> D.C. police said the incident occurred after a member of the Secret Service pulled the driver over on 14th Street and New York Avenue in Northwest around 4:30 p.m.

> While trying to escape, the driver drove through an intersection, struck a vehicle, and then hit two women who police said were crossing the street. The driver stayed in the area after the collision and was subsequently taken into custody. 

> Officials have revealed that both women were transported to local hospitals where one of them was later pronounced dead. The other victim is currently in critical condition, police said. 

Fuck.

Stolen car?

People going through reds is insane here. Literally crossed the street today and had a minivan run red well after it turned and drive through a gap all of us in the crosswalk, she barely fit in, cause freakin’ mini van -_-

I swear I shouldn’t be shocked, but still am infuriated every time I see a story about a pedestrian killed by a negligent driver. May she rest in peace…

Most of the drivers in this city are constantly close to murdering people.

Of the 200 murders this year, most of those people knew each other. I’d be willing to bet the number of random killings is fewer than the number of people killed by car violence.

I almost got t-boned today by someone running a red-light a full 3 seconds after my light had turned green. I hesitated a bit and didn't pull immediately out when the light turned, and that's the only reason my drivers side door didn't get impaled by a car going ~40-50 in a 25.

I mean, seriously, any other day and I pull immediately out of that light. I don't think I would have survived that crash, as fast as the car was going. Just today, for no reason at all, I hesitated for a small eternity, and it saved my life.

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Please, do us all a favor

2 blocks to get Sweetgreen. 4 near misses.

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Jfc. Awful.

I mean yeah fuck cars but banning them is never gonna happen, there are however ways to greatly improve the situation and become less car dependent.

Almost got run over in the crosswalk when a driver pulled up fast (after I had already entered the crosswalk) and failed to stop and had to slam the brakes halfway into the crosswalk.

Then he had the nerve to yell at me about it

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Eh drivers are just awful

Drivers seem to get annoyed when I stop before entering the crosswalk - but I literally trust no fucking drivers anymore. Narrowly avoiding getting hit on crosswalks with stop signs/red lights like every couple weeks now

Let's just ban right on reds - so the people that already do illegal rights on red where banned will keep doing it and the few who don't actually stop.

How about enforce traffic laws?

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And your point is?

It’s not the cars. It’s the people driving them.

A few weeks ago I was walking with my wife and we stopped to look both ways before crossing the intersection. A dude in some riced out Honda Civic is barreling down the street and definitely not gonna stop or slow down. It wasn't until about 15 feet before the stop sign that he slammed the brakes after noticing us. He sheepishly waved to try and signal "my bad".

We didn't start crossing until he came to a complete stop.

Ban people then.

Doesn't a murder charge require premeditation? What does DC class vehicular manslaughter as, just that?

/r/fuckcars

If you're going to be killed violently, it's going to be with a bumper not a bullet.

Saw some red piece of junked-up custom shit blow through at least two stop signs in a row tonight, was going in the same direction at least

I work near Union Station and it’s really bad there. There’s been more than a few times I was almost tagged. Because I also drive to work on occasion, I am respectful of pedestrians but there are more times than not that pedestrians are not respectful of motorists. Those asses that run stop signs and stoplights need to be heavily fined or jailed especially if they do it more than once.

"I should be able to walk to the coffee shop down the street in peace. My barista, however, should have to hike in from the suburbs."

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I didn’t realize secret service was so concerned about whether a car has a valid registration sticker

This is big “guns don’t kill people” logic.

Cars sure make minor mistakes extremely deadly.

Fundamentally there is no difference. We should hold people accountable for their recklessness instead of just demonizing the equipment they use.

The murder rate is used to bash cities and encourage you and businesses to flee to the suburbs but any safety is often offset by higher car crash deaths

Many streets should be closed to cars, especially around the busiest areas for pedestrians and any sensitive sites. But a blanket ban on the city won’t work. Instead something like the London Congestion Charge would help reduce car traffic elsewhere

Pedestrianized streets and retractable bollards. Now.

I legit death stare drivers when I see them coming up to a crosswalk. If they hit me, I want to make sure I see their face in case I need to ID them.

Vision Zero my ass

I do the same thing, but my reason is that if you're going to hit me I want you to live with the knowledge that you were looking me in the eye when you did it.

(your reason is better, but I'm kind of face-blind)

Is that what they were pulled over for?

There's probably a less racist way to describe that particular asshole/moron's car.

Where did you derive that allegation from?

