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Digital-Latte t1_j2v6x7e wrote

How do they expect people to be able to afford the fine?

21

RowsCrayons t1_j2v8vwa wrote

So the fine can only be issued to repeat "offenders" after an alternative option (like an emergency shelter) is offered by the state. If they can't pay the fine (issued following their express refusal to attend a viable emergency shelter(which Springfield lacks)) they can elect to serve time in jail or in a work program for the state. The bill (Missouri House Bill 1606) is absolutely bonkers and it's worth reading the sections on homelessness.

Also in the bill: Complete cuts of state funding to permanent housing providers. Allows the state to allocate federal funding and GRANTS away from permanent housing providers. Gives permission to the attorney general (a wild boy) to sue any city that is not adhering to the new laws dictated in 1606.

There is an immense amount of strange stuff written into the homeless language of 1606. I encourage everyone once again to look some of it over.

Edit: Formatting

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jttIII t1_j2v9akk wrote

What about recreational camping on state land? is that okay cause wealthy yuppies do it in Patagonia and NorthFace and Columbia gear with selfies?

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Cloud_Disconnected t1_j2vcnes wrote

Next they'll want to put all the homeless people together in one place. Like in a camp or something. You know, kind of concentrate them together. Wonder what such a place would be called...

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lemler3 t1_j2vebox wrote

Lol drive in traffic with no tags u get a $90 ticket but if your homeless u pay $750. Makes since...

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22TopShelf22 t1_j2vkif9 wrote

Replying to Digital-Latte (#1,276,043)

Are you making the assumption that people pay their fines? They won't. And with all this said, the judge isn't going to throw the book at someone for their first offense. This is likely a punishment for a 10-20x offender.

−21

Lkaufman05 t1_j2vmssf wrote

Criminalizing homelessness…this is the direction we’re going?!? Anyone who supports this is a disgusting excuse of a human being and I hope they burn in the hell they very possibly believe in. This is so incredibly saddening.

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ArtisticTomatillo106 t1_j2vn4mu wrote

I mean threatening them with 3 meals a day and a warm bed???? Why the fuck . people that can't afford 450 for rent are going to pay 750 dollar fine hahahaha. These paper pushing morons did nothing but make it harder to get off the streets.

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dimibeh t1_j2vzi1g wrote

Will be cheaper to sleep in a 5 star hotel.

3

Janky_leg91 t1_j2w0opj wrote

It's pretty incredible that one of the most "christian" states is one of the most hateful and judgemental. It's almost like Christianity, hatred, and treating our neighbors like shit go hand in hand. Disappointing... heartbreaking

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Slight-Editor3827 t1_j2w3h57 wrote

putting into practise the admirable Christian principles they always promote.

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doctorpawpaw t1_j2wb43h wrote

Suppose an offender under this statute pays the fine. What happens the next day? And the day after that? The law effectively obviates local efforts to address homelessness and gives that power to the state. Not traditional GOP policy making to be sure. The homeless remain homeless and are left even more hopeless. It’s not much of a head scratching to conclude the law basically enables law enforcement to remove homeless camps. What happens the next day is a cleaner cityscape, brush cleared, rubbish removed, and a humanitarian crisis that is only made worse.

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Sk8ordie79 t1_j2wdu7b wrote

There's not really that many people living on state owned property. I believe the majority are on private lots owned by developers who aren't developing. It's not hard to not sleep on state property.

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lvsmtit78 t1_j2wdv32 wrote

I’m just guessing if they had 750 to pay a fine they wouldn’t be sleeping in the cold, seems like a good way to keep jails full and tie up courts and public defenders with more useless shit to pass off on the tax payers

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[deleted] t1_j2woy41 wrote

That should fix homelessness & poverty fine em & lock em up! lmao disgusting

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Trapinch-isnt-me t1_j2wpy23 wrote

They finally found a way to make money of homeless people. What they will gain is unknown but atleast they can say they took advantage of unfortunate individuals.

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rungoodatlife t1_j2wq4rv wrote

Replying to the_honeyman (#1,276,050)

Unfortunately for almost half the year it’s better they put the homeless is jail if shelters aren’t an option… look at the increase in petty crimes by homeless during cold months so they can stay warm

−3

Why_T t1_j2ww052 wrote

Replying to lvsmtit78 (#1,277,807)

Or we could use all that tax money to, idk, help people who don't have homes? Nah, let's just give them a record and warrants. Because after they leave jail they still won't have paid the fine.

This is pathetic.

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VaderTower t1_j2wxpa1 wrote

Replying to ArtisticTomatillo106 (#1,276,807)

Neither side here actually believes that any money will be made from the $750 fines.

That being said, the goal of one side is just to scoot the homeless away. Similar to how years ago people realized a bus ticket to Cleveland (or insert random city halfway across the country) was cheaper than providing services for homeless. It didn't solve the problems, just moved them away.

Similar to now the fine isn't going to solve anything, just get homeless people out of sight. Stupid yes, but unfortunately the people putting this policy in place aren't illogical, they'll likely get their desired outcome (not seeing as many homeless people) while doing nothing for society generally.

