tout to make themselves look tough on crime. If someone wants to look tough on crime, they're not going to choose innocent over guilty most of the time

Tell them you don't believe a word the police say and believe in jury nullification and they'll dismiss you so fast your head will spin.

Random people are going to be far less prejudiced than the people who would apply to be full time jurors.

The pay will no doubt be shit, so the only people who will apply to do the job would be people with no discernible skills, or people who are motivated by some biased agenda (“cleaning up the streets” by always siding with guilty verdict, or “defying the police” by always returning not guilty verdict, or even more complex types of bias). Anyone who has skills would sell those skills to a much much higher bidder.

Username does not check out. But you’re very right.

don’t go, they don’t do shit about it

I got summoned once and told them my work didn't pay for my time being there and claimed financial hardship and got excused.

Jury nullification isn’t a belief, it’s the law.

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Horrible. Just tell them during voir dire that you’ll be so worried about making ends meet and feeding your kids if you’re picked, that you will have a hard time concentrating on the trial.

Fucking Vote People.

Play the crazy card at jury selection, just say I enjoy watching murder porn on the ID channel.

It's more a consequence of the law. During instructions, you're specifically told that, if you are convinced beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant is guilty, you must convict them.

Of course, the jury has the final say, so even if you think they did what they're accused of, you can still vote not guilty.

You will almost certainly be dismissed if you mention it during selection.

Since they’re forcing you to take the day off of work, they should pay equal wage at your job. It’s the state/federal, they can afford it.

Word games. It’s the difference between innocent and not guilty.

Ex: Sure, i had the weed they said i had, but i have no guilt about it because it’s not a real crime, and my peers should agree. I’m not innocent, but neither am I guilty.

That’s how it was intended to work, at least.

most good companies are still paying the employee

yea PA state reps make six figures. Completely insane