Yeah, your reason is good as well.

truly honestly fuck cars

It's literally in the video in the article

People turning right on red that don't even slow down or look as well. I almost got bowled over by of all things an FBI suv while crossing the street on a Walk signal going to the Holiday Market. You'd THINK you'd be extra careful there.

A suspicious vehicle under half a mile from the white house is sort of their whole reason for being.

Does anyone else feel like DC really needs to construct overhead stop lights? I often hear visitors mention how they don’t see the stoplights off on the side.

That said, sounds like it wouldn’t have helped in this case.

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Why not both?

The difference is that cars have a function other than killing people

Best the DC city council can do for you is ban right on red in 2025.

"An accident"

Murder is legal if you use a car.

Besides all the pedestrians getting hit, what's up with the rash of people fleeing from law enforcement. My god these people have balls.

Crowbarred

Gross indifference is also murder. If you perform ultrahazardous activities without regard for the people that can be harmed, that can also be considered murder.

Exactly. So these calls to ban vehicles are just nonsense. We should just enforce the rules to curb reckless driving. You know, like the rest of the world does.

Stop lights should be like in London. On the near side of the intersection so you can only see them if you haven't bundled your way into the crosswalk / intersection. People are encouraged to creep forward with lights opposite the intersection.

It depends on race, income, sex, etc. Yeah, if you’re white and live in Ward 1, I agree a bumper is more likely to kill you. Not the same odds for others living in other parts of the city, though, who have seen a steady increase in violent crime over the past couple of years.

Don’t worry. Half the people in this subreddit don’t read and just make assumptions.

Right, whether walking or driving I assume others will literally do the dumbest/most reckless thing I can imagine and play defense lol

It’s not now.

They all know that chases aren't allowed, and now they know about the officer who was recently convicted of murder. There is every incentive to flee.

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In what world do retractable bollards stop someone fleeing a pullover from hitting someone in a crosswalk?

The first time I drove a vehicle in DC, I think I ran or almost ran somewhere around 5 stop lights. I couldn’t even tell you specifically why, but something about the lights confused the mess out of me. Add on that the uncommon angles of some intersections (at least compared to rural/suburban towns), and things like “roundabouts” except with traffic lights, it was not a recipe for a good time on my part.

Fleeing drivers kill bystanders: see story above.

The problem isn't the no-chase policy, it's that the city doesn't do nearly enough to get terrible and dangerous drivers off the road, because they are concerned about the equity effects of doing so.

I google imaged London traffic light to see what you are referring to and found this. I was concerned for a moment.

edit: forgot a word

Bollards that extend during a crosswalk's signalled duration?

Secret Service clearly identified someone who has no business behind the wheel of a car. The results were just tragic.

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Haha that's funny, showed up on a search for me too.

Just imagine if you drive into the cross walk you can no longer see the light because it's on the near side of the intersection. So you have to stay out of the cross walk and intersection to know when the light changes. No blocking the box, crosswalk, or ridiculous creeping forward when perpendicular traffic goes yellow.

That makes sense!

This dude escalated a traffic stop to vehicular homicide. Now he's looking at many years in jail. Did he think he was actually going to get away?

In the story above, the driver was not fleeing a chase, he was fleeing a traffic stop. He knew he could flee because of the no-chase policy.

I know some people are trying to end police traffic stops altogether, which will be another dangerous step in our descent into rampant criminality.

Pedestrian protest day. We can all bike / walk to work in the middle of the road. Focus on Rhode Island, mass, Connecticut, constitution, 16th etc

I’ve been noticing that on Connecticut and Wisconsin Avenues particularly - they haven’t been trimming trees/boughs and it’s actually obstructing some of the traffic lights. Reminds me to 311 some stuff. Thank you!

Yup.

https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/zsojfd/lawsuit_but_no_criminal_charges_filed_in_bethesda/j19bwnb/

> Murder and manslaughter are legal actions but only if you use a car.

The worst. This happened to me a couple years ago in Shaw, except it was a cop AND I was doing the massive pregnant lady shuffle across the street. The guy was shameless.

Seriously, they also cause grievous injuries.

The effects of chasing equal outcome rather than equal opportunity

this would solve most of our problems tbh

You're making the right decision. 3 months ago I entered a crosswalk because I saw a vehicle slowing down as it approached a stop sign. Did it stop? No. It rolled through and hit me, and the impact broke my ankle.

I was very lucky that nothing worse happened, but only as of this week I'm starting to walk again after surgery and with physical therapy. Just like you, I will never assume a car is going to stop again.