5

genmischief t1_j2wzbia wrote

Replying to RowsCrayons (#1,276,133)

>they can elect to serve time in jail or in a work program for the state

Well, at least it gets people into a hot meal and a dry roof... and hopefully into some kind of diagnostic program to help them work through whatever broke in their lives that lead to this.

is it great? No. is it SOMETHING? yes.

−4

OkDiscussion9395 t1_j2x20cq wrote

This is very sad. Does this effect pan handling at all? Is this legal or illegal?

0

ProGlizzyHandler t1_j2x4avi wrote

Replying to Why_T (#1,278,722)

If we give money to homeless people then corporate America will suffer because there won't be as much money. And that would make less criminals to perform nearly free labor. We can't let the wealthy suffer!

/s

2

RowsCrayons t1_j2x9jt5 wrote

Replying to genmischief (#1,278,895)

Yeah that's the argument from DeGroot and the legislators who support it. Their hearts are in a good place, but the homeless problem in Springfield is built on addiction and debilitating mental illnesses-things that won't be solved in jails; things that don't have a great solution at all.

I'm not sure what the answer is. This will definitely limit our exposure to homelessness. Some folks will be in jail, others will retreat deeper into the forests they were living in anyway.

4

ProGlizzyHandler t1_j2xfjzp wrote

Replying to Trapinch-isnt-me (#1,278,406)

I highly doubt there are many homeless people who can afford to spend $750 per night to sleep. There's no money to be made from fining people who dont have money, valueable possessions, jobs, homes, etc. This is going to just increase incarceration rates and we will pay for it with our taxes.

2

plezntly t1_j2xqkzz wrote

That just shows how out of touch people in office are with reality. Jail would be a blessing to done homeless people, shelter, 3 meals s day and medical care. How about attacking the causes of homelessness instead of the victims

1

smashingx t1_j2y0j3i wrote

Good luck trying to put fines on homeless people who don't give a crap about fines hahaha

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Professional-One-442 t1_j2y8a5o wrote

Replying to genmischief (#1,279,469)

Actually most aren’t dying under a bridge. This whole effort was actually meant to target KC and STL. There were plans to increase long term housing this was the response. Also I can tell you that communities outside KC bus their homeless here from as far away as ST Joseph. Most outlining communities have zero program and their only response is to “own the libs” by sending their problems here. How very Christian of them.

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theonlyjdot t1_j2yjdwf wrote

I mean don't blame the city. It was voted on and the voters are what made this a thing.

1

JC2535 t1_j2yqkl8 wrote

Interesting solution to the unhoused. Jail is a form of shelter at least.

1

TriGurl t1_j2yvze5 wrote

So that means they will get shelter and 3 squares each day for 15 days?? Watch the amount of homeless people sleeping on state owned land increase sharply!

1

the_honeyman t1_j2yzv2p wrote

Replying to rungoodatlife (#1,282,301)

Or we could use that same taxpayer money to set up systems that actually work and don't keep perpetuating the problem, ensuring future generations keep getting trapped in the same cycles.

Nah fuck it throw them all in jail.

4

Silhouettesmiled t1_j2z8918 wrote

Fucking backwards and cruel is what it is.

Maybe putting more effort in opening more homeless shelters would help but I guess that doesn't make enough money.

The politicians who make this fucking bullshit a law need to be held accountable and thrown in jail and charged themselves for being a cruel and a nuisance to humanity. It's way past time to hold these fuckers accountable!

2

[deleted] t1_j2zbz1n wrote

Replying to genmischief (#1,278,895)

None of this has shown to be effective. There's no money provided to help these people, just incentive to jail with no plan. That's like saying let's criminalize something and IT'S AT LEAST SOMETHING.

No. It's less then nothing, it's just more pain and more problems shoved into an already stressed system.

4

asander85 t1_j2zfe7h wrote

Replying to genmischief (#1,278,895)

I can certainly appreciate that point of view, but as someone who has spent time in Missouri Jails (wrongly accused, found not guilty at trial BTW) I can attest that this is NOT a viable solution. Major step backwards, and from what I can see can only cause more harm than good.

1

asander85 t1_j2zfwre wrote

Replying to ArtisticTomatillo106 (#1,276,807)

3 meals? Wrong. Warm bed? Wrong. Sorry man, but until you’ve spent time in Missouri Jails, you are completely clueless. I went multiple days without eating (getting beat up and meals stolen from me, or it just LEGIT not being served at all.) also slept on a very thin yoga mat style pad with no pillow on a concrete floor for two weeks. This is in no way shape or form an improvement.

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qsvcharles t1_j300fvh wrote

So it is now against the law to be so poor that you can’t buy food or a room in which to stay?

1

sgf-guy t1_j30ntlv wrote

The amount of truly state and not city or county owned land is prob very, very small.

But clearly becoming Portland or LA or even DC is clearly not the answer either.

1