Honestly DC should just have a purge day where everything short of murder, arson, vandalism of public property or bodily harm is legal. Get it out of everyone's system.

My point (and response to OP's comment) was that people use many things that increase how deadly they are, and they should have higher standards of accountability for using them. I don't think you get a pass for operating a car unsafely just because it's purpose isn't to kill people.

> I am respectful of pedestrians but there are more times than not that pedestrians are not respectful of motorists.

Oh boo hoo. When's the last time a person was killed by a travelling pedestrian?

He was escaping after he was pull over for the police!!! People going through reds is insane here???…The driver is a killer! Probably was under the influence…

Downtown is a complete mess for everyone. It’s designed to enable drivers to go anywhere, but ends up confusing everyone. Plus what is the point of letting people drive to the Smithsonian if you can’t park anywhere for less than 50 dollars. This impractical situation causes frustration, which leads to impatient, and often hostile driving practices.

I’m always scared when someone nearly kills me on my bike, but I’m even more scared when I see the confused looks through their windshield. It’s not their job to decide where they should and shouldn’t drive. No one educates them about pedestrian and bike safety.

Of course some of drivers are homicidal and some are just stupidly aggressive, but most are just absent minded, because that’s what the exhaustion of driving does to the mind and body. What a stupid form of transportation that we’ve universally adopted.

It’s a shame that people die for choosing to walk.

Cars aren’t a luxury, they’re a cost that is forced upon most Americans. However we’re fortunate to live in a walkable city.

If you live and work in the District, sell your car. I save 3,000 dollars a year, and you could save more depending on your situation. People say D.C. is unaffordable, and they’re right, but a big part of that cost is car ownership.

Use metro, use the bike lanes and sidewalks; force them to continue improving the infrastructure.

And tell your friends to do the same.

Not sure if I've seen this implement anywhere else in the world, but it would work. Would be expensive as hell and create constant traffic during construction. Also no more right on reds

Can only imagine the maintenance issues with them not properly retracting

DC cannot get all the dangerous drivers off the road because so many aren't DC licensed drivers or in DC registered vehicles. As a consequence the policy choice appears to be to not even attempt to get the DC licensed drivers from driving dangerously.

The city is incapable of fixing this issue unless they start a zero-tolerance impound policy. Anything below taking away the vehicle is essentially wish casting, since Virginia and Maryland don't have any sort of reciprocal punishment for DC initiated fines.

There is no mechanism to do so. Traffic laws are enforced through fines, and fines for MD or VA plated cars are meaningless.

> In the story above, the driver was not fleeing a chase, he was fleeing a traffic stop

Right, and killed a pedestrian within like a block of beginning to flee. The whole point of a no chase policy is to avoid drivers doing crazy shit that kills bystanders to get away from police. As I note every time this comes up, 1/3 of the people who die in chases are bystanders, who are 3x more likely to die in a chase than officers. You really don't want high speed chase going on through a city.

> I know some people are trying to end police traffic stops altogether, which will be another dangerous step in our descent into rampant criminality.

I don't have really strong views on how the costs & benefits of traffic stops net out. But I would love it if the city took easier steps that don't involve police confrontations to suspend driver's licenses and impound vehicles.

Not disagreeing there. But a lot of the handwring about the violence is from people who do not fit the profile of likely to be killed by a bullet.

> The city is incapable of fixing this issue unless they start a zero-tolerance impound policy.

Idk about zero tolerance but I am fine with more aggressive impounding, towing, booting, license suspensions, etc.

> Virginia and Maryland don't have any sort of reciprocal punishment for DC initiated fines.

Note that that's just for camera fines, which DC also now has virtually no punishments for.

My issue with DC driving is that the city is laid out in an imperfect grid. There are many avenues that cut diagonally across city blocks. I find myself even confused by what the GPS is telling me to do sometimes - it will tell me to turn but I then see that making that turn isn't very safe because cars are incoming from the other direction along the diagonal. The stop lights are sometimes ambiguous - are they for my lane or the other lane?

I don't own a car and mostly walk or use the train, but I think if the city was laid out in a perfect grid without all these weird cross avenues, it will ease a lot of the confusion. Avenues like New York Avenue, Florida Avenue, Pennsylvania Avenue, etc. can disorient drivers, especially those who are not familiar with these streets.

That's true, you don't hear about that aspect a ton though in DC.

Nonsense distinction that is mostly just a right-wing rhetorical device.

The cop will get charged for "engaging in a pursuit" you mean? Because that is what happens in upsidedown-town.

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/dc-police-officers-found-guilty-in-karon-hylton-browns-death/3235652/

Have you been to the rest of the world? Most places the streets are basically a complete free-for-all. Rich/poor/civilized does not matter one bit.

Not secret service

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Sky bridges like Minneapolis seems like a better solution

Name a day

What? Yes it is? In the second video

You’re absolutely right, and unfortunately that’s something we can’t easily fix, but we could easily reduce the amount of roads that cars can use. I second your frustration about using GPS, but that’s on Apple and Google; and we see how slow they are to improve the key flaws in their software.

I would start by squaring off some of the roundabouts, like the ones around Thomas Circle and Logan Circle. I know, roundabouts are much more efficient than regular intersections but most American drivers don't really know how to navigate roundabouts. I know I struggle with them when driving.

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So... Nobody can turn on a green light and we'd need to have all right and left turns on green arrows? I hope you realize this makes no sense

What in the fox news does that have to do with this

> expensive as hell

That's understatement. You'd need electronic and/or hydraulic infrastructure at every intersection. It would have to be powerful enough to raise and lower quickly and durable enough to operate thousands of times a day. Then you need the ongoing expense of continued maintenance or they end up like Metro's escalators.

Not sure why you’ve received the downvotes, especially in a sub that’s usually a little bit more in-tune with checking themselves for that kind of language.

Bollards would presumably just be there to allow scheduled deliveries to get through but otherwise no other drivers would be allowed.

Even if a driver in one lane stops for me, I still wait for the inevitable impatient jackov that tries to go around them at speed.

A cursory Google search explains that "rice" is an acronym for "Race Inspired Cosmetic Enhancements", wherein Race is defined as a competitive motorsport rather than a demographic descriptor.

I didn't know where the term came from before I read your comment, hence my Google search. I was fully ready to strike the term from my vocabulary as I could absolutely see it having derogatory origins, just like the terms "peanut gallery" or "gypped".

Not just police, but the Secret Service. Running from them has to be a sure-fire way to get on some lists you do not want to be on.

I've seen a couple times recently someone stopping for me while turning left - then someone will pass them on the right and attempt to make a left turn - wild shit

I have never heard the term applied to a vehicle made by western manufacturers. No one would call a modified mustang "riced out". The term originates from back in the 70's when cars from Asian (mostly Japanese) manufacturers were derogatorily referred to as "rice burners".

Urban dictionary (and a few others) suggests that the acronym was developed after the fact by people uncomfortable with the racist origins of the term looking to justify it's continued use. At least there seems to be some awareness of how racist the term is/was but we can do better than coming up with an excuse and just use different words to describe "a car heavily modified with stupid cosmetics that look fancy but provide no performance benefits".

Because it sounds like I'm vaguely defending the moron in the car and this sub currently has an absolute hatred of anyone in a car (with some justification). The only acceptable response is to vocally attack anyone driving a car and mine didn't do that.

It's also because the term is so widely used that I suspect a lot of people don't realize it has racist origins.

cheaper to just build a bridge or tunnel across every intersection at that point lol

Totally fair. I've heard people use it to describe Mustangs, Camaros, and even BMW's, but that's obviously anecdotal on my part. Also, that was back in the mid-2000's, so I can absolutely see how the term may have been retconned in an attempt to cover-up its racist roots.

This does my head in. It’s bad enough the drivers are super reckless and don’t think twice about endangering people’s lives but then they want to fight with you about it?

Bruh. The driver in the story is awful, needs to go to prison for a long time, and probably is a murderer (but y'know, we let juries make the call), but to state that most people driving in the city would do something like this, is absurd and borderline misanthropic.

Weird, I’m only seeing one video.

This was at an intersection, which is where cars pass through.

Not surprised. So many drivers are assholes and always rushing.

Slowly keep getting rid of parking spaces and expand bike lanes

A large portion of the drivers in this city drive too fast, blow through stop signs or red lights, don't stop for people in crosswalks, etc. All these can kill people.

Driver's license suspensions become meaningless if there's no risk to driving with a suspended license. Impoundment would be more effective -- I'd love to see more of that. But reckless driving is an act of violence -- it will always be a matter foremost for law enforcement personnel.

If you just wish really hard for vision zero and say it enough times it will surely happen right?

Pedestrian bridges are car infrastructure not pedestrian infrastructure.

Ok I'm a big advocate for safe streets but retractable bollards is bordering on the insane.

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Lol I don't understand the downvotes, you are objectively correct here

Yes, me too. Direct eye contact. I make them feel my eyes lol. It's the only way these days.

You don't know what you're talking about